Mazrim Posted February 27, 2020 Share Posted February 27, 2020 Just now, DCJonah said: What's to debate? Its such a hypothetical situation based on no real evidence. It's not like we're talking about whether hourihane should play, where there are lots of things we can base it on. Everyone is in agreement that if he is ready then he should play. There is nothing to do but trust the club on this one. There was another debate, which could have its own thread in fairness, but as Barry is arguably or potentially our best or most high profile youth player, it's on his thread. That debate was, if Dean Smith was to make a point of putting a youth player in instead of an established first teamer who is under performing (naming nobody specifically but there are several choices) is it a good idea? I think its an interesting distraction as we wait to get hammered by Man City on Sunday. I think a few players need a kick up the arse and this is just one way of doing it. It might be wrong, hence debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdman Posted February 27, 2020 Share Posted February 27, 2020 40 minutes ago, Mazrim said: There was another debate, which could have its own thread in fairness, but as Barry is arguably or potentially our best or most high profile youth player, it's on his thread. That debate was, if Dean Smith was to make a point of putting a youth player in instead of an established first teamer who is under performing (naming nobody specifically but there are several choices) is it a good idea? I think its an interesting distraction as we wait to get hammered by Man City on Sunday. I think a few players need a kick up the arse and this is just one way of doing it. It might be wrong, hence debate. I wouldnt agree with starting him because he could be shell-shocked up against Man City who move the ball around so well. However should have him on the bench ASAP in case we're losing by a couple and we can throw caution to the wind and give him some valuable experience Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mazrim Posted February 27, 2020 Share Posted February 27, 2020 8 minutes ago, birdman said: I wouldnt agree with starting him because he could be shell-shocked up against Man City who move the ball around so well. However should have him on the bench ASAP in case we're losing by a couple and we can throw caution to the wind and give him some valuable experience Yeah exactly. That's the only feasible way you could see it happening. Samatta doesn't deserve dropping yet, but Barry can also play wide so you take off a wide player late on perhaps... ...and Barry scores the winner after we keep it tight at 5-5 for 3 minutes. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post OutByEaster? Posted February 27, 2020 Moderator Popular Post Share Posted February 27, 2020 I guess there are three things that will define his readiness to progress: The technical - is he good enough? Now given he is where he is and his history at Albion, his move to Barca, his start here and his performances at age level with the England team, I'm going to put this one down as a given. I'm assuming he's technically good enough based on the evidence shown in his career to date - as an age level player, he's definitely got the talent to be a player. The physical - most of those players that have come through into first team football at a very young age have been physically incredible in one regard or other - the pace of Gabby Agbonlahor or Michael Owen, the strength of Wayne Rooney - it's this that has given them the ability to fast track their progress - fast is fast no matter how old you are. I've yet to see enough of Louie Barry to know whether he's a player with a unique physical gift - whether he's particularly quick or strong or whatever - I hope to soon. If he's not, if he's just a very good athlete in a league of very good athletes, then it might take a little longer. The mental - and this one will be a complete mystery to anyone but the people inside our coaching set up and the players he plays alongside - is he mentally strong enough at sixteen to take the big groan from 40,000 people when he misplaces a pass, to take the insults from the away end, to take the verbal buffering from the opposition, to not be exhausted by the occasion, by the media, by the clamour around him, is he able at sixteen to have the degree of focus that allows him to keep doing what he's doing as a footballer in the full glare of the worlds biggest TV show? It's a very rare quality - Gareth Barry's calmness, James Milner's level headed determination - to be sixteen and able to cope with that is extraordinary. There are a lot of risks in there and pushing him forward too soon could be the difference between a very good career and years bobbling around the lower leagues thinking of what could have been. If we give him a modern contemporary - Jack Grealish was 18 years and 4 months old when he made his debut on loan at Notts County - that's 20 months older than Louie is now - that's the equivalent of Barry going out on loan and making his debut in the second half of the season after next; that's normal. He's a very, very young player - if he were to appear in a league game before the end of the season, he'd be our youngest ever in the Premier league - the current holder of that honour is recovering from the pressure of it with Derby County U23's. For me, there's too much we can't know on this one and we have to trust the coaching staff - when he's ready, he'll appear - I don't think the clamour does him any favours. 