Philosopher Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 Wesley Goals 5 Ex Goals 7 Of you scale it up you get a slightly worse ratio than Tammy's. Shots 27 On target 18 Significantly better ratio than Tammy's. Wesley's supply was clearly vastly inferior. Offsides 14 Less than Tammy's which is expected as Tammy will look to run in behind more. Fouled Wesley 43 in 20 games Tammy 17 in 26 games Wes is fouled way more, and thus wins more set piece opportunities. Pass completion 72% for the isolated figure that is Wesley. Tammy's is 69%. Defending is once again in Wesley's favour, more tackles, but less interceptions. Higher successful tackle percentage. If average out over the same number of matches then wes has the advantage Wesley also has given away more fouls. Ironically both players has given away fouls in the same amount as they have won. However I still place slighty more value on Wesley here as he has to do more defending and is often tussling with centre backs a lot more than Tammy. However Tammy from the looks of the stats avoids tussles with defenders in favour of trying to anticipate their passes. My summary is that they seem equally as effective at what they do. They are different types of strikers. Wesley is more of a team player, Tammy is focused on scoring goals. However in terms of goals Wesley would only have a couple less goals than tammy given the same service. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philosopher Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 Seems to me that Tammy, Maupay and Wesley are all of a similar level looking at stats alone. However Tammy being the youngest has a higher ceiling than the oldest in Maupay. And Wesley has had the hardest job, in adapting to a new country, league, and not speaking the language. Personally I think this comparison reflects well on Wesley and he may very well be the best of this trio. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Silvers Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 2 minutes ago, Philosopher said: Seems to me that Tammy, Maupay and Wesley are all of a similar level looking at stats alone. However Tammy being the youngest has a higher ceiling than the oldest in Maupay. And Wesley has had the hardest job, in adapting to a new country, league, and not speaking the language. Personally I think this comparison reflects well on Wesley and he may very well be the best of this trio. Thanks for all the stats the research etc, very interesting. Its just a gut feeling of mine that Tammy just clicked here, I feel he would have buried all the sitters Davis and Samatta had, creepy up the table and raising confidence in those around him would have seen us closer to 10th then 17th. This is what Ollie with give us, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Silvers Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 Scenes tonight when Bale leaves spurs and heads up the M1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philosopher Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Phil Silvers said: Thanks for all the stats the research etc, very interesting. Its just a gut feeling of mine that Tammy just clicked here, I feel he would have buried all the sitters Davis and Samatta had, creepy up the table and raising confidence in those around him would have seen us closer to 10th then 17th. This is what Ollie with give us, I would somewhat agree with that. However if Wesley had stayed fit you can make the same speculation with similar justification. Having looked at the top strikers and goalscorers last season everyone of them except Sterling (by 0.30 goals) scored more than their expected goals stat. The best of which were Martial and Kane. Followed by Aubameyang and Ings. The best goals to expected goals ratio i found was Greenwood it was 10 goals to 3 expected goals. Which suggests this kid is going to be frightening. Interestingly Jack also scored more than his expected goals stat. Also just noticed Jacks expect assists was higher than his actual, which suggests that the finishing was lacking. Edited September 18, 2020 by Philosopher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas10 Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 36 minutes ago, AvfcRigo82 said: It was probably the same guy that got on a plane at Burton to Denmark the day after.. then onto Germany 2 hours later. Who knows!? Come on, spill the beans... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas10 Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 35 minutes ago, Jareth said: It was Dean's creepy uncle with the wandering hands 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 1 hour ago, Philosopher said: I think Wesley is better too. Tammy is a good striker for a top championship team or a good top 6 back striker. Otherwise he's not that useful. Don't forget Tammy takes penalties so his goal stats are bolstered by that. When we got promoted I thought then, as I do now that Tammy is worth 25m but not a penny more, nothing has happened for me to change that. If he was playing for us last season do you really think he would've scored more than 10 to 12 goals Wesley probably would've scored had he stayed fit? I don't. He contributes very little to the build up, for a tall guy he is lightweight, not creative. He is a goal hanger with a little bit of pace, nothing more. In the championship i rated him, in the Premier league he is average. What a load of tosh, you obviously don’t watch much football. I don’t mind debating opinions but when your starting point is nonsense then there is no point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philosopher Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 2 minutes ago, nick76 said: What a load of tosh, you obviously don’t watch much football. I don’t mind debating opinions but when your starting point is nonsense then there is no point. Take a look an my statistical analysis and then tell me I'm taking nonsense. Honestly you seem to always be starting arguments and being rude to others. Why all the angst? