Keinan Davis

[useless]

It's in our best interests for him to go out on loan and to be playing as much as possible, he doesn't have to prove himself to be good enough for us whilst out on loan, for that loan to be beneficial, if he goes somewhere and plays well enough that we can get get a bigger fee than we would currently then that would make the loan worthwhile, if we was to go somewhere on loan and do well enough that Smith wanted him back as a squad option then even better.

[Dave-R]

1 minute ago, M_Afro said:

I think that we have mismanaged Davis. He looks to have the attributes to be decent but he just doesn’t seem to understand his role. He looks like a man, not unsurprisingly, who has not learned his role through experience. The guy needs to go and play for a team that will play him every week. He may never get there. Some people just don’t have it but we need to give him a chance.

The best thing would be to just set him free and move him on letting him do his own thing without Villa having to feel guilty by hoping he will come good. I just hope he's not always thinking is this my time because I'm not doing what should be done.. I don't think he would have those doubts from a championship side but a prem side having that type of player must be out of there minds not moving him on at this point in our prem league revival.

He is no where near Watkins level, yet is one year younger right? I think championship will be his place once he leaves here and then whether he can make a more all round player of himself he may end up in a promotion team which then fights for a bottom survival team in the prem. Then the moment that club survives in the prem, the moment Davis does not do what he's been doing, the bloke will end up all the way back to the championship. because his club survived and there ambitions moved on because that's what happens ambitions move on from players and clubs need and want more. I am just surprised with some of our fans that there seems to be this real poetic love story with our players that regardless of where the club is they seem to think we can do it all with these inconsistent/underperforming players in our squad.

I think he does deserve to play regular football and that football doesn't always mean it has to be with the club you have been with for ages. 

 

[mikeyp102]

Davis is not going to push on to become a side challenging for Europe every year. 
We’ll buy and bring through better. 

[villa89]

He's not good enough for premier league level. 

[brummybloke]

His only role at the club is an impact sub, and by that I don't mean a goal getter, I mean as someone to challenge for the long ball to release pressure with 20 to go.

He doesn't have 90 minutes running jumping and battling in him at this level.

It's only due to having no other forwards available this season he was kept on. He will be gone in the summer when we get another forward.

Good luck to him though.

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

2 hours ago, KenjiOgiwara said:

It's a never ending problem that he never gets a run in the side. Once he gets one match and doesn't light it up, he's automatically not good enough. Mean while people are content giving Wesley 6 months of straight pure shite and he's apparentley a better option. Or any other player we have that goes on a stupid run of poor performances. But for Davis he has to deliver from the one crumb he gets. It's baffling.

You know i'm a big defender of Wesley, but this is exactly my point.

He is in a lose, lose situation.

When he comes on in a game we are losing, or a difficult game, if he doesn't do something spectacular within that time, has a bad touch, or misses a shot, within 5 minutes, there is uproar.

He gets 1 start, where pretty much the whole supporting cast is poor, has a couple poor touches, doesn't have a stormer, and is castigated.

I didn't think he was very good either, but the lack of context and consideration of the circumstances is baffling, for me, too.

It's as if all the things like " a run in the team " " support " " confidence " etc. don't apply here.

I think it's a case of people being bored and wanting a new name to throw into the mix.

Bare in mind, there are people who have given Ollie stick in games like yesterday as well.

For his own good, he probably needs to go out on loan, or permanently to a newly promoted, or Championship club, where he can have a run in a team, and gain confidence, because he has attributes to be a very good player.

Edited May 14, 2021 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[KenjiOgiwara]

Yep. I dare also say it looked like the team or Barkley/Traore/AEG weren't used to his movement and such. So many times yesterday he ran and didn't get the ball or got the ball at the wrong time or were even kicked down by his own players. This is difficult to get around without more first team football, but it obviously makes it more difficult. 

FWIW I think it's a shame we didn't have a midfielder coming into the box when he squared it mid game. It was a lovely ball and should have been a goal. 

