The now-enacted will of (some of) the people

[welnik]

9 hours ago, LondonLax said:

I've been a big Genesis fan ever since the release of their 1980 album, Duke. Before that, I didn't really understand any of their work, though on their last album of the 1970s, the concept-laden And Then There Were Three (a reference to band member Peter Gabriel, who left the group to start a lame solo career), I did enjoy the lovely "Follow you, Follow Me.' Otherwise all the albums before Duke seemed too artsy, too intellectual. It was Duke(Atlantic; 1980), where Phil Collins' presence became more apparent, and the music got more modern, the drum machine became more prevalent and the lyrics started getting less mystical and more specific (maybe because of Peter Gabriel's departure), and complex, ambiguous studies of loss became, instead, smashing first-rate pop songs that I gratefully embraced. The songs themselves seemed arranged more around Collins' drumming than Mike Rutherford's bass lines or Tony Banks' keyboard riffs. A classic example of this is "Misunderstanding," which not only was the group's first big hit of the eighties, but also seemed to st the tone for the rest of their albums as the decade progressed. The other standout on Duke is "Turn It On Again," which is about the negative effects of television. On the other hand, "Heathaze" is a song I just don't understand, while "Please Don't Ask" is a touching love song written to a separated wife who regains custody of the couple's child. Has the negative aspect of divorce ever been rendered in more intimate terms by a rock 'n' roll group? I don't think so. "Duke Travels" and "Dukes end" might mean something but since the lyrics aren't printed it's hard to tell what Collins is singing about, though there iscomplex, gorgeous piano work by Tony Banks on the latter track. The other bummer about Duke is "Alone Tonight," which is way too reminiscent of "Tonight Tonight Tonight," from the group's later masterpiece Invisible Touch and the only example, really, of where Collins has plagiarized himself.

Abacab (Atlantic; 1981) was released almost immediately after Duke and it benefits from a new producer, Hugh Padgham, who gives the band a more eights sound and though the songs seem fairly generic, there ares till great bits throughout the extended jam in the middle of the title track and the horns by some group called Earth, Wind, and Fire on "No Reply at All" are just two examples. Again, the songs reflect dark emotions and are about people who feel lost or are in conflict, but the production and sound are gleaming and upbeat (even if the title's aren't: "No Reply at All," "Keep It Dark," "Who Dunnit?" "Like It or Not"), Mike Rutherford's bass is obscured somewhat in the mix but otherwise the band sounds tight and is oce again propelled by Collins' truly amazing drumming. Even at its most despairing (like the song "Dodo," about extinction), Abacab musically is poppy and lighthearted.

My favorite track is "Man on the Corner," which is the only song credited solely to Collins, a moving ballad with a pretty synthesized melody plus a riveting drum machine in the background. Though it could easily com off any of Phil's solo albums, because the themes of loneliness, paranoia and alienation are overly familiar to Genesis it evokes the band's hopeful humanism. "Man on the Corner" profoundly equates a relationship with a solitary figure (a bum, perhaps a poor homeless person?), "that lonely man on the corner" who just stands around. "Who Dunnit?" profoundly expresses the themes of confusion against a funky groove, and what makes this song so exciting is that it ends with its narrator never finding anything out at all.

Hugh Padgham produced next an even less conceptual effort, simply called Genesis (Atlantic; 1983), and though it's a fine album a lot of it now seems to derivative for my tastes. "That's All" sounds like "Misunderstanding," "Taking It All Away" reminds me of "Throwing It All Away." It also seems less jazzy than its predecessors and more of an eighties pop album, more rock 'n' roll. Padgham does a brilliant job of producing, but the material is weaker than usual and you can sense the strain. It opens with the autobiographical "Mama," that's both strange and touching, though I couldn't tell if the singer was talking about his actual mother or to a girl he likes to call "Mama." "That's All' is lover's lament about being ignored and beaten down by a unreceptive partner; despite the despairing tone it's got a brilliant sing-along melody that makes the song less depressing than it probably needed to be. "That's All" is the best tune on the album, but Phil's voice is strongest on "House by the Sea," whose lyrics are, however, too stream-of-consciousness to make much sense. It might be about growing up and accepting adulthood but it's unclear; at any rate, its second instrumental part puts the song more in focus for me and Mike Banks gets to show off his virtuoustic guitar skills while Tom Rutherford washes the tracks over with dreamy synthesizers, and when Phil repeats the song's third verse at the end it can give you chills.

