Ross Barkley

[Mister_a]

31 minutes ago, sparrow1988 said:

Why are people obsessed with sending him back to Chelsea? He's on loan for the season. He's played well in some games and been disappointing recently after a lenghty layoff through injury. He might rediscover some form and help us out later in the season. But sending him back to Chelsea is one of the dumbest suggestions I've heard. We do that and we're a player less in the squad and are not allowed to register a replacement.

When I say send him back, I mean at the end of the season.

[tomav84]

7 minutes ago, sparrow1988 said:

I thought that we are contractually obliged to play him, no?

impossible to do that. could be in a situation where we say he's not fit enough, ross/chelsea says he is, so you need to go about bringing in independant physios etc to assess him and decide if the contract has been breached or not. just wouldn't happen

the worst case scenario is that chelsea are reluctant to loan us players in the future if ross isn't getting expected game time

[sparrow1988]

14 minutes ago, tomav84 said:

impossible to do that. could be in a situation where we say he's not fit enough, ross/chelsea says he is, so you need to go about bringing in independant physios etc to assess him and decide if the contract has been breached or not. just wouldn't happen

the worst case scenario is that chelsea are reluctant to loan us players in the future if ross isn't getting expected game time

Was a joke/dig at some people. I'll stick in a winky smiley.

Edited March 7, 2021 by sparrow1988

[cheltenham_villa]

Hes 100% struggling with form and really hasnt performed at the level we would like. Right now in my opinion we need to find a way to score goals and Barkley gives us the best chance of doing that.

I also think he brings much more out of Watkins. If I was Deano, I'd accept that hes a number 10, I'd play him as one and try to address in the summer. This wont come with lots of tracking and we may need to tweak the team to accommodate.

[Vive_La_Villa]

1 hour ago, sparrow1988 said:

Why are people obsessed with sending him back to Chelsea? He's on loan for the season. He's played well in some games and been disappointing recently after a lenghty layoff through injury. He might rediscover some form and help us out later in the season. But sending him back to Chelsea is one of the dumbest suggestions I've heard. We do that and we're a player less in the squad and are not allowed to register a replacement.

I’m one of them that said it. I know it sounds dumb but I genuinely think he is severely weakening us whenever he is on the pitch. 

[DaveAV1]

1 hour ago, Kingman said:

Absolutely, On the plus side for him, He's probably devaluing at around £1m a performance so his price tag for any perspective buyers will be around £20/25m rather than the £40m banned around at the beginning of the season. Think this has Jack Wilshere V2 allover it. 

I wouldn’t give anywhere near £20m for him. Frankly his current form makes him unsignable, a complete waste of a squad number. 

He’s in a difficult position as he’s a high profile player and so his decline is quite noticeable. None of the bigger clubs are likely to want to touch him but he needs a reset. I think that was his motivation when joining us but it really hasn’t worked. Even when he was “good” he was only good when we were good. At no point has he been a game changer. 

I have some sympathy for the lad but only he can really change things around. I’m sure he’s had and will continue to get plenty of help behind the scenes but football is an unforgiving industry. Perform or get forgotten pretty quickly. 

[AvfcRigo82]

1 hour ago, sparrow1988 said:

Why are people obsessed with sending him back to Chelsea? He's on loan for the season.

Maybe because he is shite?

I'll be first to admit that I was probably the first person to suggest this weeks ago and I still stand by it now.

I think it is quite evident that he is holding us back with his performances and attitude.

Imo, The quicker these 12 games are played and he is returned to Chelsea the better.

As @DaveAV1 mentioned, he is just a waste of a squad number.

 

 

[MotoMkali]

1 hour ago, cheltenham_villa said:

Hes 100% struggling with form and really hasnt performed at the level we would like. Right now in my opinion we need to find a way to score goals and Barkley gives us the best chance of doing that.

I also think he brings much more out of Watkins. If I was Deano, I'd accept that hes a number 10, I'd play him as one and try to address in the summer. This wont come with lots of tracking and we may need to tweak the team to accommodate.

He doesn't bring more out of watkins though. Watkins has got as many chances to score goals in the games barkley has missed as the games barkley has played. Watkins has just been unlucky with his shots for whatever reason when barkley is out or the team. It is just a coincidence. 

Also if we need a goal barkley offers nothing. I would rather play a youth player and see what they can offer. Otherwise El Ghazi and Sanson all the way. 

