Tony Xia (no longer involved with AVFC)

[Stevo985]

3 minutes ago, Rugeley Villa said:

I'm not so sure. We would of had a right job getting them to come here anyway.

Maybe. But again that doesn't somehow excuse Sherwood's performance.

 

I think Sherwood getting sacked so early in the season saved his reputation somewhat.
If he'd somehow managed to stay employed for that whole season i think the debate about his incompetence wouldn't exist.

[Rugeley Villa]

Tony is either broke or he's decided he's not going to give Bruce or any other manager any more funds. I don't buy this FFP thing. Fail to go up this season and we are in shit street.

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

5 hours ago, AstonMartyn88 said:

Not sure that's real. It's certainly not on Twitter. Be hilarious if it was though. Would be saying what a lot of us were thinking

No it's not real. Lol. It's from an Aston Villa fan page but ive been having a hard time posting links or photos. I'm surprised that one worked.

[wazzap24]

22 minutes ago, Rugeley Villa said:

Tony is either broke or he's decided he's not going to give Bruce or any other manager any more funds. I don't buy this FFP thing. Fail to go up this season and we are in shit street.

Not to pick on you Ruge, but I've read a few similar comments on FFP, yet when you look at the facts surrounding it, it's pretty easy to see why it's a problem for us and that there is only so much the Doc can do about it. 

People's sole argument appears to be, other clubs are ignoring it and we should as well. The clubs that have ignored it, have faced sanctions in one shape or form. The sanctions that could be applied to us, now include potentially withholding promotion. Now I don't think for one minute that would actually happen, but the rules are there, so it would be a massive risk to just ignore them. It's a real thing. 

IF we get promoted, the time to potentially ignore it is then. The PL wouldn't relegate us and we'd only have to worry about UEFA if we qualified for Europe, in which case we'd probably just get hit with a reduced squad allowance or some kind of transfer embargo. 

[bannedfromHandV]

32 minutes ago, Rugeley Villa said:

Tony is either broke or he's decided he's not going to give Bruce or any other manager any more funds. I don't buy this FFP thing. Fail to go up this season and we are in shit street.

Nope, FFP is actually a real thing.

[villa4europe]

i think he knows he's got another mammoth spending spree if we did go up so he's reached a point where he feels content with the squad and cant justify splashing more money on the targets bruce has identified

may be more of a football man than people are giving him credit for

[Daweii]

4 hours ago, villa4europe said:

i think he knows he's got another mammoth spending spree if we did go up so he's reached a point where he feels content with the squad and cant justify splashing more money on the targets bruce has identified

may be more of a football man than people are giving him credit for

Wyness has stated and restated as recently as last week on the Villa View that Xia's plan is a squad to get up, a squad to stay up and a squad to win things. 

Now we have already spent £70 million assembling this Championship team which is absurd and it's an amount of spending that will be infringing on FFP before long. Xia has money I mean just recently Recon bought 51% of Millennium Films for $100 million. Now people may say well that's Recon's money, but Recon is Xia and Xia is Recon if he wants to manipulate money around so we become the next Man City then he likely could. This is solely because FFP hurts Championship teams more the Premier League teams and Villa have to take that very seriously.

Like you said Xia has another mammoth spending spree ahead if our plans work out a spending spree that will likely make £70 million look like pocket change, but for now we have to abide by the rules.

[sharkyvilla]

They said in January that they'd brought most of this summer's budget forward to help Bruce sort the team out, so I don't see why people are surprised we've not spent that much.  Judging from the way he's used the players he's bought so far, I can't say I'd have trusted him with more now anyway.  We just need to coach and manage the players we have better.

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

11 minutes ago, sharkyvilla said:

They said in January that they'd brought most of this summer's budget forward to help Bruce sort the team out, so I don't see why people are surprised we've not spent that much.  Judging from the way he's used the players he's bought so far, I can't say I'd have trusted him with more now anyway.  We just need to coach and manage the players we have better.

Pretty much

[DCJonah]

FFP is an issue but didn't Bourmouth and Leicester break it and just pay a fine?

Now I'm very happy with the level of spending so far and Bruce talking about being restricted is just excuse making shit. But I'd like to think we wouldn't let FFP let us struggle in this league for years and years to come. 

[OutByEaster?]

5 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

FFP is an issue but didn't Bourmouth and Leicester break it and just pay a fine?

I think they changed the rules after that and made the punishments a bit more draconian.

It'll be interesting to see what happens to PSG who appear to have decided to slap a great big hole through the middle of it by buying Neymar and Mbappe and then threatening to take UEFA to court if they start mentioning FFP.