"Illegal Alien" is the most explicitly political song the group has yet recorded and their funniest. The subject is supposed to be sad--a wetback trying to get across the border into the United States--but the details are highly comical: the bottle of tequila the Mexican holds, the new pair of shoes he's waring (probably stolen); and it all seems totally accurate. Phil sings it funniest, and the rhyme of "fun" with "illegal alien" is inspired. "Just a Job to Do" is the album's funkiest song, with a killer bass line by Banks, and though it seems to be about a detective chasing a criminal, I think it could also be about a jealous lover tracking someone down. "Silver Rainbow" is the album's most lyrical song. The words are intense, complex and gorgeous. The album ends on a positive, upbeat note with "It's Gonna Get Better." Even if the lyrics seem a tiny bit generic to some, Phil's voice is so confidence (heavily influenced by Peter Gabriel, who never made an album this polished and heartfelt himself) that he makes us believe in glorious possibilities.

Invisible Touch (Atlantic; 1986) is the group's undisputed masterpiece. It's an epic meditation on intangibility, at the same time it deepens and enriches the meaning of the preceding three albums. It has a resonance that keeps coming back to the listener, and the music is so beautiful that it's almost impossible to shake off because every song makes some connection about the unknown or the spaces between people ("Invisible Touch") questioning authoritative control whether by domineering lovers or by government ("Land of Confusion") or by meaningless repetition ("Tonight Tonight Tonight"). All in all it ranks with the finest rock 'n' roll achievements of the decade and the mastermind behind this album, along of course with the brilliant ensemble playing of Banks, Collins and Rutherford, is Hugh Padgham, who has never found as clear and crisp modern a sound as this. You can practically hear every nuance of every instrument.

In terms of lyrical craftsmanship and sheer songwriting skills, this album hits a new peak of professionalism. Take the lyrics to "Land of Confusion," in which a singer addresses the problems of abusive political authority. This is laid down with a groove funkier and blacker than anything prince or Micheal Jackson--or any other black artist of recent years, for that matter--has come up with. Yet as danceable as the album is, it also has a stripped-down urgency that not even the overrated Bruce Springsteen can equal. As an observer of love's failings Collins beats out the Boss again and again, reaching new heights of emotional honesty on "In Too Deep"; yet it also showcases Collins' clowny, prankish, predictable side. It's the most moving pop song of the 1980s about monogamy and commitment. "Anything She Does" (which echoes the J. Geils Ban's "Centerfold" but is more sprinted and energetic) starts off side two and after that the album reaches its peak with "Domino," a two part song. Part one, "In the Heat of the Night," is full of sharp, finely drawn images of despair and it's paired with "The Last Domino," which fights it with an expression of hope. This song is extremely uplifting. The lyrics are as positive and affirmative as anything I've heard in rock.

Phil Collins' solo efforts seem to be more commercial and therefore more satisfying in a narrower way, especially No Jacket Required and songs like "In the Air Tonight" and "Against All Odds" (though that song was overshadowed by the masterful movie from which it came) and "Take Me Home" and Sussudio" (great, great song; a personal favorite) and his remake of "You Can't Hurry Love," which I'm not alone in thinking is better than the Supreme's original. But I also think that Phil Collins works better with the confines of the group than as a solo artist--and I stress the word artist. In facgt, It applies to all three of the guys, because Genesis is still the best, most exciting band to come out of England in the 1980s.

London, London, London..............

And then there were three was released after Steve Hackett left, and is a reference to there only being three in the band, that's all!

 

Go back and listen to Wind and Wuthering, an absolute masterpiece

[Risso]

9 hours ago, Mark Albrighton said:

I was going to post something very similar!

[ml1dch]

 

This sort of thing was definitely in those 2016 Vote Leave adverts.

[Stevo985]

14 hours ago, Risso said:

I was going to post something very similar!

I think

 

[LondonLax]

16 hours ago, welnik said:

London, London, London..............

And then there were three was released after Steve Hackett left, and is a reference to there only being three in the band, that's all!

 

Go back and listen to Wind and Wuthering, an absolute masterpiece

It's a chapter from a book by Bret Easton Ellis called 'American Psycho'.  The character likes to think he is super knowledgeable and sophisticated but is in reality just a boorish yuppie with only a superficial understanding of things like art and culture (or human emotion).  

