AV82 Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 1 hour ago, bobzy said: I really hope it doesn't. This system has seen us play really well against Chelsea, Everton and Man Utd. Just because we lose one game, we shouldn't go changing up how we're playing. It's this reactionary stuff that really annoys me about our fan base (not aimed at you, just general). News just in. Managers can play different systems at different times to suit different opponents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leemond2008 Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 41 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said: If he changed it and we lost everyone would be saying why change a winning system. Like I said earlier, absolutely no problem with sticking with a winning system, the problem comes when we are clearly second best and the system isn't working, there is nothing in the rules that says you aren't allowed to make changes until the 70th minute. Smith has been brilliant in the last 4 games but today was a bad day at the office for him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 24 minutes ago, Lerner's Driver said: So, immune from criticism then? He deserved praise last week and deserves criticism this week, surely. Yeh of course. I’m just saying it’s tough calls. I personally would have stuck with that shape. It wasn’t the shape that cost us, it was individual performances not good enough in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 (edited) 14 minutes ago, leemond2008 said: Like I said earlier, absolutely no problem with sticking with a winning system, the problem comes when we are clearly second best and the system isn't working, there is nothing in the rules that says you aren't allowed to make changes until the 70th minute. Smith has been brilliant in the last 4 games but today was a bad day at the office for him. Yeh I agree he could have changed it sooner. I still think we would have lost though. They were just better than us. Edited October 3, 2021 by Vive_La_Villa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delphinho123 Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 Don’t think Smith was at fault today, but what he does need to understand is there are certain things that need tweaking. My biggest gripe with this current side is the front two. They’re not playing well together at all and there seems to be very minimal chemistry. I genuinely can’t think of a single moment this season where they’ve linked up to create a chance. It could be that they’re very similar, I don’t know, but it isn’t quite clicking. If we’re persisting with the 3-5-2 then it might be the case that one needs to be dropped for Buendia. Personally, I’d like to see the 4-2-3-1 brought back but you still have the same dilemma, Ings or Watkins. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delphinho123 Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 1 minute ago, DCJonah said: I think people want this to be the case. Watkins should have scored 2 last week and his goal today, Ings was heavily involved in. I don't get why some are so desperate to not even give it a chance. Partnerships take time to develop. I think you know that’s nonsense. Why would people not want two of our players to play well together?! Individually, they’re both very good players but surely you can see they haven’t exactly been great together (yet). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macandally Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 7 minutes ago, DCJonah said: People don't want this front two. So they're negative it about it non stop. I think they've been key in our recent good form and performances. It wasn't great today but Watkins still got his goal. I agree, the front two press up top and allow the midfield three to join, that’s where currently the partnership is working. Spurs today surprised me in how easy they beat the press, either direct into Kane (which we struggled with) or via one touch passing, give and go. They have had a crap run, but the mid-week result lifted them and the first goal was coming. That was the worst thing that could have happened, they could then sit back and hit us on counter. Not a great day today all told, but shows how far we have come when we play that poorly and get done by the odd goal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaFaninLondon Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 The sooner he drops this 5 at the back nonsense and trying to shoehorn Ings and Watkins in the better. We genuinely looked like a Pulis Stoke side at times today. Needs to get his creative players like Bailey (when fit), Buendia and Traore on he pitch. We look a long ball team in this current set-up and our passing retention is absolutely awful. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkyvilla Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 For me the problem today was the performance of the 3 in midfield and whether we played wing backs or 4-3-3 then it would have been the same 3 players. To be fair I thought Doug was good, it was the other 2 that played like drains after the first 15 minutes and hard for a manager to legislate for. Have to give credit to Hojbjerg and Ndombele for a lot of our problems as they won the battle convincingly today. It's not unexpected that Ramsey could have an off game against more experienced players in there. There is still a lot to like about the system but it's good that we have options ready to come in to change things up in the future. Like most others I'd like us to see a front 3 against Wolves and leave out Ings for a spell, though there's a good chance we would beat them with 3-5-2 anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommo_b Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 15 minutes ago, VillaFaninLondon said: The sooner he drops this 5 at the back nonsense and trying to shoehorn Ings and Watkins in the better. We genuinely looked like a Pulis Stoke side at times today. Needs to get his creative players like Bailey (when fit), Buendia and Traore on he pitch. We look a long ball team in this current set-up and our passing retention is absolutely awful. I like 5 at the back, Cash and Targett look dangerous getting forward more, I think it’s the formation we should stick with moving forward. Today was poor, but previous two game’s with this formation were pretty damn good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 Just now, Tommo_b said: I like 5 at the back, Cash and Targett look dangerous getting forward more, I think it’s the formation we should stick with moving forward. Today was poor, but previous two game’s with this formation were pretty damn good. I think we're not very good