Carney Chukwuemeka

[TRO]

1 hour ago, villa4europe said:

Unfair on him

Maybe because he's from down the road or maybe because no one watched them lot down the road but watching dortmund this year every time I've seen Bellingham he's proper class, as in best player in the world for his age class, before he's 21 he could be a £100m player

If chuks half as good as Bellingham he'll have a decent career

Jude was better than Carney, when he was at the Blues, never mind Dortmund.

Jude has contributed to his own development, hence the opportunities opening up for him.

The unfair bit comes in, with the assessments of Carney and his talent being over hyped....He seems unable to carry the burden.

He could go on to be a real star but the exponetial rise of Jude seems to have slowed for Carney, and for me he is looking like an ordinary academy player, not a prodigy, some have made him out to be.

Whether he picks that rate of development back up, is anyones guess....but from a distance, it seems to me ,he is blaming the club and not himself....hence his refusal to sign a contract....which equally is not helping him.

[WHY]

1 hour ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

Let's be honest though mate, one of the reasons people are " harsh " is a combo of the extreme hype + contract situation.

To be brutally honest, so far, they don't correlate at all as it stands.

I've seen more from our much less hyped young players so far.

People try to use the JJ comparison but I don't even see that yet.

When JJ came in, he never looked out of place, even though he wasn't standing out or doing anything special. He did have a few poor games in between, but I definitely saw the potential.

Yesterday, he looked a bit lost IMO. ( Not for the first time )

Anyway, Chuk is only 18, but a compromise needs to be met.

If he thinks he goes to clubs like Dortmund, and the others rumoured, and gets consistent first team minutes right now, he's been terribly advised.

I don’t get the Ramsey comparison either. For a start with Ramsey nobody had really heard of Ramsey and like you I could see his potential, even when he didn’t play particularly well you could see he had something about him. Personally also think he looked more ready to make the step. 
 

Problem with Chuck he has been massively over hyped by fans and a few inside the club. When you have the CEO saying he’s the best 16 year old in the country agents/ the player himself latches on to it, hence why he’s probably after a decent contract. Hopefully Purslow isn’t so naive in the future but kind of get the impression he will be, the guy seems to like the limelight. 

Edited May 20, 2022 by WHY

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

57 minutes ago, useless said:

You make my point for me, people haven't got a clue what's going on with his contract sitution yet still accuse him of this and that,  as if he they know what he's thinking, giving him a bad name with no evidence whatsoever, there's nothing to suggest that he thinks he's too good for a place on the bench, or to go out on loan, or that he needs a reality check, or any of the others things people have been coming out with.

Also there's no 'extreme hype' and if there is that's not his fault, unless people are expecting him to come into the first team and look like Maradonna he's doing fine.

Not sure which of our other 'much less hyped' youngsters have shown more, only one I can think of is Ramsey and he's more than two years older.

Ok forget his contract situation, I just don't think he's looked ready for the first team so far, full stop.

I'm not just going based off yesterdays game either.

I think Iroegbunam for example looks more ready. ( Does absolutely nothing extra ordinary, but doesn't look out of place at all )

No one at all expects him to " Look like Maradona ". 

Come on mate, there has definitely been hype.

Edited May 20, 2022 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[useless]

People need to forget about Bellingham when it comes to judging Chukwuemeka, if academy players are expected to look as good as Bellingham when coming through or anywhere near as good as him, then we and every other academy in the country would be in big trouble and no academy players would make the grade.

Also if you were to put a an actual 'ordinary academy player' in the first team you would soon see how much they'd struggle and how good Chukwuemeka looks in comparision.

He's been perfectly fine in his barely more than three games worth of Premier League football, got his assist against Norwich, played his part in the equalizer against Man Utd, played well against Liverpool, nearly scored against Man City, he wasn't even that bad last night, was caught out a few times but it was only his second start and he was playing out of position and playing as part of the front three was made even more difficult last night because of how deep Buendia was dropping, Watkins was also left isolated.

 

[useless]

There hasn't been "extreme hype", the hype he's had is deserved, he's without a shadow of doubt one of the best academy players in the country, I can guarantee if he was to leave us there would be a queue of clubs trying to sign him, and not just any clubs, there would be 'bigger' clubs than us in for him. But that doesn't mean to say he has to come into our first team and look like world beater straight way, I think people don't realize that to look as good as he has done overall is a big achievement and a sign of encouragement as he's only going to get better and better.

