Racism Part two

[snowychap]

3 hours ago, sne said:

Uh-oh, looks like the Uncle Ben's logo and some syrup called Aunt Jemima could be going.

Is this a bad thing?

[Chindie]

2 hours ago, snowychap said:

I mean: how and why (would he like to be referred to it not why it would obviously set you on edge)?

I've absolutely no idea. The family friend isn't the type to be racist, so I doubt he's 'given' him that name, it must be a name he'd been introduced as. But still... It's just horrific.

[sne]

Just now, snowychap said:

Is this a bad thing?

Nope

[Demitri_C]

Whats racist about the uncle ben logo?

[icouldtelltheworld]

Vast majority of our fans are a good bunch, but there were some seriously bad takes on the club's FB post about the players taking a knee yesterday. Noticed one or two mentioning they won't support BLM as it's being funded by George Soros/new world order etc... "I'm not racist, here's some antisemitic tropes to prove it"

[ml1dch]

 

 

[bickster]

30 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

Whats racist about the uncle ben logo?

Quote

Uncle Ben’s Rice

The image of an elderly black man has appeared in ads for Uncle Ben’s Rice since 1946. Like Aunt Jemima, the caricature represented a racial stereotype that lingered after slavery. And, just like Aunt Jemima, the Uncle Ben logo has been updated to reflect a more modern Black person. Also in the same vein as the pancake brand, the name remains, carrying on the practice of whites addressing elderly African-Americans as “uncle” and “aunt” because the titles “Mr.” and “Mrs.” were deemed unsuitable for Blacks.

Atlanta Black Star (more racist Logos on link)

[Paddywhack]

26 minutes ago, bickster said:

Atlanta Black Star (more racist Logos on link)

I'd never given it a second thought. I guess I just assumed the guy on the packet was the founder of the company and he'd named it 'Uncle Bens'. Very naive of me, I guess!

Edited June 18, 2020 by Paddywhack

[HanoiVillan]

48 minutes ago, ml1dch said:

 

 

Mark Francois

[StefanAVFC]

Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear.

Willful ignorance is a cancer.

[ml1dch]

10 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said:

Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear.

Willful ignorance is a cancer.

Come on now, it's not as if the Foreign Secretary needs to know about things happening in the world. 

[Stevo985]

1 hour ago, icouldtelltheworld said:

Vast majority of our fans are a good bunch, but there were some seriously bad takes on the club's FB post about the players taking a knee yesterday. Noticed one or two mentioning they won't support BLM as it's being funded by George Soros/new world order etc... "I'm not racist, here's some antisemitic tropes to prove it"

Amazing the amount of replies on social media raging because we can have BLM on the shirts but not the poppy. 
 

Seemingly they don’t watch football as the poppy has been on the shirt every year for **** ages now 

[Davkaus]

8 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

Amazing the amount of replies on social media raging because we can have BLM on the shirts but not the poppy. 
 

Seemingly they don’t watch football as the poppy has been on the shirt every year for **** ages now 

Not only that, but players that choose not to wear one get abuse, every single year.

They can't be worn in international fixtures. People don't check facts before getting on their high horse to bang about how oppressed they are as middle aged gammon people. 

[Rolta]

Nah, we need to commemorate WW2 every single day as it's the event when English history began. England didn't exist before then. You're not English unless you funnel your thinking through a nostalgic, black and white portal where all thought is accompanied with phrases like, 'blitz spirit' and 'we wouldn't have our freedom now'.

(Nothing that I said disrespects those who gave their lives in WW2. It's a comment on a trope of modern English thinking by some people.)

[tonyh29]

49 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

Amazing the amount of replies on social media raging because we can have BLM on the shirts but not the poppy. 
 

Seemingly they don’t watch football as the poppy has been on the shirt every year for **** ages now 

yep , i had that one from friends in a WhatsApp group  ... pointed out , not only do they wear a shirt with a poppy on it , it is then sold off after the match to raise money for charity , been going on for years   ..not one word back

 

Even my "Yay , its back comment"  on Facebook yesterday  , first reply " What the **** were those clowns doing on their knees????"

These are friends who I grew up with , they aren't Britain first Nazi types ,  they are just from that era and their occasional casual racism comment has sort of been a way of life to them ,   but both these comments go way way beyond that ... I'm not the sort who is going to go around defriending people because they don't agree with taking a knee but there comes a point when you realise you've outgrown some old friends

[sharkyvilla]

1 hour ago, Paddywhack said:

I'd never given it a second thought. I guess I just assumed the guy on the packet was the founder of the company and he'd named it 'Uncle Bens'. Very naive of me, I guess!

