Generic Virus Thread

[ml1dch]

8 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

Thats not the point of this discussion.  We are getting screwed  equally eventaully whether  its south east west or north

And until today people weren't getting screwed equally. Some people were being more screwed than others.

Those people are now being less screwed.

[chrisp65]

28 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

Dont turn this into a lame south vs north debate chris mate 

 

Me?

I didn’t do it. It actually suits me to be brutally honest. 

[OutByEaster?]

1 hour ago, Demitri_C said:

It would have been alot worse if you wasnt given no help at all. Its mot very organised but at least your getting some help. 

Nope, not in our case - because it's perfectly possible to have a socially distanced concert with up to thirty people, the government isn't forcing a business with a 15.000 seat arena to close and if the govt isn't forcing your business to close, then you don't qualify for any help. There are an awful lot of caveats to the schemes that they brag about on the TV.

Redundancies require a consultation period - that's usually between 30 and 45 days - companies that were being left without support have started those processes - they aren't going to stop them because the government have announced a 30 day extension of an existing scheme that they don't know for sure they qualify for.

 

[ml1dch]

2 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

Redundancies require a consultation period - that's usually between 30 and 45 days - companies that were being left without support have started those processes - they aren't going to stop them because the government have announced a 30 day extension of an existing scheme that they don't know for sure they qualify for.

 

And given the last furlough scheme officially ended today, plenty of companies will have already started and finished those processes and those involved will have already lost their jobs.

[OutByEaster?]

39 minutes ago, bickster said:

I was down to four days a week getting paid 67% of my wage for the fifth day from tomorrow

I'm now down to f*** nows how many days at 80%

I literally got a payrise because the south is now affected (If I remain off one day a week)

I was on 67% since August and was going back up to 100% from tomorrow - that 100% would be paid by my company who didn't qualify for either the JSS Open or JSS Closed schemes that were in place at 18:30 today.  My company as of midnight tonight will have been getting nothing at all from govt in terms of wage coverage - zero. They'll most likely spend the weekend with the lawyers again trying to find out which little clause Rishi will be using to avoid having to help tomorrow.

 

[fightoffyour]

5 hours ago, Davkaus said:

I wonder what catchy 3 word slogan they've come up with.

Anyone have “track, trace, disgrace”?

[markavfc40]

[chappy]

7 hours ago, Davkaus said:

I wonder what catchy 3 word slogan they've come up with.

Next slide please

[KentVillan]

Haven't written anything about this in ages.

Important to own what you say, so I should admit to some mistakes:

1. I thought lockdowns were bollocks, but actually they do work in the narrow sense of controlling the virus. There's no doubt they're effective at controlling the virus. I still think they're hugely damaging in other ways, but I accept they work at getting R down and getting the virus under control.
2. Herd immunity is light years away in most places. I thought Sweden showed that herd immunity was achievable more easily than the models suggested, but that seems to be pretty questionable now.

Where I still back my original posts on this is that this is a holistic problem, and a lot of people's lives are being royally f***ed by the suppression measures. We need to come together as a society, not just to fight the virus, but to fight the collateral damage from lockdowns. We are not only creating a growing underclass, but also piling up a massive mental health crisis which will have knock-on effects for years. And destroying the economy at the same time. This is so much bigger than the financial crisis of 07/08

We all need to be kind to each other. Not in a lame Philip-Schofield-ducking-out-of-a-sex-scandal way, but in a genuine, listen-to-my-neighbour way. People are suffering right now, all over the world. It's natural that a lot of them are anti-lockdown, or maybe even Covid deniers. Don't beat up on them. Listen to them, concede some ground to them. This is truly horrific. It will drag on for years.

[Rolta]

5 hours ago, KentVillan said:

Haven't written anything about this in ages.

Important to own what you say, so I should admit to some mistakes:

1. I thought lockdowns were bollocks, but actually they do work in the narrow sense of controlling the virus. There's no doubt they're effective at controlling the virus. I still think they're hugely damaging in other ways, but I accept they work at getting R down and getting the virus under control.
2. Herd immunity is light years away in most places. I thought Sweden showed that herd immunity was achievable more easily than the models suggested, but that seems to be pretty questionable now.

Where I still back my original posts on this is that this is a holistic problem, and a lot of people's lives are being royally f***ed by the suppression measures. We need to come together as a society, not just to fight the virus, but to fight the collateral damage from lockdowns. We are not only creating a growing underclass, but also piling up a massive mental health crisis which will have knock-on effects for years. And destroying the economy at the same time. This is so much bigger than the financial crisis of 07/08

We all need to be kind to each other. Not in a lame Philip-Schofield-ducking-out-of-a-sex-scandal way, but in a genuine, listen-to-my-neighbour way. People are suffering right now, all over the world. It's natural that a lot of them are anti-lockdown, or maybe even Covid deniers. Don't beat up on them. Listen to them, concede some ground to them. This is truly horrific. It will drag on for years.

It's so much easier to find common ground when people don't automatically take contrarian views on 'expert advice' just because they don't like it. 

Once we're over all that then there's the discussion you want.

