Steve Bruce

[Zatman]

Just now, bobzy said:

So it's pretty much unavoidable, he should absolutely do it, but he's classless because of it?. However, when Frank Lampard does it, it's fine.

 

I think we're done

Lampard didnt leave in pre season and he gave Derby enough notice that a manager was appointed before he left

Terrible comparison 

[bobzy]

Just now, Zatman said:

Lampard didnt leave in pre season and he gave Derby enough notice that a manager was appointed before he left

Terrible comparison 

Fair enough - Sarri and Chelsea knew he was leaving in March so plenty of time for discussions to happen etc.  so probably can't be compared.

[villa4europe]

4 minutes ago, bobzy said:

So it's pretty much unavoidable, he should absolutely do it, but he's classless because of it?. However, when Frank Lampard does it, it's fine.

I think we're done

frank Lampard has not done the same thing!! 

the circumstances and timing of his appointment is different, what he did in his time there is different, you can argue what he has been offered as a new opportunity is different

2 managers quitting and joining bigger clubs doesn't mean that they both did it in the same manner

bruce will deservedly get criticism for what he has done to Wednesday, however that criticism shouldn't be enough to deter him from doing it - that's it done

[PieFacE]

 

Now this would be hilarious...

[LakotaDakota]

1 hour ago, Zatman said:

No its not. Championship starts in 2 and a half weeks. New manager has no chance to have a pre-season or to get his ideas across and as Bruce said himself many times you need a pre-season . Transfer window closes in 3 weeks as well

He has well and truly **** Wednesday 

13 minutes ago, Zatman said:

Lampard didnt leave in pre season and he gave Derby enough notice that a manager was appointed before he left

Terrible comparison 

Lampard left Derby 8 days ago, Not pre-season? They had already let players go & started making signings.

1 year into a 3 year contract and he told them he wanted to leave to go to chelsea

Edited July 16, 2019 by LakotaDakota

[Demitri_C]

2 hours ago, Stuartc445 said:

You say it makes no sense in a place where people are making him out to be the worst manager we've ever had, not a manager that got us to win 24 games in a season and lost a playoff final which again is used to beat him with even though since 1996 plenty of our managers have lost finals with better players than Bruce had.

^^^^ now that doesn't make sense but as I said keep this going as it's brilliant entertainment my lunch breaks would be dull without reading comedy like this

Alex where did anyone say he was worst we ever had?

[TheStagMan]

4 hours ago, bannedfromHandV said:

I'll reply once for a laugh, though I know it'll make zero difference.

 

If you cannot see the allure for a Geordie to have the chance to manage Newcastle United, whilst they are in the premier league (and he's not) - irrespective of all other aspects, then you and I operate on entirely different plains.

 

Hand on heart I think there are those who would genuinely find a negative angle on Bruce coming up with a cure for cancer and giving it out freely, there's just little to no basis for reasonable discussion.

Well, I do normally laugh at your posts, so thanks. 

I can understand him taking the job. Doesn't stop me from thinking that he is a dick for doing it. Why do I think he is a dick for doing it - mainly because he bangs on about the loyalty of players and fans, and displays none himself - how he portrays himself as Mr Nice guy when his actions show he is interested in Steve Bruce first and foremost - which is fine, but then don't peddle what he peddles. You and I do operate on different plains. I see through the bullshit. You clearly don't.

 

If Bruce came up with a cure for cancer I would recommend him for a Nobel prize, if, as is WAY more likely he shits on a football club who have treated him very well, I will call him out on it. If he is a poor manager of our football club, I will point that out too. When people then race to his defence, 6 months after he left our club a steaming mess - I will wonder what is wrong with them. 

 

Anyway in three months time he will likely have been sacked, and people will be on here saying he wasn't given a fair chance. Hey ho.....

Edited July 16, 2019 by TheStagMan

[MessiWillSignForVilla]

1 hour ago, bannedfromHandV said:

I'll reply once for a laugh, though I know it'll make zero difference.

 

If you cannot see the allure for a Geordie to have the chance to manage Newcastle United, whilst they are in the premier league (and he's not) - irrespective of all other aspects, then you and I operate on entirely different plains.

 

Hand on heart I think there are those who would genuinely find a negative angle on Bruce coming up with a cure for cancer and giving it out freely, there's just little to no basis for reasonable discussion.

At the minute, I think that is more reason why he wouldn't take the job. What self respecting Newcastle fan would take the job under Ashley? They absolutely hate him and many want nothing to do with the club until he leaves. For the Best Supporters In The Country"(tm), there's been 12,000 season tickets unsold after Rafa left, and for once it seems Newcastle fans are actually doing something about hating Ashley, rather than being content with just Shearer have a pop at him on MotD occasionally. So why would a Newcastle fan walk into this dumpster fire of a situation?