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 1 hour ago, Okonokos said: Not sure he's proven yet. I think £55m would be a ridiculous overpayment. Much, much better value elsewhere. I'd trust the Chelsea fans opinions on him as they see him more than anyone and even they don't seem to rate him. Well he’s scored goals at all levels so he’s fairly proven. you think? Great..... I don’t. Nice to have differing views, we don’t have to agree. i don’t trust Chelsea fans views, they want world class we aren’t there plus they can live without him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Okonokos Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 4 minutes ago, nick76 said: What a load of tosh, you obviously don’t watch much football. I don’t mind debating opinions but when your starting point is nonsense then there is no point. I thought he made good points that I agree with to be honest and I watch lots of football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 39 minutes ago, Philosopher said: Wesley Goals 5 Ex Goals 7 Of you scale it up you get a slightly worse ratio than Tammy's. Shots 27 On target 18 Significantly better ratio than Tammy's. Wesley's supply was clearly vastly inferior. Offsides 14 Less than Tammy's which is expected as Tammy will look to run in behind more. Fouled Wesley 43 in 20 games Tammy 17 in 26 games Wes is fouled way more, and thus wins more set piece opportunities. Pass completion 72% for the isolated figure that is Wesley. Tammy's is 69%. Defending is once again in Wesley's favour, more tackles, but less interceptions. Higher successful tackle percentage. If average out over the same number of matches then wes has the advantage Wesley also has given away more fouls. Ironically both players has given away fouls in the same amount as they have won. However I still place slighty more value on Wesley here as he has to do more defending and is often tussling with centre backs a lot more than Tammy. However Tammy from the looks of the stats avoids tussles with defenders in favour of trying to anticipate their passes. My summary is that they seem equally as effective at what they do. They are different types of strikers. Wesley is more of a team player, Tammy is focused on scoring goals. However in terms of goals Wesley would only have a couple less goals than tammy given the same service. You're not seriously suggesting that Wesley is comparable to Tammy are you ? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 1 minute ago, Philosopher said: Take a look an my statistical analysis and then tell me I'm taking nonsense. Honestly you seem to always be starting arguments and being rude to others. Why all the angst? Think you have the wrong person I’m rarely am involved in arguments on this forum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delphinho123 Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 Today is f***** painful. No Links, nothing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 1 minute ago, Okonokos said: I thought he made good points that I agree with to be honest and I watch lots of football. Ok thanks for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichiBoi11 Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 The summer transfer thread is now an argument about Wesley being better than Tammy? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philosopher Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 Just now, nick76 said: Well he’s scored goals at all levels so he’s fairly proven. you think? Great..... I don’t. Nice to have differing views, we don’t have to agree. i don’t trust Chelsea fans views, they want world class we aren’t there plus they can live without him. So you're saying you don't want world class? Surely that has to be the hope with every signing! Personally I know where you're coming from you simply mean you want players that improve us. But the stats suggest Tammy won't improve us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Okonokos Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 (edited) 8 minutes ago, nick76 said: Well he’s scored goals at all levels so he’s fairly proven. you think? Great..... I don’t. Nice to have differing views, we don’t have to agree. i don’t trust Chelsea fans views, they want world class we aren’t there plus they can live without him. He has scored 3 goals this calendar year and before last season all of his goals were in the Championship. A proven goalscorer is someone who scores at the top level year in year out, eg - Aguero, Vardy, Aubameyang, Lewandowski, Salah, Mane etc. When Abraham has scored double figures at least for say 3+ seasons in a row, then we can say he is a proven goalscorer. I don't think he'd offer us any more than Watkins. I like Tammy but he is a limited player. Just look at his technique when he strikes the ball. He doesn't look like a natural footballer, so it's no wonder he misses so many chances. Edited September 18, 2020 by Okonokos 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philosopher Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 1 minute ago, hippo said: You're not seriously suggesting that Wesley is comparable to Tammy are you ? That's what the stats suggest. I'm saying I rate Wesley at least as much as Tammy. Tammy is loved because he was a vital part of or promotion winning team. I love him too. I just don't get caught up in the romanticism, in making him the second best English striker. He isn't good enough for the Chelsea first team, isn't good enough for the England squad, and is at best an average Premier league striker. Kane, Ings, Sterling, Rashford all scored more goals and had better expected goals ratios. Greenwood's potential is world class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 4 minutes ago, Philosopher said: So you're saying you don't want world class? Surely that has to be the hope with every signing! Personally I know where you're coming from you simply mean you want players that improve us. But the stats suggest Tammy won't improve us. Of course I want world class but world class won’t come to us yet will they. The area on the market we are in Tammy is the best we can get massively an increase on what we have. If you don’t think Tammy would improve us, I’m shocked but I guess it’s a game of opinions....but it’s a bizarre opinion! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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