In the same breath as all the rest of the things you brought up is it not maybe also relevant to acknowledge the people who are going to die early deaths because of the virus. How have they been affected by late lockdowns? Are their lives not important and are they acceptable collateral damage? How is that good leadership? And how much extra strain on the economy does a late lockdown cause? How long does it prolong the issue of inflated infections? 

 

 

Edited November 1, 2020 by Rolta

[tinker]

Schools are obviously the breeding ground. Until they are closed then it will continue to spread . 

[Demitri_C]

10 hours ago, bickster said:

I was down to four days a week getting paid 67% of my wage for the fifth day from tomorrow

I'm now down to f*** nows how many days at 80%

I literally got a payrise because the south is now affected (If I remain off one day a week)

Yet all the uber drivers and cabbies I know are having the same issue. Go central london where most of them are completeky dead and thats where most of thwir work is.

No airport runs either as no going away. Now a national lockdown be even worse for them.

10 hours ago, Davkaus said:

We may all be getting screwed, but equally? Nah.

 

Matter of opinion not factual.

[Demitri_C]

9 hours ago, chrisp65 said:

Me?

I didn’t do it. It actually suits me to be brutally honest. 

Open a new thread if you wish a friendly north vs south debate Christopher

[LondonLax]

50 minutes ago, tinker said:

Schools are obviously the breeding ground. Until they are closed then it will continue to spread . 

That is very easy to say but the implications of that could pretty drastic on an entire generation of people. A second school year in a row of significantly disrupted learning will have long term impacts on society. 

[Jareth]

Given nobody does any work in December anyway, I can see the England lockdown extending to January. 

[ml1dch]

27 minutes ago, Jareth said:

Given nobody does any work in December anyway, I can see the England lockdown extending to January. 

I'd go completely the other way. Presumably it's a desperate attempt to sacrifice the comparatively fallow economic November to save a bit of the December Christmas economy. 

Some pubs and restaurants make half of their annual income in the few weeks leading up to Christmas (what other time of year is every restaurant fully booked all evening, every day of the week), to say nothing of the general Christmas shopping impact on town and city centres. 

Edited November 1, 2020 by ml1dch

[Nicho]

7 hours ago, KentVillan said:

Haven't written anything about this in ages.

Important to own what you say, so I should admit to some mistakes:

1. I thought lockdowns were bollocks, but actually they do work in the narrow sense of controlling the virus. There's no doubt they're effective at controlling the virus. I still think they're hugely damaging in other ways, but I accept they work at getting R down and getting the virus under control.
2. Herd immunity is light years away in most places. I thought Sweden showed that herd immunity was achievable more easily than the models suggested, but that seems to be pretty questionable now.

Where I still back my original posts on this is that this is a holistic problem, and a lot of people's lives are being royally f***ed by the suppression measures. We need to come together as a society, not just to fight the virus, but to fight the collateral damage from lockdowns. We are not only creating a growing underclass, but also piling up a massive mental health crisis which will have knock-on effects for years. And destroying the economy at the same time. This is so much bigger than the financial crisis of 07/08

We all need to be kind to each other. Not in a lame Philip-Schofield-ducking-out-of-a-sex-scandal way, but in a genuine, listen-to-my-neighbour way. People are suffering right now, all over the world. It's natural that a lot of them are anti-lockdown, or maybe even Covid deniers. Don't beat up on them. Listen to them, concede some ground to them. This is truly horrific. It will drag on for years.

Don’t mean to bite at you but it sounds like you are a Tory but want leftie policies 

[darrenm]

36 minutes ago, LondonLax said:

That is very easy to say but the implications of that could pretty drastic on an entire generation of people. A second school year in a row of significantly disrupted learning will have long term impacts on society. 

Another government failing. It was imperative on them right at the beginning to get remote learning fully integrated everywhere. Most businesses who work around IT naturally got to the point before the pandemic where they were using Teams/S4B for remote meetings so that the shift to everyone being telecommuters was almost seamless. Now offices are closing everywhere because they don't want or need to go back. The same could have been done for schools. Classrooms should have been made hybrid so it doesn't matter if kids are there in person or over a screen. Obviously practical subjects can't be done in this way and social interaction is still hugely important for kids so being there in person would always be preferable. But it would have made the inevitable 2nd spike easier to manage.

[tinker]

1 hour ago, LondonLax said:

That is very easy to say but the implications of that could pretty drastic on an entire generation of people. A second school year in a row of significantly disrupted learning will have long term impacts on society.

I know but you can't ignore the facts when trying to stop this virus. 

Tbh the only way I can think to completey halt this is to have a total lock down for 2 weeks, as in no schools no work and no shops open. Give people a week to get enough food together and bang , stop everything. Other than vital and I mean vital services ,water , elec and gas and some NHS services , the rest just stops.

 

[abdulaziz1]

I’ve just got it. Although our country is still banding travelling (with only people with Visas and nationals to come back). It seems to be spreading again from what I’m seeing again. I’m sure there will be a way to fully control it without Vaccines. Hopefully the lockdowns in some countries can reduce the cases and effects.