One of the best bits of The Office is when David Brent gets Fray Bentos mixed up with Fidel Castro but it's only very recently that I realised that Fray Bentos is a place, not a person. 

[Davkaus]

I think it was an interesting decision to endorse BLM rather than using the existing "Kick It Out" campaign, which is comparatively uncontroversial, though I guess you could say that's because it's less effective.

I struggle with BLM because there's an awful lot of the moment that's nothing to do with racism and all about an unrelated political agenda. The message "black lives matter" being so closely entangled with a fairly radical anti-capitalist movement is quite problematic in that criticism of Black Lives Matter as an organisation always seems to get taken as criticism of the message.

[villa4europe]

I'm kind of glad kick it out took a bit of a back seat

For all the good work they do and don't get me wrong football is far from perfect but I do think football is better than society in general and I will always defend football and football fans (despite the number of idiots) when we get the shitty end of the stick, it's not a football problem ita a society problem for which football is one of many voices and I think last night got that message across better than kick it out can 

On a side to that I did see one of the suggestions was again introducing Rooney rule type things, 25% of coaches should be from an ethnic background... My problem with that is that they want the top end of football to fix the problems that exist due to what's happening at the bottom, the FA need to increase the number of ethnic minorities taking the badges before they point the finger at the PL clubs for not hiring them 

[tonyh29]

49 minutes ago, Rolta said:

Nah, we need to commemorate WW2 every single day as it's the event when English history began. England didn't exist before then. You're not English unless you funnel your thinking through a nostalgic, black and white portal where all thought is accompanied with phrases like, 'blitz spirit' and 'we wouldn't have our freedom now'.

(Nothing that I said disrespects those who gave their lives in WW2. It's a comment on a trope of modern English thinking by some people.)

I'll be honest and say I don't really agree with the sentiment in that post . .. In a thread about ignorance , tolerance and  removing  stereotyping , it seems wrong to then stereotype the English

This country is a multi cultural society and lots of people actively  embrace things like Diwali  , Eid , Notting Hill , Chinese new year , people are up for any sort of celebration really  .... yet wave a St George flag or object to a statue of one of its former  PM's being vandalised  and its some sort of desire to relive WW2  ? 

I get the points being made  and I agree  I'm seeing a lot of ignorant stuff like "where is Lee Rigbys statue" and "white lives matter"  , but i think that stems from a knee jerk reaction to the protests and the vandalism that went with it  ... I genuinely believe most people aren't racist, they are just people reacting to what they see as a perceived injustice  ... "How dare they vandalise Churchill  ".  Wrongly , It turned some people off the BLM cause ,  but i don't think that equates that they want to deport all black people or bring back slavery  ... The Coulston statue toppling thing pissed me off a bit  , I still don't think it was right  , it should have been removed a different way  ..but , I do at least understand why it was toppled and have kinda drawn a line under it , rather than opting for Social media outrage at everything a black man has done and got away with ..... unfortunately ,  not everyone wants to look at it  rationally , people aren't always rational  ... but every" the English are basically ****"  comments entrenches those people further imo 

 

Edited June 18, 2020 by tonyh29

[HanoiVillan]

13 minutes ago, Davkaus said:

I think it was an interesting decision to endorse BLM rather than using the existing "Kick It Out" campaign, which is comparatively uncontroversial, though I guess you could say that's because it's less effective.

I struggle with BLM because there's an awful lot of the moment that's nothing to do with racism and all about an unrelated political agenda. The message "black lives matter" being so closely entangled with a fairly radical anti-capitalist movement is quite problematic in that criticism of Black Lives Matter as an organisation always seems to get taken as criticism of the message.

I think there's two things on that; firstly, I don't think they are 'unrelated', in the sense that the distribution of goods under capitalism is itself a large source of racial inequality (probably the single largest source). If I am hiring for a company, naturally I will hire people qualified for a position. It isn't on me to consider whether certain racial groups are highly unlikely to be represented in the set 'people who have qualification X' because the qualification costs a lot of money or takes a long time without earning to attain or requires an unpaid internship or whatever else. Yet it's easy to see from just this one example that the normal operation of 'capitalism' can and will perpetuate racial inequality, without anyone at any stage in the process needing to have animus towards different racial groups.

However, the second issue is that 'Black Lives Matter' is, in reality, as much a diffuse movement as it is an organisation. Nobody is a member, and different people with have different levels of support or buy-in. I don't think a football club taking a knee needs to be considered anything more than a fairly meaningless gesture of solidarity; you don't need to be concerned that Aston Villa Football Club support the overthrow of capitalism.