at it because it doesn't come natural to our players Someone needs to step out and we never seem to know which of the 3 it should be, means we drop too deep You can also make a good argument that our wingers are better in attack than our wing backs, the quality of delivery from cash and Targett is really hit and miss even if they do get in really good positions 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avfc1982am Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 I think the problem today as in previous games is the system. An over reliance on the wingback system and success is very much based on both Cash and Targett delivering the creativity from wide. If either or both have off days or are over exerted and caught out it pressures the CB's to split and cover wide creating gaps through the middle. I'm not adverse to the system but an over reliance on it stifles our creativity as the middle and forward lines are continually congested. I felt Spuds had it easy today sitting back and countering us until we somewhat ran out of ideas and then gas. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condimentalist Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 1 hour ago, Czarnikjak said: Neither Buendia nor Traore ever in their careers played on the left wing. Not sure why. It's really down to El Ghazi or Young ( having watched JPB in last U23 game, he is defo not ready to start PL game) on LW if Bailey is not fit. I don't fancy any of these 2 options. I don't think Traore would be good on the left at all. No reason Buendia couldn't do it though IMO. He's hardly a typical winger anyway, and is both footed, preferring his right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaFaninLondon Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 9 minutes ago, Tommo_b said: I like 5 at the back, Cash and Targett look dangerous getting forward more, I think it’s the formation we should stick with moving forward. Today was poor, but previous two game’s with this formation were pretty damn good. I don't agree I'm afraid. Watch the Everton game again and until Bailey came on we looked abject. Man U we looked dangerous but so did they and we were let off the hook by their poor finishing. Today was a deserved defeat and we could have lost by more but Emi made a couple of big saves. Smith is supposed to be an attacking manager, but I was at the game today and we just seemed to be trying to score from that long throw every time. It's great having a set piece coach where we can improve there but it shouldn't be at the expense of us trying to play decent football. And while Cash and Targett get forward more, in this set-up we would look a far more threatening side if we had genuine creativity on the pitch like Buendia and Traore. More often than not Targett and Cash's crosses are just overhit anyway or hit the first man. I for one really hope this defeat leads to him going back to a flat back four and bringing in some more creative and threatening midfield players. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villarocker Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 34 minutes ago, villa4europe said: I think we're not very good at it because it doesn't come natural to our players Someone needs to step out and we never seem to know which of the 3 it should be, means we drop too deep You can also make a good argument that our wingers are better in attack than our wing backs, the quality of delivery from cash and Targett is really hit and miss even if they do get in really good positions Cash was formerly a winger so playing wing back should be natural to him. Targett also got forward well. I think that the midfield, especially the defensive side of it, was poor today. Ramsey wasn't great today and my frustration with Deano is the fact he didn't make a change at half time today - it needed it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWARLEY2 Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 Nothing wrong with the formation today. Just a shit performance from the large majority of the team. It happens. Consistency is the hardest thing to get from a team. Its what separates us from the top 4 or 5 . Good oerformance last Saturday by the first team the ladies team and a brilliant performance by the U23s . Fast forward to the next weekend and flat slow uninspiring performances from all.. Disappointed but not gutted. Its early days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 2 minutes ago, Villarocker said: Cash was formerly a winger so playing wing back should be natural to him. Targett also got forward well. I think that the midfield, especially the defensive side of it, was poor today. Ramsey wasn't great today and my frustration with Deano is the fact he didn't make a change at half time today - it needed it. I don't doubt that they cover the ground I just think the final ball isn't always good, definitely not as good as what I'd expect from bailly and traore If we didn't have winger options then it would make sense but we do so to me it doesn't Our strongest line up won't be with a back 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhan_Zhuang Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 Just have to bounce back and cement the top ten place next match. Obvious to say but the formation and line-up will change a little for the next match and i'd expect Villa to go for Wolves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaFaninLondon Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 10 minutes ago, Villarocker said: Cash was formerly a winger so playing wing back should be natural to him. Targett also got forward well. I think that the midfield, especially the defensive side of it, was poor today. Ramsey wasn't great today and my frustration with Deano is the fact he didn't make a change at half time today - it needed it. It simply isn't worth persisting with Cash and Targett as wing backs just because they get forward a bit more than before, when we are leaving out players who will be our main source of goals. You can't leave out players of the calibre of Bailey, Buendia and Traore for Cash and Targett. It's a dumb move. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 Bailey could fit in the 3-5-2 as a second forward I think although more logical to give him a run of starts wide right given we signed him to play there. Buendia can play as advanced midfielder in the three and we'll very likely see him there v Wolves as think Ramsey will drop out given he was poor. I don't think a 3-5-2 means we can't play any creative players, we can start either Bailey/Traore and Bunedia if we think clever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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