Philosopher Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 1 minute ago, nick76 said: Zzzzzzzzz You are guessing this not based on fact. You don’t know how I’ve formed by opinion. Stats that you have chosen to suit your argument. Zzzzzzzzz Bias is obvious. It sticks out like a sore thumb. Keep being disparaging it's fine. As fellow Villa fans ultimately we want the same thing, a successful Villa team. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philosopher Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 Just now, nick76 said: You said he wouldn’t offer us that much now we have signed Watkins.....that’s just silly. We have Watkins who I’m looking forward to, looks great but is untried at this level. Wes whose injured until we don’t know when. Samatta looks to be leaving. Davis who’ll probably go on loan but if he doesn’t has already scored his one cup goal for the season. Yet you are saying Tammy wouldn’t make us much better, that’s just plain silly! Not the first team. The squad would improve though. But why spend upwards of 40m on a squad player we aren't man poo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Okonokos Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 Just now, nick76 said: You said he wouldn’t offer us that much now we have signed Watkins.....that’s just silly. We have Watkins who I’m looking forward to, looks great but is untried at this level. Wes whose injured until we don’t know when. Samatta looks to be leaving. Davis who’ll probably go on loan but if he doesn’t has already scored his one cup goal for the season. Yet you are saying Tammy wouldn’t make us much better, that’s just plain silly! Because Tammy is a similar type of striker to Watkins, that's why he wouldn't improve us all that much now. He'd just offer a similar game style to Watkins. If we want to improve now we do have Watkins then we need a different type of striker. If plan A doesn't work we need a plan B and/or C, not plan A recycled. I would rather take the £50 odd million it would take to buy Tammy and spend it on alternatives. Why spend over £70m on similar kinds of strikers? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Silvers Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 9 minutes ago, Okonokos said: Because Tammy is a similar type of striker to Watkins, that's why he wouldn't improve us all that much now. He'd just offer a similar game style to Watkins. If we want to improve now we do have Watkins then we need a different type of striker. If plan A doesn't work we need a plan B and/or C, not plan A recycled. I would rather take the £50 odd million it would take to buy Tammy and spend it on alternatives. Why spend over £70m on similar kinds of strikers? We need a strong squad though, I'd argue we need 2x plan A's for every position but upfront we need 2xA and 2xB, taking Injuries and covid into account. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 It rattles my cage when I see somebody using statistics to construct an argument, which by their very nature are objective, then somebody else returns with aggression. I don't know why I let it get to me, maybe it's the pointlessness of it. Statistics literally don't care about your feelings. Yes, there's more to the game than can be captured on paper, but simply put - there's just no need to be a dick about it. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichiBoi11 Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-R Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 The reason why Traore is not announced is Grealish and his puppy and lower down is Mings and his dog. I think this is going to be a new media attention grab by players, there will be an advert done at some point with the song *who let the dogs out* 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheltenham_villa Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 19 minutes ago, Phil Silvers said: We need a strong squad though, I'd argue we need 2x plan A's for every position but upfront we need 2xA and 2xB, taking Injuries and covid into account. That surely needs building over time when you can balance wages, investment and FFP. I agree with poster, we have watkins, Abraham wouldnt complement hed replace so wed be better spending money or strengthening another position. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Okonokos Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 @Philosopher used the following statistics in his argument; goals, shots (on/off target), offsides, pass completion %, expected goals, fouls (for/against), tackles and interceptions. That's not selective to suit his argument. I'd say that's pretty thorough and covers a decent range. What other stats would you want to look at for a centre forward? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubberman Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 2 minutes ago, Okonokos said: @Philosopher used the following statistics in his argument; goals, shots (on/off target), offsides, pass completion %, expected goals, fouls (for/against), tackles and interceptions. That's not selective to suit his argument. I'd say that's pretty thorough and covers a decent range. What other stats would you want to look at for a centre forward? How attractive they are? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Okonokos Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 (edited) 28 minutes ago, Phil Silvers said: We need a strong squad though, I'd argue we need 2x plan A's for every position but upfront we need 2xA and 2xB, taking Injuries and covid into account. All the more reason not to spend so much on Abraham. If we need to buy more players for various positions I just don't see the justification for spending so much on someone of his calibre. Why not go for an alternative striker, like Wout Weghorst, who I've mentioned before. Totally different type of player to Watkins and Abraham so would offer us an alternative game plan, lethal goalscorer at a top level and allegedly available for £30m ish. This would leave us over £20m we could then spend on other players instead of spending a full £50m on Abraham who would offer similar to Watkins. Edited September 18, 2020 by Okonokos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 7 minutes ago, Okonokos said: @Philosopher used the following statistics in his argument; goals, shots (on/off target), offsides, pass completion %, expected goals, fouls (for/against), tackles and interceptions. That's not selective to suit his argument. I'd say that's pretty thorough and covers a decent range. What other stats would you want to look at for a centre forward? If anyone doesn't like stats, they will always bring into an argument... "I don't need stats I WAtcH teH fOotBalLZ WITH MY Eyez!!" 