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMelvillan Posted February 27, 2020 Share Posted February 27, 2020 Hi wiki info will look great in the future when it states that his first professional competitive appearance was a 6-0 humping in a cup final Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel Posted February 27, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted February 27, 2020 I'm all for giving a go to anyone who is ready, regardless of age, but we have to be careful of what we are looking for here! Is this debut with the idea that he will somehow affect the result? If so its highly doubtful, one player (no matter how good he is) will give us much more chance against the resources our opponents have. We will still be banking on the same parameters to win. Or is it for his development? If so surely it's best to give him more of a chance and do it in a slightly less profile game. No way he plays sunday, and neither should he imo! His next step should be a 6 month loan to a top championship club so he can develop at his own pace! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Mazrim Posted February 27, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted February 27, 2020 21 minutes ago, TheMelvillan said: Hi wiki info will look great in the future when it states that his first professional competitive appearance was a 6-0 humping in a cup final I think Man City will score to be honest. 7 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMelvillan Posted February 27, 2020 Share Posted February 27, 2020 1 hour ago, Mazrim said: I think Man City will score to be honest. pfft. pessimist 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
It's Your Round Posted February 27, 2020 Share Posted February 27, 2020 2 hours ago, OutByEaster? said: I guess there are three things that will define his readiness to progress: The technical - is he good enough? Now given he is where he is and his history at Albion, his move to Barca, his start here and his performances at age level with the England team, I'm going to put this one down as a given. I'm assuming he's technically good enough based on the evidence shown in his career to date - as an age level player, he's definitely got the talent to be a player. The physical - most of those players that have come through into first team football at a very young age have been physically incredible in one regard or other - the pace of Gabby Agbonlahor or Michael Owen, the strength of Wayne Rooney - it's this that has given them the ability to fast track their progress - fast is fast no matter how old you are. I've yet to see enough of Louie Barry to know whether he's a player with a unique physical gift - whether he's particularly quick or strong or whatever - I hope to soon. If he's not, if he's just a very good athlete in a league of very good athletes, then it might take a little longer. The mental - and this one will be a complete mystery to anyone but the people inside our coaching set up and the players he plays alongside - is he mentally strong enough at sixteen to take the big groan from 40,000 people when he misplaces a pass, to take the insults from the away end, to take the verbal buffering from the opposition, to not be exhausted by the occasion, by the media, by the clamour around him, is he able at sixteen to have the degree of focus that allows him to keep doing what he's doing as a footballer in the full glare of the worlds biggest TV show? It's a very rare quality - Gareth Barry's calmness, James Milner's level headed determination - to be sixteen and able to cope with that is extraordinary. There are a lot of risks in there and pushing him forward too soon could be the difference between a very good career and years bobbling around the lower leagues thinking of what could have been. If we give him a modern contemporary - Jack Grealish was 18 years and 4 months old when he made his debut on loan at Notts County - that's 20 months older than Louie is now - that's the equivalent of Barry going out on loan and making his debut in the second half of the season after next; that's normal. He's a very, very young player - if he were to appear in a league game before the end of the season, he'd be our youngest ever in the Premier league - the current holder of that honour is recovering from the pressure of it with Derby County U23's. For me, there's too much we can't know on this one and we have to trust the coaching staff - when he's ready, he'll appear - I don't think the clamour does him any favours. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mazrim Posted February 27, 2020 Share Posted February 27, 2020 How old was Gareth Barry when he made his debut, 17? Louie is only 6 months away from that. Again, what clamour? A few people speculating on when we might see him is not a clamour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeyp102 Posted February 27, 2020 Share Posted February 27, 2020 (edited) The Rooney situation was entirely different. When he started, social media was very limited, yet almost every football fan knew about him, he was that good and that talked about. Let’s be honest, before Louie Barry signed, the majority of us had not heard of him. Edited February 27, 2020 by mikeyp102 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elton Posted February 27, 2020 Share Posted February 27, 2020 I’ve no idea if he will be anywhere near the squad and I guess he won’t be. But if he is, then I’ll be delighted, as it will mean that Smith believes he is good enough on merit and that will confirm we have a genuine prospect. There is no way Smith is picking anyone in a major cup final to make up the numbers or send a message. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-R Posted February 28, 2020 Share Posted February 28, 2020 (edited) 14 hours ago, Mazrim said: There was another debate, which could have its own thread in fairness, but as Barry is arguably or potentially our best or most high profile youth player, it's on his thread. That debate was, if Dean Smith was to make a point of putting a youth player in instead of an established first teamer who is under performing (naming nobody specifically but there are several choices) is it a good idea? I think its an interesting distraction as we wait to get hammered by Man City on Sunday. I think a few players need a kick up the arse and this is just one way of doing it. It might be wrong, hence debate. I think it's more than right to shake up this squad, if we have players in our first team not pulling there weight, fulfilling there ability or doing a Ghazi and getting out of playing, then by all means bring in the youths and replace anyone and make an example of them. I don't see how first eleven players should be excluded from being replaced if they are not bringing the goods, they get paid enough to pull everything out of there arsenal. Look at Vasilev and how he came on abit ago, the lad was impressive, more impressive than some of the players who should be running the show. That Youth showed us all that he wanted it and he looked like he was willing to give both his nuts to achieve first team status. Hes not been seen in the main squad since which is disgusting because he showed more heart, guts and determination than ive seen from Ghazi, Trezeguet, Jota, Taylor all season. For whatever reason we brought Vasilev in because we was short in numbers, then as soon as we bring some players In and some come back from injury we just send him back sown the pecking order and it shouldn't be like that. Vasilev should be playing or at least be given a seat on the subs bench and we should be making use of these Youths or we won't see another break through for a very long time. We could of probably saved a whole bunch of money incorporating some of our Youths into the first team than going and buying some of the players we did. The only players that look worth the buy since summer are Mings, Target. The jury is still out on alot of others because they should of made things happen and have not. Other players are having to do extra work, no wonder positions and certain players are extra stressed on the field, they are having to pick the slack up. Samatta at the moment is the only one who maybe gets a pass. So yeah bring the Youth on in if that's what it's going to take to find a team that can win games. We have to find a way of winning even if it's going to cost us some of the players we signed in summer and January. Edited February 28, 2020 by Dave-R 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigJim Posted February 28, 2020 Share Posted February 28, 2020 I would agree about Vassilev and would certainly have him at least on the bench on Sunday. The time is probably not right yet for Barry but it wouldn't surprise me if Smith has toyed with the idea of playing both of them - both as a surprise factor to unsettle the opposition (dream on!) and to provide some sort of an excuse for the inevitable thumping. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deeps Posted February 29, 2020 Share Posted February 29, 2020 Looks like he’s in London tonight. His barber put a story of him cutting his hair and just before a video driving by Wembley. Looked like a hotel room too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
screwdriver Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 9 hours ago, deeps said: Looks like he’s in London tonight. His barber put a story of him cutting his hair and just before a video driving by Wembley. Looked like a hotel room too. probably just a tinder date. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zab6359 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 10 hours ago, deeps said: Looks like he’s in London tonight. His barber put a story of him cutting his hair and just before a video driving by Wembley. Looked like a hotel room too. I thought his mum cut his hair? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveAV1 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 On 27/02/2020 at 12:14, TheMelvillan said: Hi wiki info will look great in the future when it states that his first professional competitive appearance was a 6-0 humping in a cup final I admire your confidence, but I can’t see us beating Man City 6-0. Perhaps 3 or 4-0 if we’re really on our game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveAV1 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 41 minutes ago, screwdriver said: probably just a tinder date. You know about this sort of thing then....? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheltenham_villa Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 Is he training with the first team yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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