Personally, I think he recognises this may be his only shot at being their manager, as when Ashley finally sells, no new owner is going to even consider Bruce, so he's going to take his chance even though it seems destined to fail. Plus he has the advantage of being able to blame Ashley when things go tits up. And that's not a dig at Bruce, manager's more than likely think about their "exit strategy" at clubs the join and I think it's part of the reason Lampard took the Chelsea job, he can blame the transfer ban to minimise damage to his career if he's sacked early on.

I reckon it's less about being a Newcastle fan, and more about it being his best opportunity to manage them, as there's no way he'd want to work for Ashley if he's a Newcastle supporter.

[MessiWillSignForVilla]

44 minutes ago, LakotaDakota said:

Lampard left Derby 8 days ago, Not pre-season? They had already let players go & started making signings.

1 year into a 3 year contract and he told them he wanted to leave to go to chelsea

It was about 3 days in to pre-season and Derby knew and had enough time to prepare that they appointed Cocu the next day. Seems pretty different to me.

[Stevo985]

3 hours ago, TrentVilla said:

I agree on the first bit not so sure on the second.

Generally speaking I agree most Championship managers would happily leave their jobs to take a job in the Premier League, even more so if it was their boyhood club. I don't think anyone can really dispute that.

It is though when we move away from the hypothetical to the specifics of this situation where I think some doubt starts to creep in.

For instance, when Villa were talking with Brentford do you think Dean Smith would have taken the same action that Bruce has taken? Namely being given permission to speak and then quitting when the compensation wasn't agreed quick enough. Now neither of us can say either way with anything like any certainty but my belief is that he wouldn't have conducted himself as Bruce has done.

So for me there is a distinction to be drawn between the desire for the job and the actions in pursuit of it. I think to criticise Bruce for wanting the job is wrong but similarly I think his actions are wrong and entirely worthy of criticism.

I think this is even more true given the unusual circumstances around his appointment, I think he owed Sheff Wed a little more respect given that they were willing to go to such unusual lengths to appoint him.

So for me, yes a very high percentage of managers would want the Newcastle job in his position, an even higher percentage would want the job with it being 'their' club. I just think a lot of managers would have conducted themselves better than Bruce has done in this example and for me at least on a number of occasions throughout his managerial career.

What irritates me with Bruce is the way he portrays himself and the way he is portrayed by the media, I think it is an entirely false narrative not supported by events or his behaviour. I don't doubt he is good company, I'm sure he is extremely personable but I question his integrity, his honesty and I think he is utterly utterly deluded and self serving. Now plenty of people in the game are that way but I don't think they are given quite the same sugar coating by their pals in the press.

Some will argue Bruce can't be held responsible for the press but I'd argue he is very clever and deliberate in the way he cultivates an image and those relationships for his benefit. I don't expect everyone to share that view but it does seem to be quite commonly held by fans of a lot of his former clubs.

So I think your view expressed above is largely correct but I also think a lot of the criticism of him is equally valid.

Which essentially boils down to you don’t like him so you don’t like that he’s done this. 

Which others in this thread have also admitted to. Steve Bruce is a clearing in the woods therefore they think this is bad. 

 

Which was my point to be honest. 

[TrentVilla]

6 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

Which essentially boils down to you don’t like him so you don’t like that he’s done this. 

Which others in this thread have also admitted to. Steve Bruce is a clearing in the woods therefore they think this is bad. 

 

Which was my point to be honest. 

It doesn't but if that is how you want to read it fine. 

[Keyblade]

Like I said before, just look at the Wednesday and Derby fans' reactions to the departures of Bruce and Lampard respectively. If the situations were exactly the same, they'd have at least roughly similar reactions. 

[wilko154]

I can't believe this thread is still going! Can we just delete it and forget about Steve Bruce for a season?

[Demitri_C]

I love how the Wednesday fans are making fun of him with cabbage

[Stuartc445]

2 hours ago, Zatman said:

But we lost both games. One didn't nearly kill the club

Though no idea how losing to United is worse than losing to Fulham without us making an attack all game

It wasn't that game that nearly killed the club going by what has happened with Dr Tony getting promoted would have more than likely just delayed what happened as it's clear Dr Tony hasn't got the money he claimed he had.

Again it's scale we had a team in 2010 more than capable to beat United just like we had a team more than capable to beat Fulham in the playoff final. 

It's not as simple as 1 was United and 1 was Fulham you have to factor in the level of where we were competing at the time. In 2010 we were competing around Uniteds level and in 2018 we were competing around the level of Fulham so if you take that into consideration it's the same.

