villalad21 Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 (edited) 13 minutes ago, BOF said: There was much more going on with Wesley's transfer and season than just what was going on on the pitch too though. Is he a better striker than Watkins? Probably not. Will he be better than he was last season? Absolutely 100% yes. I think we'll see a massive improvement from Wesley. Everything is in his favour this season. He is more settled. His idea of what is expected of him is better. We are a better team. He will have less pressure, probably because he'll be a sub, but either way that will help him play his game without the entire goalscoring weight of an entire club on his shoulders. He's younger than Watkins remember and he's a long way from home. I think we'll have an asset in him and I look forward to seeing him back on the pitch. That's a big claim there for a player who's been out for almost year. I don't think so. He'll need a few months of regular game time just to get up to speed and get match fit. Which again, he won't get regular game time. This is why i think he is finished at Villa. Just like Heaton. They got unfortuanate long term injuries. We replaced them with better players. They are better off going elsewhere where they will get regular game time. Edited November 18, 2020 by villalad21 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 We're a better team that is attacking with more purpose, he'll be back in gently and relatively pressure free That alone will result in him looking a better player 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted November 18, 2020 Moderator Share Posted November 18, 2020 8 minutes ago, villalad21 said: This is why i think he is finished at Villa. Just like Heaton. They got unfortuanate long term injuries. We replaced them with better players. They are better off going elsewhere where they will get regular game time. The difference is Wesley is 23 and Heaton is 34. So I agree that unfortunately for Heaton it probably is curtains at Villa. But I don't believe it is the case for Wesley. I believe Wesley still has plenty of growing as a player and can do that here. If we buy above him and push him out then good for us. It means we're progressing as a club. But I'd be surprised if we don't see him play a fairly decent role for us again, which yes probably does involve second fiddle to Olly. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 And in related news. Quote Wesley has shared on Instagram that he is now ‘training with the ball’ as the Aston Villa striker works his way back from a long-term injury. When the Brazilian last played, Villa were still trying to find their feet, a lack of inexperience within the squad was showing and there was too much emphasis on players like Wesley despite it being his first season in a top European league. But now Villa are shining bright and it will allow Wesley to ease his way back into the fold and show the same improvements the likes of Douglas Luiz and Ezri Konsa have showed since the restart. Added with Wesley, it also seems that goalkeeper Tom Heaton, who also suffered a season-ending injury at Turf Moor, is on his way back, but he seems closer to a return than his attacking teammate. https://www.hitc.com/en-gb/2020/11/18/i-see-you-shining-wesley-issues-key-injury-update-aston-villa-man-responds/ Video in link. I honestly don't see him playing much this season. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 3 minutes ago, BOF said: The difference is Wesley is 23 and Heaton is 34. So I agree that unfortunately for Heaton it probably is curtains at Villa. But I don't believe it is the case for Wesley. I believe Wesley still has plenty of growing as a player and can do that here. If we buy above him and push him out then good for us. It means we're progressing as a club. But I'd be surprised if we don't see him play a fairly decent part for us again. And at 23, regular gametime is crucial for him. Especially after a long term injury to get up to speed and developing. He won't get that here. I can't find any injury history of Ollie Watkins so the chances of him being out is fairly low. Wesley did a job for us last season but we've now outgrown him imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted November 18, 2020 Moderator Share Posted November 18, 2020 1 minute ago, villalad21 said: And at 23, regular gametime is crucial for him. Especially after a long term injury to get up to speed and developing. He won't get that here. I can't find any injury history of Ollie Watkins so the chances of him being out is fairly low. Wesley did a job for us last season but we've now outgrown him imo. Yeah you might be right and you might not. I'm just not writing him off is all, and I can see reasons as to why he might succeed and why he might not. If he goes, he goes. If he stays I think we have an asset 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 you can also rotate in and give minutes to a striker, you dont do that with a keeper if wes needs 10 minutes of PL football a week whilst also playing for the U23s for 6 weeks to get up to speed then thats not impossible, we can make that work, especially with christmas coming up 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhan_Zhuang Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 (edited) I'm hopeful on Wesley and I want him to succeed because he plays for Aston Villa, we should all feel the same way. I'm repeating here much of what others have said but he was a young guy coming into a new league with a team that was struggling. Pressure was immense for him and probably in hindsight that was wrong. However Wesley has a fresh chance to improve his game as part of his rehabilitation and gently get back involved with the matchday squad. I think he will prove to be invaluable if a game is close and we are dominating but can't quite get the equaliser or winner so we can bring him on to help Watkins. Or we are winning a match comfortably and we can rest Watkins and bring on Wesley for thirty minutes. Potentially (if he's fit) I see him getting minutes later on in the season. UTV Edited November 18, 2020 by Zhan_Zhuang 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turvontour Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 17 minutes ago, sne said: And in related news. https://www.hitc.com/en-gb/2020/11/18/i-see-you-shining-wesley-issues-key-injury-update-aston-villa-man-responds/ Video in link. I honestly don't see him playing much this season. Great to see