[ml1dch]

On 13/12/2020 at 11:22, Davkaus said:

I honestly fear for next year, and don't think it'll take long for the big sections of the economy to come crumbling down.

We're not prepared at the border in any way - that test of French processes at the tunnel for 9 hours caused a 5 mile queue. It took hours to clear that queue once things restored to "normal", but that's not an option in January. Our haulage companies are ****. No two ways about it. Our manufacturers that rely on EU imports (pretty much all of them), are pretty ****, because getting things in to the country is either going to be significantly more expensive (air freight), or just slightly more expensive and a lot more unpredictable if they opt for road haulage. We'll pay a lot more even for that, due to the extra time, fuel and opportunity cost for lorries sitting in hours of traffic jams at the border. These changes along could be significant enough to send companies under that run at thin margins.

Question - what is the one thing in this situation that will screw things and (eventually) result in panic more than large queues of lorries not moving?

Answer- no lorries making an attempt to move anywhere.

 

[snowychap]

 

[villa4europe]

first one for me tomorrow, got to go to the local post office and pay the import duty for them to release a PlayStation game that i ordered before xmas but amazon have delivered late, £14 I've got to pay for a £40 game

the UK is cheaper for a lot of stuff so i do a fair bit of online shopping there, thats all going to come to a end now

i think with my mom sending over some xmas presents too and some jan sale shopping ive got another 3 packages which im going to have to pay for

[StefanAVFC]

Got a Villa shirt for my birthday in December. Was shipped sometime last month, still don't have it.

[Davkaus]

When does the Brexit dividend start paying out? 

[Wainy316]

Just now, StefanAVFC said:

Got a Villa shirt for my birthday in December. Was shipped sometime last month, still don't have it.

Well if it’s ordered direct from the club you’re still in the normal timeframe tbf.

[sidcow]

5 minutes ago, Davkaus said:

When does the Brexit dividend start paying out? 

Around 8 years time when we elect to rejoin the EU. 

[GarethRDR]

11 minutes ago, sidcow said:

Around 8 years time when we elect to rejoin the EU. 

I worry that ever rejoining is wishful thinking at this point.

[Xann]

1 hour ago, Davkaus said:

When does the Brexit dividend start paying out? 

Tory donors, disaster capitalists and tax swervers are rolling in it already.

The rest of us are getting...

 

 

[LondonLax]

The UK is not going to rejoin the EU anytime soon. 

I could see the UK joining the customs union again at some point though.

[darrenm]

2 minutes ago, LondonLax said:

The UK is not going to rejoin the EU anytime soon. 

I could see the UK joining the customs union again at some point though.

I'm not sure we easily can after signing any trade deals. I think trade deals which are incompatible with the EU, its internal market or the customs union would preclude us rejoining at any point in the future too.

[Genie]

1 minute ago, darrenm said:

I'm not sure we easily can after signing any trade deals. I think trade deals which are incompatible with the EU, its internal market or the customs union would preclude us rejoining at any point in the future too.

Have we done any?

If it’s on worse terms than what the EU have with that nation then it’s probably not a problem we need to worry about.

[darrenm]

Just now, Genie said:

Have we done any?

If it’s on worse terms than what the EU have with that nation then it’s probably not a problem we need to worry about.

Quite a few apparently.

Quote

Trade agreements that took effect from 1 January 2021
Agreements with the following countries and trading blocs took effect from 1 January 2021. Where the agreement has not yet been ratified, provisional application or bridging mechanisms have been put in place to ensure continuity of trade.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/uk-trade-agreements-with-non-eu-countries

 

[snowychap]

28 minutes ago, darrenm said:

Quite a few apparently.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/uk-trade-agreements-with-non-eu-countries

 

I think most of those (if not all) are roll-overs of the current EU agreements to which the UK was party (with one or two slight adjustments, e.g. with Japan).

Edit:

 

Edited January 12, 2021 by snowychap

[Enda]

1 hour ago, Genie said:

Have we done any?

If it’s on worse terms than what the EU have with that nation then it’s probably not a problem we need to worry about.

Au contraire (as we say in Europe).

If you sign deals on worse terms, it might mean you've surrendered on a few points the EU wouldn't stand for. I think a(nother) country leaving the UK will happen before Brentry.