Edited July 16, 2019 by Stuartc445

[Keyblade]

I don't get this thread. Are you guys saying that Wednesday fans are wrong to be angry? It's almost like there's more to this story than simply a manager taking his dream job and moving from the Championship to the PL. He wasn't even the only one to do so this summer. Lampard did it. Potter did it. Yet there wasn't even close to an uproar in either case.

This isn't about Villa fans picking on Steve Bruce for no reason. Pretty much every football fan is in agreement that the way he went about his time at Wednesday was assholeish. I've seen United fans' take on it, Everton fans' take, Wednesday fans' of course as well as Newcastle fans'.  Literally only a section of Villa fans who are saying his hands are clean in this, it's the weirdest thing  

[bannedfromHandV]

1 hour ago, MessiWillSignForVilla said:

At the minute, I think that is more reason why he wouldn't take the job. What self respecting Newcastle fan would take the job under Ashley? They absolutely hate him and many want nothing to do with the club until he leaves. For the Best Supporters In The Country"(tm), there's been 12,000 season tickets unsold after Rafa left, and for once it seems Newcastle fans are actually doing something about hating Ashley, rather than being content with just Shearer have a pop at him on MotD occasionally. So why would a Newcastle fan walk into this dumpster fire of a situation?

Personally, I think he recognises this may be his only shot at being their manager, as when Ashley finally sells, no new owner is going to even consider Bruce, so he's going to take his chance even though it seems destined to fail. Plus he has the advantage of being able to blame Ashley when things go tits up. And that's not a dig at Bruce, manager's more than likely think about their "exit strategy" at clubs the join and I think it's part of the reason Lampard took the Chelsea job, he can blame the transfer ban to minimise damage to his career if he's sacked early on.

I reckon it's less about being a Newcastle fan, and more about it being his best opportunity to manage them, as there's no way he'd want to work for Ashley if he's a Newcastle supporter.

Villa could have Donald Trump as owner and Vladimir Putin as MD, I'd still jump at the chance to manage them.

And yes, let's all be real about this - SB is only getting this opportunity because of the state of things at Newcastle - I'm sure he'll know that too which is why he's jumping at the chance.

You have to take opportunities when they come, if I started a new job but then 3 months later my dream job comes calling then I'm all over it - as any one of us would be.

[TheStagMan]

27 minutes ago, bannedfromHandV said:

Villa could have Donald Trump as owner and Vladimir Putin as MD, I'd still jump at the chance to manage them.

And yes, let's all be real about this - SB is only getting this opportunity because of the state of things at Newcastle - I'm sure he'll know that too which is why he's jumping at the chance.

You have to take opportunities when they come, if I started a new job but then 3 months later my dream job comes calling then I'm all over it - as any one of us would be.

And I would still take you for the job over Steve Bruce!

[Stevo985]

1 hour ago, Keyblade said:

I don't get this thread. Are you guys saying that Wednesday fans are wrong to be angry? It's almost like there's more to this story than simply a manager taking his dream job and moving from the Championship to the PL. He wasn't even the only one to do so this summer. Lampard did it. Potter did it. Yet there wasn't even close to an uproar in either case.

This isn't about Villa fans picking on Steve Bruce for no reason. Pretty much every football fan is in agreement that the way he went about his time at Wednesday was assholeish. I've seen United fans' take on it, Everton fans' take, Wednesday fans' of course as well as Newcastle fans'.  Literally only a section of Villa fans who are saying his hands are clean in this, it's the weirdest thing  

Nope. Wednesday fans have a right to be angry. I’d be angry if our manager had just left in pre season. That’s being a football fan. 

But we’re not wednesday fans. And nobody is saying it’s a nice thing he’s done and his nose is totally clean. All people are saying is that any other manager would have done the same thing and he can’t really be blamed for taking a bigger job. I don’t know what other fans takes on it you’ve seen but any I’ve seen are mostly a shrug of the shoulders and why wouldn’t he go to Newcastle?

The point I’m making is that certain villa fans are reacting far more negatively to this than most because they hate Steve Bruce. It seems to be admitted by most in here that actually they don’t think he should have turned down the job, they’re just annoyed by how bruce is portrayed in the media. 

Which like I said basically boils down to “we don’t like him so we’re going to be harsher about these things”

which is fine. That’s their prerogative. But other posters have every right to point out that that’s what’s happening and how that in itself is pretty **** weird. 

[Stevo985]

1 hour ago, bannedfromHandV said:

 

You have to take opportunities when they come, if I started a new job but then 3 months later my dream job comes calling then I'm all over it - as any one of us would be.

This is the crux of it. Anyone would do the same thing. Which nobody seems to be disputing but everyone still seems to be hating Bruce for doing it.