 

[foreveryoung]

15 minutes ago, useless said:

People need to forget about Bellingham when it comes to judging Chukwuemeka, if academy players are expected to look as good as Bellingham when coming through or anywhere near as good as him, then we and every other academy in the country would be in big trouble and no academy players would make the grade.

Also if you were to put a an actual 'ordinary academy player' in the first team you would soon see how much they'd struggle and how good Chukwuemeka looks in comparision.

He's been perfectly fine in his barely more than three games worth of Premier League football, got his assist against Norwich, played his part in the equalizer against Man Utd, played well against Liverpool, nearly scored against Man City, he wasn't even that bad last night, was caught out a few times but it was only his second start and he was playing out of position and playing as part of the front three was made even more difficult last night because of how deep Buendia was dropping, Watkins was also left isolated.

 

It looked like work rate to me though, more than quality. I expect 100% every game out of our academy players and so would Gerrard.

[Adam2003]

25 minutes ago, useless said:

People need to forget about Bellingham when it comes to judging Chukwuemeka, if academy players are expected to look as good as Bellingham when coming through or anywhere near as good as him, then we and every other academy in the country would be in big trouble and no academy players would make the grade.

Also if you were to put a an actual 'ordinary academy player' in the first team you would soon see how much they'd struggle and how good Chukwuemeka looks in comparision.

He's been perfectly fine in his barely more than three games worth of Premier League football, got his assist against Norwich, played his part in the equalizer against Man Utd, played well against Liverpool, nearly scored against Man City, he wasn't even that bad last night, was caught out a few times but it was only his second start and he was playing out of position and playing as part of the front three was made even more difficult last night because of how deep Buendia was dropping, Watkins was also left isolated.

 

Yeah agreed. All he has to do right now is look “ok” and that puts him two years ahead of Ramsey. Still no guarantees of course but just looking ok is great at 18.

[villa4europe]

21 minutes ago, foreveryoung said:

It looked like work rate to me though, more than quality. I expect 100% every game out of our academy players and so would Gerrard.

But would you then say mcginn works harder than coutinho? Or just has a style that makes it look like he does? Mcginns blowing out of his ass after 10 mins, does that mean he's worked harder than anyone else or its just his physique? 

This idea of him being lazy and strolling around the pitch will be a stick to beat him with for years, it'll be the fall back position used to criticise him all the time 

He is putting a shift in, his body language just makes it look like he's not 

[Vive_La_Villa]

He’s not lazy. He just lacks power and intensity. But he’s 18, he’s still developing, he can work on these areas. He’s got a lot of talent and will be a top player one day. These minutes will do him good.

[Vive_La_Villa]

56 minutes ago, useless said:

People need to forget about Bellingham when it comes to judging Chukwuemeka, if academy players are expected to look as good as Bellingham when coming through or anywhere near as good as him, then we and every other academy in the country would be in big trouble and no academy players would make the grade.

Also if you were to put a an actual 'ordinary academy player' in the first team you would soon see how much they'd struggle and how good Chukwuemeka looks in comparision.

He's been perfectly fine in his barely more than three games worth of Premier League football, got his assist against Norwich, played his part in the equalizer against Man Utd, played well against Liverpool, nearly scored against Man City, he wasn't even that bad last night, was caught out a few times but it was only his second start and he was playing out of position and playing as part of the front three was made even more difficult last night because of how deep Buendia was dropping, Watkins was also left isolated.

 

I think the problem is fans expect a youngster to improve us whereas that’s just not realistic. However they need minutes to grow and improve so they can eventually improve us. Ramsey being the perfect example. 
 

It’s a tough balance for managers.

[Villatillidie95]

16 hours ago, Zatman said:

He is the youngest of them all. He is 20 months younger than Archer who this time last year was probably about to be released

thats cool, but i think that there is fundamentally a mismatch between what the player wants and what is best for the club at this current time. Unfortunately if he wants to be a regular starter this season then that is looking to be unfeasible with our ambitions (based on what we have seen this season) and so he should be loaned out, if happy, or moved on if not. Maybe he will tear it up in pre season and deserve to start, but he does look extremely raw at this time, and that is not surprising given his age. Im sure he is very talented and would warrant regular starts in the team at some point but that time is not now imo, gerrard seems to think the same.

