Ratings & Reactions: Leeds v Villa

[The Fun Factory]

24 minutes ago, NurembergVillan said:

 

Who's the daddy now?

[thunderball]

1 hour ago, TRO said:

I was talking about today's game.....not the last 10

I simply disagree with your analysis. We don't play anything like Steve Bruces team granted.....but by being pushed back and losing Midfield, it became similar today.....we started brightly, missed a few good chances and a pen.....and faded.

Have you studied the possession stats?, We simply watched the game differently I guess.

I can excuse John McGinn being on a ban threat....but the rest outside the defence, I couldn't see anyone dominating their position.....I thought Jack had a poor game by his standards ( sorry)

Maybe Dean will acknowledge that the game needed Whelan and not Hourihane away at a side that presses. 

Green I thought did well, he found his own space. El Ghazi and Jack were targeted successfully. McGinn was under a compromising yellow card cloud and Kodj was just an unfamiliar maverick and he didn’t really take his chances. 

On a positive note, we didn’t really look under too much threat away from home and did enough to win away from home. Defensively we looked solid. Leeds were better over 97 minutes on balance but not sufficiently to deserve a win, nor one where it matters. We looked like we weathered a storm and took it in our stride, we almost had another gear but didn’t need it.

[peterms]

6 minutes ago, JohnStortford said:

I think Bielsa has played a blinder by letting us score. Imagine how much ammunition that would give us if we'd have lost that game.

Yes, he understands how we would have reacted.

Why, it's almost as though he'd seen us in training.

[peterms]

1 hour ago, YLN said:

That's not how the game is played and certainly when a player feign that he's going to put the ball out and then plays a forward pass once everyone has stopped playing,

Yes, that's the point.  There are times when you clearly stop play, times when you don't,  and times when players are unsure.

What caused the strong emotional reaction from the players was the feeling that there was deception.  If Leeds had just played on as normal, there might have been complaints afterwards, but there wouldn't be the fury that we saw.  

[Dr_Pangloss]

56 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said:

Reading their forums; blimey they are a deluded lot. Hope they go bust.

Some of the worst fans in football support Leeds. A rancid little football club.

[Spoony]

21 minutes ago, peterms said:

Yes, that's the point.  There are times when you clearly stop play, times when you don't,  and times when players are unsure.

What caused the strong emotional reaction from the players was the feeling that there was deception.  If Leeds had just played on as normal, there might have been complaints afterwards, but there wouldn't be the fury that we saw.  

It’s exactly this. If I were Smith I’d definitely be laying into them for not playing to the whistle, but it was the deception that’s just not on. So unbelievably unsporting. 

[ciggiesnbeer]

15 minutes ago, Dr_Pangloss said:

Some of the worst fans in football support Leeds. A rancid little football club.

Rancid BIG football club I am sure they would be the first to tell you  Makes you wonder what they are compensating for... 

 

More seriously, I dont mind most Leeds fans.  They have done their time in the Championship and are a bit crazy at the prospect of maybe getting back to the top tier. I respect that. I feel the same about Villa and we have not been down here very long comparatively. 

[Kingman]

In all my life following the Villa that's the only goal we have scored that I have never cheered, Purely and simply because I hadn't got a **** clue what was going on! 

Edited April 28, 2019 by Kingman

[tonyh29]

After the game at VP I feared meeting Leeds in the play offs ... After today I don’t really fear them at all , nothing about them really other it’s like Norman Hunter is training them , take away the kick and bite and they don’t have a lot going for them  .. other than an ability to whine to the ref every 20 seconds 

We weren’t at our best today but  were controlling that match nicely and liked the likely winners until their dirty cheating goal and the cheating dive .

shame we didn’t make it 11 on the spin but we’d take a point after all that happened 

Edited April 28, 2019 by tonyh29

[Johnnyp]

44 minutes ago, tonyh29 said:

After the game at VP I feared meeting Leeds in the play offs ... After today I don’t really fear them at all , nothing about them really other it’s like Norman Hunter is training them , take away the kick and bite and they don’t have a lot going for them  .. other than an ability to whine to the ref every 20 seconds 

We weren’t at our best today but  were controlling that match nicely and liked the likely winners until their dirty cheating goal and the cheating dive .

shame we didn’t make it 11 on the spin but we’d take a point after all that happened 

I don't think we were controlling it nicely. At all. I think they were the best side we've faced in the run we've been on. They got into our half plenty, they play some nice triangles with ayling, hernandez and trampford without been threatening . Thought Phillips nullified Grealish. We need to do our homework more on them should we meet them at Wembley.