[tomav84]

2 hours ago, sparrow1988 said:

Was a joke/dig at some people. I'll stick in a winky smiley.

ha yeah i definitely didn't get that...i need things spelt out to me via a winky smiley or at the very least a 'lol'

[sparrow1988]

2 hours ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

I’m one of them that said it. I know it sounds dumb but I genuinely think he is severely weakening us whenever he is on the pitch. 

So does Elmo comapred with Cash but nobody says get him out of this club and never play him again. El Ghazi for Grealish the same (although I've seen him get plenty of abuse). He strengthened us at the start of the season, and right now he's out of form and also IMO weakening the team whenever he plays but this send him back to Chelsea just baffles me. He looks unfit since the injury and covid break, there is no doubt about that but it's up to himself and the coaching staff to get him firing again.

I think that he was brought in as the opportunity presented itself to improve on Hourihane and we had decided against Sanson due to the price quoted in the summer. It was a decent loan actually for all concerned. We got an upgrade in that position and Barkley got a chance to prove himself. He did that to an extent before the injury and now he is out of form and not playing well - IMO it's 90% mental with him at the moment because he doesn't trust his body to hold up. Maybe he comes back in to form, he helps us up the table and we get a couple extra million prize money or sneak into Europe, maybe he doesn't, but cancelling the loan (if even contractually possible) is not the way to go IMO. You wait it out and see if he improves and see can you use him further. If he doesn't then he goes back to Chelsea at the end of the season. Imagine he was our own player and performing so poorly and we couldn't get rid of him so easy at the end of the season. That would be a much worse situation.

[sparrow1988]

1 hour ago, AvfcRigo82 said:

Maybe because he is shite?

I'll be first to admit that I was probably the first person to suggest this weeks ago and I still stand by it now.

I think it is quite evident that he is holding us back with his performances and attitude.

Imo, The quicker these 12 games are played and he is returned to Chelsea the better.

As @DaveAV1 mentioned, he is just a waste of a squad number.

 

 

He's not totally shite though is he? He's playing very poorly at the moment but he did have a few good games and improved the team before his injury. He just hasn't performed since. As it stands I would send him back to Chelsea at the end of the season also.

Regarding his attitude, I don't really agree. I think he's pissed off with himself when he plays badly. I think he doesn't have the confidence in his body at the moment as he's afraid of injuring himself again and he's finding it hard to deal with that psychologically. I wouldn't be too hard on him in this respect.

Edited March 7, 2021 by sparrow1988

[Vive_La_Villa]

11 minutes ago, sparrow1988 said:

So does Elmo comapred with Cash but nobody says get him out of this club and never play him again. El Ghazi for Grealish the same (although I've seen him get plenty of abuse). He strengthened us at the start of the season, and right now he's out of form and also IMO weakening the team whenever he plays but this send him back to Chelsea just baffles me. He looks unfit since the injury and covid break, there is no doubt about that but it's up to himself and the coaching staff to get him firing again.

I think that he was brought in as the opportunity presented itself to improve on Hourihane and we had decided against Sanson due to the price quoted in the summer. It was a decent loan actually for all concerned. We got an upgrade in that position and Barkley got a chance to prove himself. He did that to an extent before the injury and now he is out of form and not playing well - IMO it's 90% mental with him at the moment because he doesn't trust his body to hold up. Maybe he comes back in to form, he helps us up the table and we get a couple extra million prize money or sneak into Europe, maybe he doesn't, but cancelling the loan (if even contractually possible) is not the way to go IMO. You wait it out and see if he improves and see can you use him further. If he doesn't then he goes back to Chelsea at the end of the season. Imagine he was our own player and performing so poorly and we couldn't get rid of him so easy at the end of the season. That would be a much worse situation.

I think this is different. Yes they weaken us but they are back up players so it’s expected.  We have to deal with it as there’s no alternatives. 

With Barkley there other options but it seems Smith will continue to use him because of the player he can be. But each team it’s making the team much poorer.  I don’t think he should feature at all until he can sort himself out. 

[sparrow1988]

6 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

I think this is different. Yes they weaken us but they are back up players so it’s expected.  We have to deal with it as there’s no alternatives. 

With Barkley there other options but it seems Smith will continue to use him because of the player he can be. But each team it’s making the team much poorer.  I don’t think he should feature at all until he can sort himself out. 

I agree but you don't know if you can sort himself out until he has featured. Maybe he's looking good in training, we haven't a clue. I think Dean did the right thing dropping him for the Leeds game (should maybe have been earlier) and he hasn't started since and to be honest I'd have brought him on Wednesday and again last night after Sanson got injured.

Edited March 7, 2021 by sparrow1988

[MattVillaPortsmouth]

Lol he is a long way from being ‘shite’, people really like to go to the extremes.

