Phumfeinz Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 I just don't think he's that good. Aside from one, maybe two decent matches I've not seen anything that warrants the hype he's gotten. I think a lot of it still persists as some form of desperation for us to have produced a quality homegrown player from our very own system, as well as it being maybe one positive in the awfulness we've suffered for the past number of years. A genuinely good player would be tearing up the Championship, and I don't subscribe to the "it's the players around him" stuff. A good player will shine regardless of what's around him. Albrighton was a much better player at that age (and I'm still sore we let him go). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 I've defended him and moaned plenty of times that we've stuck him out wide or in a shit team but yesterday we set up perfectly for him, 2 wingers stretched the game giving him space, gabby did a lot of running for him, midfield supported him...he should be sat feet up this morning 3 points in the bag with him MOTM with 3 assists, he was poor, the most frustrating thing about the counter and then the square ball gabby tap in was just how much time he had to make those passes and he got them wrong scary to think that if things had gone differently yesterday gabby could have scored a hat trick 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 3 hours ago, philgetaway said: For me he's not a number 10. Id have him out on the left. Get him settled into one position. He can focus on crossing and dribbling into the box, winning free kicks and pens. Also if he's in that same position, it will make it harder for teams to take turns fouling him. Most RBs will be sent off by the end. Some behind me in the Holte were giving him abuse yesterday, telling him to get up. There was a 10 minute period where whenever he got the ball they fouled him! What's he supposed to do? I'd get pissed off as well. He gets kicked off the park every week. I'm the opposite, he's not a wide man, same as kodjia and ayew, green and adomah showed yesterday what 2 proper wide men do, stretch the game create space in the middle, we're too narrow and unbalanced when Jack plays there agree about him being fouled, was getting very little sympathy from our own fans by me 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philgetaway Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 29 minutes ago, villa4europe said: I'm the opposite, he's not a wide man, same as kodjia and ayew, green and adomah showed yesterday what 2 proper wide men do, stretch the game create space in the middle, we're too narrow and unbalanced when Jack plays there agree about him being fouled, was getting very little sympathy from our own fans by me Maybe you're right. I just think the best I've seen of Jack is when he gets in behind defenders, as he's one of a few that can beat his man, and out left gives you that. At 10, and also when he's been played deeper, he beats a man but he's still yards from goal. i agree on Kodja and Ayew out wide, as their mindset is to look for a goal. Grealish will look to assist. I suppose my point was at this stage in his career, he's been asked to play wide left, in behind, and also deeper in midfield. He just needs a settled position so he can focus on his game. We're desperate for wide men so why not use him. Wide left has also been where he has played most of his football (and Notts County, Youth team etc). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
srsmithusa Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 5 hours ago, DCJonah said: Apart from creating a goal. I was commenting on his overall game over time. not one moment in one game. In a later post you clarified " He's not doing enough. I 100% agree. He should be doing a lot more at this level and he's not kept up his early season promise. For me, after a few signings he wouldn't be in the starting 11 until his performances pick up. So, you and I agree. He flits, he floats, he skips by people, he does very little of real impact. Not enough for either of us. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaCas Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 2 minutes ago, srsmithusa said: I was commenting on his overall game over time. not one moment in one game. In a later post you clarified " He's not doing enough. I 100% agree. He should be doing a lot more at this level and he's not kept up his early season promise. For me, after a few signings he wouldn't be in the starting 11 until his performances pick up. So, you and I agree. He flits, he floats, he skips by people, he does very little of real impact. Not enough for either of us. Good post. To be honest he hardly 'created' a goal - he clipped a hopeful ball forward and Flabby surprising did well to make something of it and then squared it to Adomah to score. Hardly 'creating' a goal. Doesnt score, doesn't defend, hardly creates. 90 first class appearances and you can count the good moments on the fingers of one hand. We're currently a mid-table championship team and he can't even command a place with us. Show pony with a daft look-at-me rolled down socks™ affectation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 3 minutes ago, VillaCas said: Good post. To be honest he hardly 'created' a goal - he clipped a hopeful ball forward and Flabby surprising did well to make something of it and then squared it to Adomah to score. Hardly 'creating' a goal. Doesnt score, doesn't defend, hardly creates. 90 first class appearances and you can count the good moments on the fingers of one hand. We're currently a mid-table championship team and he can't even command a place with us. Show pony with a daft look-at-me rolled down socks™ affectation Haha your description of the pass is laughably harsh. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 2 hours ago, VillaCas said: Good post. To be honest he hardly 'created' a goal - he clipped a hopeful ball forward and Flabby surprising did well to make something of it and then squared it to Adomah to score. Hardly 'creating' a goal. This is exactly wrong. Grealish played a pinpoint pass, which Gabby miscontrolled (hence him clattering into the goalkeeper rather than finishing off the chance standing up). 