[nick76]

55 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said:

Yep. I dare also say it looked like the team or Barkley/Traore/AEG weren't used to his movement and such. So many times yesterday he ran and didn't get the ball or got the ball at the wrong time or were even kicked down by his own players. This is difficult to get around without more first team football, but it obviously makes it more difficult. 

FWIW I think it's a shame we didn't have a midfielder coming into the box when he squared it mid game. It was a lovely ball and should have been a goal. 

I thought his movement generally was poor.  Maybe I'm so used to Ollie that watching Davis, he just looked like a big guy lugging around. 

It wasnt until the 97th minute that he put that big frame about and showed what so many have been saying he can offer.  He should've been doing everything to show Dean he's worthy of a spot.  Yes the other players didnt help much in what was a "already off to the beach game" but Davis should've been busting a gut that he finally got an opportunity and wanted to prove himself. 

He just didnt take the opportunity by the scruff of the neck and despite others, prove something.  He just moved around and I forgot he was on the pitch second half until he did that run in the 97th minute, that's how anonymous he was. 

Even Villalad21 who is a massive fan of his gave him 6 out of 10...surely a player who wanted to prove himself with his first opportunity in the league to start wouldve got a better score from a big fan of his.  To get such a low scores says Davis didnt grab the opportunity. 

Yes it's one game, yes he hasnt had much chance to prove but against a team in Everton that was at the beach themselves he didnt take it.  I think it's hard to justify him getting a run in the team when he plays like that and him going out on loan or being sold in the summer would seem the obvious route now.

Edited May 14, 2021 by nick76

[DCJonah]

People talk about Davis, as though he's only ever made a handful of appearances for us. 

We've seen enough to know his strengths and his weaknesses.

He's not going to turn into a striker good enough to play regular for a top 7 team, which is where we aim to be. I seriously doubt he'd play regular football for many Premier league teams. 

The idea that he'd been badly treated or should have more minutes is laughable really. He's good for a 10 minute spell here and there. 

I like him but as we've progressed he's just not able to keep up the pace. 

If we were in the championship or fighting relegation  each season, then he has a place. But surely even his biggest fan knows he's not the required level for where we currently are or aim to be.

[Sulberto21]

He does his best work wide. Might be an idea to start wide (either side) whilst Jack has these sub appearances. Against scumchester we looked good when both Davis and Wesley were on.

[TRO]

7 hours ago, Sulberto21 said:

Overall today I thought he had a decent enough game. The problem with Keinan is the same as a lot of our players. When it matters they lack the killer instinct sometimes. Very inconsistent the lot of them except Emi, the defence and King Jack. Even Ollie has been inconsistent at times this season. 

When it matters? - that heavy touch he had when he was required to receive a quick pass and the ball went out of play. Playing the ball behind Matty Cash when we were on a counter, blocking Cash's shot. That was a lack of spatial awareness. A few others from today.

When he comes on as a sub he uses his attributes well imo especially against tiring defenders. As I've said before I think the sweet spot for him is 20 minute cameos and it doesn't have to be when we're chasing a game. 

He seems a timid shy footballer and once we start bringing in the cocky bastards the entitled pricks who scream shout moan for every little thing the likes of Davis will improve because they'll pick up these lil things. 

 

The team lack personality, when Jack and Ollie is not in it.

[TRO]

2 hours ago, Sulberto21 said:

He does his best work wide. Might be an idea to start wide (either side) whilst Jack has these sub appearances. Against scumchester we looked good when both Davis and Wesley were on.

its all too much for one striker imo....but Dean likes 2 wingers, which then means we lose a midfielder and our lot are not good enough to play with 2.

The right signings could transform our team......we will see.

Edited May 14, 2021 by TRO

[Sulberto21]

Just now, TRO said:

The team lack personality, when Jack and Ollie is not in it.

Agreed. Jack's vitriol towards Atkinson was slightly OTT but it's an example of what I mean. He's always in the ref's ear. 

[VillaChris]

1 hour ago, KenjiOgiwara said:

Yep. I dare also say it looked like the team or Barkley/Traore/AEG weren't used to his movement and such. So many times yesterday he ran and didn't get the ball or got the ball at the wrong time or were even kicked down by his own players. This is difficult to get around without more first team football, but it obviously makes it more difficult. 