[Villa_Vids]

He is very young, it is very important to remember that. It was a solid game from him, nothing more or less.

[TRO]

5 hours ago, est1874 said:

Let's be honest, if he thinks he's hot shit and wants to leave, on the basis of what we've seen on pitch recently I'd sooner let him go than bend over backwards to keep him. He may be talented but we have other kids who would be glad of the opportunity he's been given with the first team, not least of all JJ's younger brothers, Tim Iroeg, JPB, Raikhy, Barry, Brad Young, even Carney's brother (if he can be called a kid).

Reality will soon strike home that we don't have the space to blood them all at the same time, and for me, any of the above could end up having successful careers, so if Carney's still refusing to sign the deal then I'd honestly be opening the front door for him at this point.

As we progress, the business of blooding youth players is going to get tougher......These kids are going to have to make a real impact on loan, not just tread water, if they want to break in to our first team.

I get the optimism that some are afforded, but reality soon kicks in.....We all want them to do well, thats a given.....but there is little benevolence in this league, its hugely competitive.

Carney for me hasn't done enough, when given opportunities, to be holding big football clubs to ransom.....I think it could all back fire on him.

 

[TRO]

7 hours ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

I think the problem is fans expect a youngster to improve us whereas that’s just not realistic. However they need minutes to grow and improve so they can eventually improve us. Ramsey being the perfect example. 
 

It’s a tough balance for managers.

Yes it is......and its their jobs on the line.

I try to look back at what other players of a similar age were like when they made their debuts.....and irrespective of their position, what impact they made, is what I try to evaluate.

• Gareth Barry
• Sid Cowans
• Gary Shaw
• Brian Little
• Ugo Ehiogu
• Jack Grealish
• Mark Walters
• Tony Daley

Edited May 21, 2022 by TRO

[Vancvillan]

46 minutes ago, TRO said:

Yes it is......and its their jobs on the line.

I try to look back at what other players of a similar age were like when they made their debuts.....and irrespective of their position, what impact they made, is what I try to evaluate.

• Gareth Barry
• Sid Cowans
• Gary Shaw
• Brian Little
• Ugo Ehiogu
• Jack Grealish

When Jack was the age that that Carney is now he hadn't even made is debut for Villa.  The following season plenty were saying he was still learning and needed to add to the defensive side of his game.

Welcome to the goldfish bowl...

[Steero113]

16 minutes ago, Vancvillan said:

When Jack was the age that that Carney is now he hadn't even made is debut for Villa.  The following season plenty were saying he was still learning and needed to add to the defensive side of his game.

Welcome to the goldfish bowl...

Sid Cowans is the best example he gives when compared to Carney. 

Won the League Cup aged 17 with Villa after winning the FA Youth Cup the season before. He set a massive standard at Villa and went on to the very top. 

The others on that list (aside from possibly Barry) had nothing like the path that Carney is looking at taking. Certainly not Jack who was at least 18 months older before he had really done anything in the first team. 

Edited May 20, 2022 by Steero113

[TRO]

11 minutes ago, Steero113 said:

Sid Cowans is the best example he gives when compared to Carney. 

Won the League Cup aged 17 with Villa after winning the FA Youth Cup the season before. He set a massive standard at Villa and went on to the very top. 

The others on that list (aside from possibly Barry) had nothing like the path that Carney is looking at taking. Certainly not Jack who was at least 18 months older before he had really done anything in the first team. 

All the more reason why he should be patient.

[Keyblade]

If we had an 18 year old who could wow us with his 2nd or so senior start, he simply wouldn't be at our club. 

[PaulC]

1 hour ago, Vancvillan said:

When Jack was the age that that Carney is now he hadn't even made is debut for Villa.  The following season plenty were saying he was still learning and needed to add to the defensive side of his game.

Welcome to the goldfish bowl...

Wasnt Grealish on loan at Notts County at that age? This is a wasted season for Carney. Hes not good enough to be in our first team yet and would have been better served learning his trade on loan like Archer, Barry etc. Stop worrying about cintracts and focus on playing football. 

[beachboys1]

cant see the big fuss about him