that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MentalM Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 25 minutes ago, villalad21 said: I can't find any injury history of Ollie Watkins so the chances of him being out is fairly low. Wesley had meningitis and an 11 day ligament injury in 2016 before Ben Mee assaulted him. Not much injuries there either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MotoMkali Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 40 minutes ago, BOF said: Yeah you might be right and you might not. I'm just not writing him off is all, and I can see reasons as to why he might succeed and why he might not. If he goes, he goes. If he stays I think we have an asset Even if he is right we can always loan him out. A Portuguese or Spanish club might be interested in him and warm weather always helps with joint issues. But he has been a solid enough player for us. 5 in 21 isn't great but he was contributing to the team a lot more than what they are saying as well. Even if a lot of it is due to mcginn you don't go from scoring 2 a game to under one a game based on the form of one player (unless that player is jack) and mcginn was at around the same forn to finish the season and we still scored under 1 a game with him. Wesley was a huge part of our production. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomav84 Posted November 18, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted November 18, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, villalad21 said: This is why i think he is finished at Villa. Just like Heaton. They got unfortuanate long term injuries. We replaced them with better players. They are better off going elsewhere where they will get regular game time. you are entitled to your opinion as to the quality of players, as we all are. these debates are what make forums interesting. but it's stuff like this that i really dont get...we move wesley on we are a watkins injury away from davis being our ONLY striker. literally, what planet are you on that you think that moving wesley on is a sensible move? davis has scored 5 goals in 70 appearances for us....SEVENTY! and 3 of those are vs shit teams in the cups. wesley managed that in half a season when new to the league and country as i said previously, there is no question watkins is better than wesley, but he showed enough last season in patches to indicate he could cut it at this level. Edited November 18, 2020 by tomav84 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 8 hours ago, MentalM said: I am joining the people believing you are drunk. First I thought you were just talking out of your ass, but I doubt even that would amount to the shitfest you are throwing here... One thing that video shows is he's a good passer, which is something he has over Ollie. Also he absolutely bodied Keane and Mina at VP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hong0311 Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 On 18/11/2020 at 20:30, tomav84 said: you are entitled to your opinion as to the quality of players, as we all are. these debates are what make forums interesting. but it's stuff like this that i really dont get...we move wesley on we are a watkins injury away from davis being our ONLY striker. literally, what planet are you on that you think that moving wesley on is a sensible move? davis has scored 5 goals in 70 appearances for us....SEVENTY! and 3 of those are vs shit teams in the cups. wesley managed that in half a season when new to the league and country as i said previously, there is no question watkins is better than wesley, but he showed enough last season in patches to indicate he could cut it at this level. And for those who constantly says Davis is a young bright prospect, Wesley is just a year and a couple months older for goodness sake. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete101 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 Just want him to be stronger when he comes back , he was on the ground half the time he played 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MotoMkali Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 2 hours ago, pete101 said: Just want him to be stronger when he comes back , he was on the ground half the time he played That is unfair. He was consistently fouled and it just wasn't given. I think there are 2 reasons for it. 1) His size meant refs expected him to stay up even when his legs were hacked. 2) Jack was winning fouls for fun and they were bitter about having to give him the free kicks so they took it out on the rest of the team and gave fewer free kicks to them. Wesley struggled last season to find the right balance of strength. Either he absolutely **** dominated a defender and the ref gave a free kick to the player wesley made look like a toddler or he went down because he was fouled and the ref just let it pass. I remember in the first spurs game, he received a long ball to his feet and he was slightly in the air and Vertonghen just swept through both his legs and the ref didn't give anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 3 hours ago, MotoMkali said: That is unfair. It's not. He was on his arse a stupid amount of minutes every match. Softest big man I've ever seen. Goes without saying he needs to improve on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 7 hours ago, hong0311 said: And for those who constantly says Davis is a young bright prospect, Wesley is just a year and a couple months older for goodness sake. I still think Davis is the better player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheStagMan Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 (edited) I think Wesleybtook a while to adjust to the physicality of the game, as said above, he was often way too soft, but other times he goes in too hard (fnaaar fnaaar). He was looking closer to where he needed to be before Ben Mee turned up. I agree he needs game time, I would seriously contemplate loaning him out for a few months with a recall clause (is that still allowed?) in case Ollie gets injured. Offer him out for free with us covering his wages as a sweetener and have him back for the run in. Edited November 21, 2020 by TheStagMan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hong0311 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 3 hours ago, KenjiOgiwara said: I still think Davis is the better player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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