 

[trekka]

5 hours ago, Rugeley Villa said:

Tony is either broke or he's decided he's not going to give Bruce or any other manager any more funds. I don't buy this FFP thing. Fail to go up this season and we are in shit street.

Or maybe forget about the FFP thing and agree that Tony has spent a lot of money for this division and is seeing no product under Bruce.  I've supported Bruce but now there must be improvement in the team for the money spent.  

[wazzap24]

34 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

FFP is an issue but didn't Bourmouth and Leicester break it and just pay a fine?

Yes, you are right, but that's one of the reasons we need to be a bit more cautious. 

Basically, my understanding is; the EFL don't think fines have been enough of a deterrent and I read somewhere there's a bit of beef between the EFL and PL over enforcement of punishments if/when teams go up. 

So the EFL have now given themselves the power to deduct points and/or withhold promotion. Neither of those punishments were available to them when clubs previously broke the rules. 

So now, rather than relying on the PL enforcing a punishment set by the EFL on a team going up, they can just stop you going up in the frst place (according to their rules at least) 

I believe it's looked at in a case by case basis, so if we marginally exceeded the permitted losses, but the Doc could demonstrate a reduction in said losses and evidence that we'd be ok going forwards, we might get away with a fine and a smacked bottom. 

If however, we get a new manager in, the Doc decides he sticking two fingers up at the rules and we spend £20m in the next couple of weeks, then I don't think they would be inclined to do anything other than throw the book at us. They could make a real example out of us if nothing else. I've no doubt we could challenge it in court and possibly win, but how long would that take? 

 

Edited August 15, 2017 by wazzap24

[jackbauer24]

FFP is so vague though that it actually has to come down to working out percentages of success and failure, it's not as simple saying we should just follow the rules to the letter in case.

As it stands there are no hard and fast rules that an x overspend equals an x punishment. It's ifs, buts and maybes. It's open to interpretation, discussion, arguments, agreements and mitigation.

So if one assumes we are 100% f*cked if we don't go up this season you don't not invest because we may or may not get punished in some form or another. There has to be an equation, which I personally feel we're in, where by overspending and breaking the limit by a small amount is worth the risk as without it I can't see us going up. Another words my feeling is that by overspending by £10m, say, we're not going to get the book thrown at us but I think that money would make a difference (if used properly on the right creative midfielder(s)) and that not doing so would guarantee our failure.

Personally I think we have three options; Either we stay as we are and stay in FFP but are guaranteed to fail as we don't have the players, or we spend a little bit more and increase our chances considerably and have a little risk of a fine (but I admit who knows), or go crazy and increase the chance of the book being thrown at us/ promotion being denied. I'd go option two. At least we'd have a chance of going up.

 

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

43 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

I think they changed the rules after that and made the punishments a bit more draconian.

It'll be interesting to see what happens to PSG who appear to have decided to slap a great big hole through the middle of it by buying Neymar and Mbappe and then threatening to take UEFA to court if they start mentioning FFP.

 

Surely they can't/won't have bought Mbappe as well especially for the figures quoted?

I knew nothing about this kid until this summer with all the rumours?

Is he some type of Messi amplified videogame type player or what?

[limpid]

Please take the discussion of FFP out of this thread.

[Villa Stu]

Tony has backed us massively already. regardless of the clubs current financial situation we still have a bloated squad that should be reduced before we consider any more incomings. I think Xia and the board realise that it is no good in the long run with the current squad size as either way it is unsustainable, if we go up we need to shift a lot of players to build a new squad and if we do not go up we need to shift a few players to help us balance the books.

The best thing for me that Tony can do is get rid of Bruce and hire a manager (and coaches) that have the football philosophy to get the best out of the current crop of players already at the club. Tony has assembled the most expensive team in EFL history and sees the tripe that happens on match days when he knows as well as all of us that on paper we have a great squad for this level. 

Tony is not the problem, the players (imo) are not the problem, it is the management and coaching that is. He would be better off using any funds we have available replacing Bruce which would be the best bit of business we could do right now.

[Tommo_b]

Boooo that kills the discussion.

Dr Tony woop 

[DCJonah]

If Bruce isn't sacked this week then my frustrations will turn towards Xia. 

I don't care how much money you put in if you keep making terrible decisions. 

[Demitri_C]

6 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

If Bruce isn't sacked this week then my frustrations will turn towards Xia. 

I don't care how much money you put in if you keep making terrible decisions. 

Same he has to go tonight