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted January 22, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted January 22, 2017 (edited) 5 hours ago, villa4europe said: agree about him being fouled, was getting very little sympathy from our own fans by me Problem is that he IS going to get fouled a lot and though it's patently unfair and wrong g he ISN'T going to get any protection from the refs in this league. So a) forget trying to draw fouls, try and find a way to avoid them and ride the challenges. And b. when the inevitable happens stop staying down wasting precious time and stop gesticulating to the ref about how unfair it all is. He will do nothing and you get into a negative state of mind. From the stands you can see this all going on in front of you and you just urge him to get up and get on with it, but he doesn't and starts to fade from the game so the opposition have done their job on him and won. He's best to pick himself up, make it look like they cannot affect him and turn their victory over him into defeat by dancing around them and causing havoc. But the mentality isn't there so it gets frustrating to watch. Edited January 22, 2017 by sidcow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmygreaves Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 You just get the feeling he's been blessed with incredible natural talent. He's so effortlessly comfortable with the ball at his feet.... it's always been easy for him. What I think seems to be missing is the desire to graft to make himself better. Extra training, working on his weaknesses, trying to improve. The polar opposite to a James Milner for example. You hope that the penny drops soon and he begins to realise his massive potential by being professional and working his arse off. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted January 22, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted January 22, 2017 Spoiler I think its harsh to judge any of our more creative players in a team that's been so unbalanced. Once we get some more quality in the middle and a RB it will give the room for Jack to be able to express himself in a way he is capable. He's being asked to play in a team that lacks any bite, confidence or creativity and he will never be able provide that part of the game for us when he knows losing the ball in this team means panic and more pressure on our goal. There's only Jedinack that's a ball winner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VILLAMARV Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 21 minutes ago, jimmygreaves said: You just get the feeling he's been blessed with incredible natural talent. He's so effortlessly comfortable with the ball at his feet.... it's always been easy for him. What I think seems to be missing is the desire to graft to make himself better. Extra training, working on his weaknesses, trying to improve. The polar opposite to a James Milner for example. You hope that the penny drops soon and he begins to realise his massive potential by being professional and working his arse off. you talking about me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaCas Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 (edited) 16 hours ago, HanoiVillan said: This is exactly wrong. Grealish played a pinpoint pass, which Gabby miscontrolled (hence him clattering into the goalkeeper rather than finishing off the chance) A pinpoint pass??? hardly! Nothing special for me at all - not credited by the main stats sites either. 90 first class games with roughly a goal every 20 and an assist less than once in ten. A peripheral figure at best who will get less and less game time as new recruits arrive Edited January 23, 2017 by VillaCas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 20 minutes ago, VillaCas said: A pinpoint pass??? hardly! Nothing special for me at all - not credited by the main stats sites either. 90 first class games with roughly a goal every 20 and an assist less than once in ten. A peripheral figure at best who will get less and less game time as new recruits arrive It's about as accurate a through ball as you can get - perfect weight on it too. Absolutely madness to call it "a hopeful ball forward". Please watch it again: 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PieFacE Posted January 23, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted January 23, 2017 I feel for Grealish really, every time he gets on the ball he's clearly being targeted to be fouled, and I sympathise with that. But he's either got to bulk up a bit or do more to avoid a challenge and keep the ball moving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparrow1988 Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 17 minutes ago, bobzy said: It's about as accurate a through ball as you can get - perfect weight on it too. Absolutely madness to call it "a hopeful ball forward". Please watch it again: Absolute madness. It was perfect. We really are a soft touch though. For the first goal Hugill should have been put on his arse or kicked or something to the effect of stopping him. It was very poor all round. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSV Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 5 minutes ago, PieFacE said: I feel for Grealish really, every time he gets on the ball he's clearly being targeted to be fouled, and I sympathise with that. But he's either got to bulk up a bit or do more to avoid a challenge and keep the ball moving. This. He doesnt pass.. players know this so they go full blooded on him. He needs to stay out of the starting line up if we are to win games. Massive liability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PieFacE Posted January 23, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted January 23, 2017 (edited) 1 minute ago, KSV said: This. He doesnt pass.. players know this so they go full blooded on him. He needs to stay out of the starting line up if we are to win games. Massive liability. I don't think he needs to stay out the starting line up or that he's a liability at all, he just needs to improve that side of his game. I'd rather he play in the hole than Bacuna or McCormack... Edited January 23, 2017 by PieFacE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 22 minutes ago, PieFacE said: I feel for Grealish really, every time he gets on the ball he's clearly being targeted to be fouled, and I sympathise with that. But he's either got to bulk up a bit or do more to avoid a challenge and keep the ball moving. Or he just keeps taking the fouls and winning free kicks? I don't think "he gets fouled" is something he needs to work on. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PieFacE Posted January 23, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted January 23, 2017 (edited) 1 minute ago, bobzy said: Or he just keeps taking the fouls and winning free kicks? I don't think "he gets fouled" is something he needs to work on. Which is fine when we're winning, but when we're trying to build a bit of momentum and move the ball about to try and create a goal scoring chance it's incredibly frustrating to keep having the play broken up. Let's face it, our set-pieces are a bit gash. Edited January 23, 2017 by PieFacE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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