[Made In Aston]

4 hours ago, terrytini said:

but I can see Derby beating them

I can't. They resoundly beat Derby home and away this season.  

Edited April 28, 2019 by Made In Aston

[Tomaszk]

Not scared of them at all.

No Tammy and no Whealo. Grealish and McGinn half-fit.

With everyone back and with a referee who can call a foul they can't touch us. Didn't have a chance before that scummy goal. 

We'll do these when we next play.

[TRO]

3 hours ago, Hanky said:

Not sure about the linesman. It’s not just a case of he’s not seen it, he’s actually invented/guessed at what happened which is more appalling. 

was it the same one who never spotted the off side for their goal?.....he wants to go to specsavers.

[holtend4life]

They do a nice triangle with the first passer running on to get the quick flick from Bamford at the end of it. Unfortunately, our two cbs are athletic enough to cover it when it comes their way in between them and our fullback. 

Leeds are a bit toothless though without Roofe on the pitch and/or in form. They’ll be relying on set pieces and shots from outside the box to progress in the playoffs, it’ll just be their play getting into the final third will be very slick. 

They played a physical style with a hot tempered crowd behind them today and to be honest I didn’t feel that overwhelmed by it all. 

Id be more nervous against West Brom who have two much better strikers to contest against.

[Khizzy]

I don't think we have anything to fear if we play Leeds over two legs if WBA do finish above them. Leeds had the crowd on their side and the atmosphere was quite intimidating for our players and yet they still couldn't win the game. We didn't have the best of games overall but I'm sure we would give them a game at our place, we have another gear if we really need it - in a way the game didn't mean all that much overall since we've already secured our playoff place. 

McGinn needs a rest anyway, as do a few others. Think Smith really needs to rest a few at Norwich and then go all out for the playoffs. We don't have anything to fear whoever we play - WBA are probably the dark horses going into the playoffs but we've got the best squad on paper I think.

[Thug]

It’s so strange to see such a varied analysis of what to make of the game today, and I can actually agree with nearly every account I’m reading.

I can see how despite having the majority of the possession, they didn’t really have any clear cut opportunities to score, so I get it when some on here feel like today was a job well done, and feel there is nothing to fear from them.

Personally, I am actually less confident after today’s game.  I think our game plan pretty much relies on controlling the game, and up until today, I can’t remember where we’ve not dominated possession and territorial advantage, let alone be dominated in those areas.

I don’t remember a game where Grealish and McGinn have been so creatively nullified.

Now its one thing to smother those two out the game, but another to manage to do it and still dominate possession.  Most teams have had to double or triple up on Grealish.. they didn’t need to. Yes it wasn’t exactly a gentlemanly way to deal with him, but by hook or by crook they got the job done, and at the end of the day no one will remember how the job got done.

We weren’t helped at all by the fact there was no one holding the ball up top, and have to admit I was bitterly disappointed by JK’s performance today. I know that’s not what his game is about, but when he did get the opportunities to use his strengths, he didn’t manage that either.  We desperately need Tammy fit, and if not, I’d have to say that i’d prefer Davis as the lone man up front, just to hold the thing up there for long enough for us to keep possession - especially against more astute opposition like this lot.

Our defence is stellar. And the turn around from the beginning of the season is nothing short of miraculous. But I worry that the number of shots we allowed today, and the territorial advantage we conceded means it is only a quality strike away from conceding what may well be the only goal of the game against opposition like this.  We were very restricted in our own attacking opportunities, and if they are given an opportunity to shut up shop - I think they’d be very effective at doing so.

In conclusion, I think they are by far the most competent team we wave played so far, and I am loathed to admit that my supreme confidence in walking the play offs has taken admire ran a small dent after today.