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keener window-cleaner Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 7 minutes ago, rubberman said: How attractive they are? I'd say Wesley is more attractive than Tammy, real man there Wesley. Falls over like a little girl at times though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 (edited) 55 minutes ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: It rattles my cage when I see somebody using statistics to construct an argument, which by their very nature are objective, then somebody else returns with aggression. I don't know why I let it get to me, maybe it's the pointlessness of it. Statistics literally don't care about your feelings. Yes, there's more to the game than can be captured on paper, but simply put - there's just no need to be a dick about it. Because you can use the stats you need to back your argument and leave out stats that go against your argument. This is common in politics, lawyering and many other professions. Stats are used to defend your argument but can’t form the only basis of your argument. As for being a dick, people do that because the original poster posts those facts as if that’s the only truth, which it’s not. They are being just as much a dick as the person whose responding. I hate when people propose one view with some stats and believe that is the only answer that should be. Edited September 18, 2020 by nick76 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Silvers Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 2 minutes ago, Okonokos said: All the more reason not to spend so much on Abraham. If we need to buy more players for various positions I just don't see the justification for spending so much on someone of his calibre. Why not go for an alternative striker, like Wout Weghorst, who I've mentioned before. Totally different type of player to Watkins and Abraham so would offer us an alternative game plan, lethal goalscorer at a top level and allegedly available for £30m ish. This would leave us over £20m we could then spend on other players instead of spending a full £50m on Abraham who would offer similar to Watkins. Fairs points and I'm happy you gave a particular player alternative. Listen I really would hate to spend so much on Tammy but I do think he makes us better, I rate him where others don't as much, the fact that Chelsea would want 40-50m for him says they are rating him too but they are way ahead of us for squad depth, they can field 70-80m players now and that's where I want to be too, alas, he wants to stay there and fight for games, so its pretty much end on story really. I appreciate your view on spending wisely across the squad and I know we have to balance the books. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 18 minutes ago, Okonokos said: @Philosopher used the following statistics in his argument; goals, shots (on/off target), offsides, pass completion %, expected goals, fouls (for/against), tackles and interceptions. That's not selective to suit his argument. I'd say that's pretty thorough and covers a decent range. What other stats would you want to look at for a centre forward? How much a buying club would pay ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 53 minutes ago, Okonokos said: Because Tammy is a similar type of striker to Watkins, that's why he wouldn't improve us all that much now. He'd just offer a similar game style to Watkins. If we want to improve now we do have Watkins then we need a different type of striker. If plan A doesn't work we need a plan B and/or C, not plan A recycled. I would rather take the £50 odd million it would take to buy Tammy and spend it on alternatives. Why spend over £70m on similar kinds of strikers? See, after watching both of them I think they are different in styles. I’m not talking about the extremes of a Sheringham vs Henry difference but quite a difference. There are obvious similarities but I think the difference is material enough to affect a game. Plus our squad isn’t varied enough to make many tactical changes. I also think with buying Rashica and Traore we are favouring a style and thus you don’t want your strikers to be significantly different and with Wes, Watkins and Tammy you have a nice mix. We obviously aren’t going to agree so we may as well stop. I would buy Tammy, you wouldn’t now. Neither of us have a choice anyway and I’ll back whoever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted September 18, 2020 Author Share Posted September 18, 2020 So, about that cheeky loan deal for Januzaj? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Silvers Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 Just now, sne said: So, about that cheeky loan deal for Januzaj? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas10 Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 1 hour ago, AvfcRigo82 said: Nothing to spill sir, Just saying probably. Besides, it might not have even been a player!? Just joking mate & thanks for the updates. Pretty sure it was regarding a player/signing (makes sense), I can’t recall the full comment etc. hoping someone could explain. We are trying to attract higher calibre players and one of the factors is getting to play with someone of Jack’s quality as well as our ambition & project. So... when’s Rashica signing? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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