FWIW I think it's a shame we didn't have a midfielder coming into the box when he squared it mid game. It was a lovely ball and should have been a goal. 

Was that the first half? I actually thought he did the right thing but far too early as we did have McGinn or Barkley starting to get edge of the box but even Bolt would've struggle to get on the end of that cross, he needed to hold onto ball for another 2-3 seconds and wait until one of them was actually inside the box.

I don't think his spatial awareness is all there. It's like that one he squared to Ollie v Man. United. Should've shot, seen out of corner of his eye Ollie was getting closed down by Man united defender and still passed to him.

Whether he can learn all this on loan I don't know but more minutes on a pitch somewhere would obviously help him.

[KenjiOgiwara]

41 minutes ago, VillaChris said:

Was that the first half? I actually thought he did the right thing but far too early as we did have McGinn or Barkley starting to get edge of the box but even Bolt would've struggle to get on the end of that cross, he needed to hold onto ball for another 2-3 seconds and wait until one of them was actually inside the box.

I don't think his spatial awareness is all there. It's like that one he squared to Ollie v Man. United. Should've shot, seen out of corner of his eye Ollie was getting closed down by Man united defender and still passed to him.

Whether he can learn all this on loan I don't know but more minutes on a pitch somewhere would obviously help him.

Isn't that a lot to do with match fitness? From my personal experience that is the type of errors I made after injuries breaks. You just aren't ready for the pace of the game.

[pete101]

Looks a far better player when Ollie is on the field with him , I've been very critical of him but has had decent moments this season, still don't think he is good enough for this level though

[Johnnyp]

3 hours ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

You know i'm a big defender of Wesley, but this is exactly my point.

He is in a lose, lose situation.

When he comes on in a game we are losing, or a difficult game, if he doesn't do something spectacular within that time, has a bad touch, or misses a shot, within 5 minutes, there is uproar.

He gets 1 start, where pretty much the whole supporting cast is poor, has a couple poor touches, doesn't have a stormer, and is castigated.

I didn't think he was very good either, but the lack of context and consideration of the circumstances is baffling, for me, too.

It's as if all the things like " a run in the team " " support " " confidence " etc. don't apply here.

I think it's a case of people being bored and wanting a new name to throw into the mix.

Bare in mind, there are people who have given Ollie stick in games like yesterday as well.

For his own good, he probably needs to go out on loan, or permanently to a newly promoted, or Championship club, where he can have a run in a team, and gain confidence, because he has attributes to be a very good player.

Again, an absolutely moot point. The guy does not score goals. Sure, we all love Ollie's endeavour and work rate but you can be damm sure if he wasn't scoring goals, he'd be getting it in the neck. Your making out Davis has been drip fed minutes. Did it ever occur to you that the reason we had to go out and loan Abraham, buy Wesley, and Watkins is that they know from watching Keinan in training that they don't think he's good enough to start games. And if you are getting 20 minutes here and there as a sub the onus is on him to impress. He doesn't. 

Edited May 14, 2021 by Johnnyp

[sne]

A loan to Celtic that was part of a transfer for Odsonne Edouard would be perfect. Won't happen but a loan to a club like Celtic might still be a good option.

[TRO]

I think a loan is inevitable....I accept the arguments on both sides, of the debate....but we need to up the ante.

We need forwards like Callum Wilson or Danny Ings, who can cause problems on their own.....not saying them specifically, but players with similar attributes.

 

[TRO]

Until he plays regularly, in every game, we will be having these conversations forever.

He plays with a lack of personality or confidence, he lacks swagger and devilment.....but is there any wonder, when he gets just cameo roles, or comes in to the side, when they are playing pants.

He has to go out to a championship club and build some game time and see where it takes him....At present, he hasn't got enough to be a premier league regular.

Its a shame, I really like the kid, and am desperate for him to do well.....but decisions are tough and I think we have to face them.

Edited May 14, 2021 by TRO