Carney Chukwuemeka

[Steero113]

17 minutes ago, Indigo said:

The main qualm for me with Young getting on instead of him is that Young isn't and never has been a central midfielder. A cursory glance of Transfermarkt tells me prior to re-joining us he'd played around 70 minutes in that position across the entirety of his career. I appreciate that we were in a no-win situation either way really but I just feel like Young coming on was a bit of a defeatist move as a form of damage limitation and wonder what the harm would have really been in bringing on an inexperienced actual midfielder for another quite inexperienced midfielder as Ramsey is.

Yeah, it seems very odd that Smith has gone from trusting Carney enough to start him in a PL game vs. Brentford to snubbing him for a guy who (granted is massively experienced) is miles away from being a CM. 

[rodders0223]

19 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

The thing is, when you have Buendia, McGinn, Bailey and Watkins already on the pitch, what you need from your other midfielder is good pressing with positional discipline, and the ability to defend. 

Chukwuemeka has a huge number of qualities, if I had to list his weaknesses, they'd be exactly those.

But then we are talking about Young as the other option.

He was tugging a caravan on his back. Sure he is experienced and the mind is willing but it took him a week to get across to Rice's shot and once or twice he gave the ball away and the sight of him (admittedly busting his ass to get back) was pretty embarrassing.

I was shaking my head when he came on. I was astounded our last sub wasn't taking him off.

[Indigo]

15 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

The thing is, when you have Buendia, McGinn, Bailey and Watkins already on the pitch, what you need from your other midfielder is good pressing with positional discipline, and the ability to defend. 

Chukwuemeka has a huge number of qualities, if I had to list his weaknesses, they'd be exactly those.

As I said, fully get that it was essentially a no-win scenario and I think his decision was also influenced by the precarious position we find ourselves in where Smith presumably valued the addition of an experienced head, but as much as you cite those as areas of weakness for Carney there's equally zero evidence of Young possessing those qualities himself in the middle of the park. He doesn't even put up good numbers in terms of pressing or defending relative to other full backs really, never mind midfielders. For me it's not even a point about why Carney should have come on but more so why Young shouldn't, I can understand the reasoning but just think there were probably a few other preferable options than putting a 36 year-old into midfield despite having never meaningfully played there across his entire career.

None of this is a criticism of Young by the way, I was a big advocate of his signing and think he adds value to the squad, just not in that position of the pitch.

[OutByEaster?]

5 minutes ago, Indigo said:

I can understand the reasoning but just think there were probably a few other preferable options than putting a 36 year-old into midfield despite having never meaningfully played there across his entire career.

And this is the actual problem - there aren't. We have a squad that's two central midfielders light - and of course, Murphy's law then says that's where we should get our injuries.

We went in light, we lost three, we're unbalanced and Chukwuemeka is sadly a victim of that imbalance, not its solution.

 

[Indigo]

5 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

And this is the actual problem - there aren't. We have a squad that's two central midfielders light - and of course, Murphy's law then says that's where we should get our injuries.

We went in light, we lost three, we're unbalanced and Chukwuemeka is sadly a victim of that imbalance, not its solution.

 

With respect he's isn't being presented as a solution, just potentially a better option in central midfield to replace Ramsey than a 36 year-old who I believe has actually played less minutes in that position across his entire career than Carney has in senior football. It isn't a binary choice of the two either, there was also the option of brining on El Ghazi and dropping McGinn into a pivot with Nakamba with Buendia in the #10, AEG left and Bailey right, or the same kind of idea but with Watkins pushing wide and either of Archer or Davis up front. All make more sense - for me anyway - because if nothing else you're playing players in positions that they have some form of familiarity with.

Ultimately it's a bit of a futile debate because we're losing that game regardless (but what else am I going to do when pretending to work at home of a Wednesday afternoon ) and indeed are both unlucky with absentees in that area as well as in need of signings there anyway, I just disagree with the notion that Young was the best option in that moment, hindsight or otherwise.

[Jay.P.A]

People keep banging on about Carney - he played 90 mins midweek before the WH game. 

[Keyblade]

There's a lot to criticize that West Ham performance for, but not subbing on the 17 year old into midfield against Rice and Soucek is certainly not one of them.

[thabucks]

Can see his frustrations growing soon if he isn’t given more of a look in - he must look enviously at Bellingham who he has been touted to be as good as Starring for Dortmund at England - time is in his side but whether that’s with us will be telling this summer. 