I actually think he is trying to hard to play himself into form, he seems in the last few games to try and take on what Jack does and come deep to get ball, he needs to be up near Watkins more.

I don’t see an ‘attitude’ I see someone who looks frustrated and questioning himself, he may not get stuck in but he does not shirk a shift.

[villa89]

23 minutes ago, MattVillaPortsmouth said:

I don’t see an ‘attitude’ I see someone who looks frustrated and questioning himself

Exactly. N'zogbia had an attitude problem, barkley is supposed to be extremely professional and if anything wants to be a success too much. 

[picicata]

If we are not going to sign him, and I dont think we will try, then I can't really see the point of having him in the team. We looked far more balanced with Luiz, McGinn and Sanson in the team and they are far more likely to be here next season. Concentrate on getting a good understanding with those three.

[Thug]

I’ve been a huge critic of his performances, and have been calling for him to be dropped for ages.

However, I do think it’s a matter of can’t  rather than won’t with him.

I think we were just the wrong fit for him.  We don’t need an out and out number 10, we’re just not good enough in midfield to accommodate that.  Whilst Jack was playing, the ball just naturally went up the field more, and gave Ross a bit more opportunity to be involved.  Without Jack, it’s just clear that Ross can not provide anywhere near the same level of control in the last third, and basically exposes him as being quite limited.

He has a particular skill set, which is too limited for our needs, and even those skills have deserted him since the injury.

It is what it is, a failed loan for all parties involved.  I think he would want this to be a success more than anyone here, so I’m not going to judge him for the unknowns with regards to his attitude, or application.

What IS clear, for whatever reason, is that he is desperately out of form, and rightly has been dropped.  If he EARNS his way back in, then I’ll truly be delighted for us and for him.  I can’t see it happening.

We’ve paid a sizeable loan fee (?£11m I seem to recall?) which is £1m shy of what we paid for Konsa on a permanent deal.

Hopefully we learn something here as a fan base.  Every year in the transfer thread we have people moaning about championship players.  Let this be a lesson to them all.  An up and coming player hungry for success over a failing overhyped big six reserve any day of the week for me.

[Dale]

8 hours ago, GENTLEMAN said:

As was for my eyes too. I am most disappointed with his lack of energy and work-rate. He seems nowhere near winning a duel, if you compare to Sanson (pre-knock) and Ramsey. For certain, the balance of McGinn, Luiz and Barkley does not work. Really frustrating that Smith seems to persist with this. Although, he is now not trying it in a starting line-up. I would not be adverse to Barkley been returned to Chelsea, much is my distain of his performances at the moment. Was hoping it was injury or fitness but surely the 'training-minutes' trope can well and truly be dismissed now? Although Smith was trotting it out last night. 

Could possibly work in a diamond but that'd mean no Jack, Traore or Ghazi 

[ROTTERDAM1982]

There was a moment in the 2nd half when he received the ball on the half way line, and he turned, against Neves, not the quickest, his 1st touch was good, but he couldn't get away from him. He has lost that acceleration that the best players have, Jack has it, he is 27 now, it is not going to come back. 

He was always one of my non-Villa players, but i'm afraid i don't think he is ever going to be as good as he could/should of been

[Tommo_b]

23 minutes ago, Thug said:

I’ve been a huge critic of his performances, and have been calling for him to be dropped for ages.

However, I do think it’s a matter of can’t  rather than won’t with him.

I think we were just the wrong fit for him.  We don’t need an out and out number 10, we’re just not good enough in midfield to accommodate that.  Whilst Jack was playing, the ball just naturally went up the field more, and gave Ross a bit more opportunity to be involved.  Without Jack, it’s just clear that Ross can not provide anywhere near the same level of control in the last third, and basically exposes him as being quite limited.

He has a particular skill set, which is too limited for our needs, and even those skills have deserted him since the injury.

It is what it is, a failed loan for all parties involved.  I think he would want this to be a success more than anyone here, so I’m not going to judge him for the unknowns with regards to his attitude, or application.

What IS clear, for whatever reason, is that he is desperately out of form, and rightly has been dropped.  If he EARNS his way back in, then I’ll truly be delighted for us and for him.  I can’t see it happening.

We’ve paid a sizeable loan fee (?£11m I seem to recall?) which is £1m shy of what we paid for Konsa on a permanent deal.

Hopefully we learn something here as a fan base.  Every year in the transfer thread we have people moaning about championship players.  Let this be a lesson to them all.  An up and coming player hungry for success over a failing overhyped big six reserve any day of the week for me.

An £11 million loan?!