[Hornso]

I hope the karma bus rolls over the entire squad. What a bunch of scumbags.

[Rossi]

Although I agree they are the best we have faced on this run, and you some up very well what their good at, I do feel we had the better chances even tho we weren't at our best and as you mentioned without Tammy. I feel quite confident if it was them at Wembley we would beat them, they didn't really open us up in the final 3rd at home, so I would think at Wembley they would be there for the taking. 

[srsmithusa]

My contrary view.  Stuart Atwell is a good referee.  Like many good referees in fierce matches, his goal was to call the fouls in the center but give lots of freedom in key areas.  A pen must be stonewall or you don’t call it The goal is that it’s clear the players settle the match, not the ref.   Unfortunately, this approach also looks to avoid cards, even when persistent infringements demand it.  He avoided big calls and he avoided cards. The cards he gave were NECESSARY, (close to send off before you give the caution.) There were  three exceptions to the “necessary cards only” strategy. . Biesla’s was given by 4th official, the send off of el ghazi given by AR, and the caution to Bamford, also given by AR.  The other cards he gave (with the exception of the first one) were all closer to red then to no card.  Atwell was trying to avoid making a big call that made the difference in the game.  The foul on kodjia near midfield, as a villa fan, should have been called.   But trying to be neutral, I could argue that Kodj stepped in front of the opponent that played the ball and no call was defensible.  

Powers or whoever, clearly played an act to lull villa to sleep and it worked.  A referee COULD caution that for misconduct, but it would be really hard to sell. And the gut instinct is to play and clinch up hoping it comes to nothing.  I guarantee Atwell was pissed it scored, he was screwed and he knew it.  There were 2 other ways the referee crew can stop it at that situation.  The AR could call the offside, even if it was just close, but if you really don’t think it’s offside that’s hard to think that fast. The only other option (really takes courage) is to blow the whistle “inadvertently”.  The restart is a drop ball.  I had the courage to do that one time when a team was just taking clear, unfair advantage of a situation.  It worked to stop the unfair attack, but the attacker’s were so furious (somewhat understandably) I had to fight like hell to keep control of the match.  

Frankly, Leeds treachery put both villa and the referee in a terrible spot.  He had very little chance to fix the unfair events.  

As an assessor, his error was not setting firm enough control earlier.  He clearly did not want to give cards (at all) and certainly not for PI.   If he had that would possibly make Leeds a little less likely to indulge in deception to gain an advantage.  

After the “incident” he should have stepped up, gotten closer, called things really tightly for a while, to settle things down.  That would have likely prevented McGinns caution (as it was, it couldn’t have gotten anything less than a caution.)

My last thought, about the referee...once the AR told him to award a red against villa, he would have been wise to find one to give to Leeds, also.  There were chances with the neck holds etc.  but a red card each way would have felt more just in the mess he found himself and would have helped settle things, especially villa emotions who rightly felt livid over being “cheated.”

Remarkable that Bielsa instructed his team to give the goal, but I would hate to be in their dressing room this week.  Roberts and kich have to think “my manager thinks I cheated.”  Bamford realizes that “the world thinks I cheated”. Bielsa has to think “three of my team cheated and  One of my team ignored my instructions” Janssen thinks, “My manager ignored me, and the fans and gave away a win.”  Their dressing room could be lost in multiple factions

Finally, if Bielsa really wanted justice and fairness, he should have taken a player off, to play level sides.  

But DAMN that was a match

one other thought about playing.  Lots of posters here saying we need to pass more quickly.  And I understand, but I think if we play them again, I’m telling the lads to carry the ball and attack man on man and beat your man on the dribble, then drive. They were pressuring the ball, but almost always with only one man.  If you think about it, some of our best moments came when a villan took on his man one on one beat him and then took the space, (Ming’s, Tuanzebe, el ghazi, McGinn, grealish- all did it) it forced other leads players to abandon their marks to close in the space.  THATS when we need to pass to the player left unmarked.  

[Kingman]

The words "Ex-premier league referee" are usually a bit of a give away!