[Delphinho123]

Should be out on loan. 

[MWARLEY2]

If Carney doesnt want to sign then he doesnt want to sign. He is potentially an elite gamechanger but the evidence so far is that he is miles behind Bellingham in terms of development. If he is basing his situation by thinking that he can have a similar career trajectory as Jude then his agent is filling his head with shit. 

However there is no evidence of this at all . Its just negotiations and his agent wanting probably 50k a week and us offering 25k a week .  ( Probably) 

Edited November 3, 2021 by MWARLEY2

[Jareth]

15 hours ago, MWARLEY2 said:

If Carney doesnt want to sign then he doesnt want to sign. He is potentially an elite gamechanger but the evidence so far is that he is miles behind Bellingham in terms of development. If he is basing his situation by thinking that he can have a similar career trajectory as Jude then his agent is filling his head with shit. 

However there is no evidence of this at all . Its just negotiations and his agent wanting probably 50k a week and us offering 25k a week .  ( Probably) 

I think so too, the fact his brother followed him here shows him and his family see the short-medium term at Villa - it's all about the cashola, as ever.

[MWARLEY2]

Get him on the left wing ala Grealish.i swear it will improve Targett . He has the quick feet and enough pace and lets face it Bailey on the left doesnt seem particularly good. So get him on the right of a front 3 and Carney on the left and bobs yer uncle. 

[zenda]

His agent isn't that parasite Barnett, by any chance, is it? 

[John]

I worry that he may have been tapped up by a club that will up his wages, but stifle his progression by sticking him on their bench (at best). He has seen that we promote young players and that we are looking to bring our own players through the ranks. He also now has his brother at the club, it would be nice to think that they could play alongside each other in the first team some day. He might not currently be playing as often as he might like, but would that be much different at any PL club? I don't see any real reason that he would want to leave us, other than a financial one. Let's hope he signs an extension soon and continues to work towards his goal of being a first team regular with the football club that has done pretty well in getting him to where he currently is. 

[AV82]

What does this kid have to do to get a game? ...or should I say, what do Nakamba and McGinn have to do for this kid to get a game?

[rodders0223]

10 minutes ago, AV82 said:

What does this kid have to do to get a game? ...or should I say, what do Nakamba and McGinn have to do for this kid to get a game?

Stop playing at his own tempo and with an air or calm and run around like a muppet blasting first time passes into the stands I reckon.

[OutByEaster?]

12 hours ago, AV82 said:

What does this kid have to do to get a game? ...or should I say, what do Nakamba and McGinn have to do for this kid to get a game?

I think that's the problem at the moment - it's not Nakamba or McGinn he'd have come on for yesterday - he's not a six (neither is McGinn to be fair) - and we played what was almost a 4-4-2 with Buendia playing as a support striker - to bring him on I think we'd have taken Buendia off, changed the shape and played him as a ten - he's a fabulously talented footballer who can create and make things happen, who can move the ball and find space for others - he's perfect with a couple of solid midfielders behind him - which means with our midfield there's pretty much no chance for him to play.

I think we need to look at getting him a loan in January.

 

[AV82]

1 hour ago, OutByEaster? said:

I think that's the problem at the moment - it's not Nakamba or McGinn he'd have come on for yesterday - he's not a six (neither is McGinn to be fair) - and we played what was almost a 4-4-2 with Buendia playing as a support striker - to bring him on I think we'd have taken Buendia off, changed the shape and played him as a ten - he's a fabulously talented footballer who can create and make things happen, who can move the ball and find space for others - he's perfect with a couple of solid midfielders behind him - which means with our midfield there's pretty much no chance for him to play.

I think we need to look at getting him a loan in January.

 

I understand but given Nakamba and McGinns performances of late I can't see Chuk being any worse as long as he moves around a bit after passing and hauls his ass back when we (inevitably) lose possession. These are simple, rudimentary things that our current CMs seem incapable of doing. Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results - Nakamba is simply not good enough and McGinn either needs benching or at the very least different instruction.

[mikeyp102]

Scored for England U19s in a 4-0 victory

[ferguson1]

Perhaps Gerrard will convince him to sign a contract? I suppose being a midfielder if you want to be coached by one of the best in that position, then Gerrard isn’t a bad one to learn from.

Edited November 11, 2021 by ferguson1