bobzy Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 41 minutes ago, pas5898 said: Agreed. Their punishment should be points for each penalty, spread over the years they cheated or even a Ranger style expulsion to the National League. It's not just "oh they have loads of money", they've used financial doping to derail other teams. Grealish: our best player, captain, everything to sit on their bench. Phillips: Leeds best midfielder, should have stayed up with him. Ake: Bournemouths best defender to sit on the bench. Nunes: Wolves best remaining midfielder to sit on the bench. Kovacic: Chelseas best midfielder to sit on the bench. Now Paqueta: West Hams best player, who will ultimately be a squad player. It's just a different level of what most teams do, though. You can be angry about it... ...but then you also need to get angry about the relative purchasing power of Aston Villa. We've taken Sevilla's best defender, Chicago Fire's main striker, Adelaide United's goalkeeper and they're all just "squad". It's the financial nature of the Premier League. Man City have the finances to do it against a higher level of club, but all PL clubs are doing the same thing in varying degrees. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 1 hour ago, Pinebro said: PL won't touch them because they are a part of the big 6 PL is a real farce and is corrupt to the teeth I'm already quite close to "being done" with football - Man City receiving no punishment (or a purely financial one) would be the end for me. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa89 Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 47 minutes ago, pas5898 said: they've used financial doping to derail other teams. Grealish: our best player, captain, everything to sit on their bench. Phillips: Leeds best midfielder, should have stayed up with him. Ake: Bournemouths best defender to sit on the bench. Nunes: Wolves best remaining midfielder to sit on the bench. Kovacic: Chelseas best midfielder to sit on the bench. Now Paqueta: West Hams best player, who will ultimately be a squad player. Man Utd. did that for years, same for Bayern. It's standard practice for any team at the top, weaken the opposition. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinebro Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 11 minutes ago, bobzy said: I'm already quite close to "being done" with football - Man City receiving no punishment (or a purely financial one) would be the end for me. Wholeheartedly agree. Years ago I used to watch many games and was interested in the league as a whole. Only watch Villa games now 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pas5898 Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 (edited) 17 minutes ago, bobzy said: It's just a different level of what most teams do, though. You can be angry about it... ...but then you also need to get angry about the relative purchasing power of Aston Villa. We've taken Sevilla's best defender, Chicago Fire's main striker, Adelaide United's goalkeeper and they're all just "squad". It's the financial nature of the Premier League. Man City have the finances to do it against a higher level of club, but all PL clubs are doing the same thing in varying degrees. Yes but we and Man United / Bayern do that using revenue within the framework provided. They not only "financially doped", but they used that to degrade other teams as well as elevate themselves. If they operated within the rules by not falsifying commercial arrangements; then we would probably have Grealish, Leeds keep Philips (and stayed up), Wolves keep Nunes etc as they would be near FFP limits. Edited April 9 by pas5898 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calcifer Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 13 minutes ago, Pinebro said: Wholeheartedly agree. Years ago I used to watch many games and was interested in the league as a whole. Only watch Villa games now I am the same, i would watch pretty much all games, now i only watch Villa when they are on Sky, but that is become tiresome as the co commentators are so unbearable you have to mute them. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhan_Zhuang Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 22 minutes ago, Pinebro said: Wholeheartedly agree. Years ago I used to watch many games and was interested in the league as a whole. Only watch Villa games now Me too... For about ten years now I've rarely watched other teams; the last few years now I just watch the Villa. PL stinks, Everton and Forest get charged almost immediately yet City still waiting....it's dodgy. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 41 minutes ago, pas5898 said: Yes but we and Man United / Bayern do that using revenue within the framework provided. They not only "financially doped", but they used that to degrade other teams as well as elevate themselves. If they operated within the rules by not falsifying commercial arrangements; then we would probably have Grealish, Leeds keep Philips (and stayed up), Wolves keep Nunes etc as they would be near FFP limits. FWIW, this is exactly what Man Utd and Bayern have done over the years (along with various other clubs). The financial doping point is fine; and if your argument is that everything since that 2009-2018 period is built on the 2009-2018 period and therefore cannot be viewed with anything other than unfair gains, then there's no real discussion to be had. Everything Man City currently do is considered to be based on a falsehood. However, they may well be "run well" now - having gained the initial benefit. We still don't know how much they've been considered to have gained during that decade, either. (The vagueness around their charges - whilst understandable to an extent - is really frustrating). But if you consider how they operate now versus other clubs, they're the same as a "normal" big club. The game - especially when operating in European competitions - is about squad depth almost as much as how strong the first eleven is. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Platt Posted April 9 VT Supporter Share Posted April 9 (edited) If they do not get a points deduction or relegation and instead get a huge fine who pockets the money!? All the clubs that have been in The Prem for past 10 years or just the ones in it now? If Villa get a payout and reduce ticket prices would you be happy? Would Heck do that? doubt it! Would any amount received by clubs class as income to offset FFP? So much dodgy stuff can happen if money is involved and it has probably already swapped hands in some cases. The longer this goes on the worse it gets with Everton and Forest suffering. Edited April 9 by S-Platt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wainy316 Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 I hate Man City but it's pretty clear now that despite Purslow's posturing, we absolutely had to sell Grealish. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 2 hours ago, pas5898 said: Yes but we and Man United / Bayern do that using revenue within the framework provided. They not only "financially doped", but they used that to degrade other teams as well as elevate themselves. If they operated within the rules by not falsifying commercial arrangements; then we would probably have Grealish, Leeds keep Philips (and stayed up), Wolves keep Nunes etc as they would be near FFP limits. Those transfers occurred nearly a decade after the allegedly falsified documents and inflated sponsorship deals. At the start of that decade, they were not really much better than the other 'big 6' clubs. The boring truth is that the most important element in their domination of English football *now* is their decision to hire Guardiola as manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 53 minutes ago, Wainy316 said: I hate Man City but it's pretty clear now that despite Purslow's posturing, we absolutely had to sell Grealish. Yes and if we have to sell a Watkins. Ramsey or Luiz to meet ffp conditions it's another thing that is destroying the hope in our game. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 1 hour ago, Wainy316 said: I hate Man City but it's pretty clear now that despite Purslow's posturing, we absolutely had to sell Grealish. £100m was a good deal for the club The wages and the trophies were great for Jack. If it happened 10 more times I’d expect the same outcome every time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pas5898 Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 28 minutes ago, HanoiVillan said: The boring truth is that the most important element in their domination of English football *now* is their decision to hire Guardiola as manager. The falsifying of commercial arrangements is what took them from a normal "also ran" club to apparently similar commercial revenue to Real Madrid. They wouldn't have been in a position to get Guardiola / Txiki Begiristain if they didn't cheat to begin with. That's the point. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 17 minutes ago, pas5898 said: The falsifying of commercial arrangements is what took them from a normal "also ran" club to apparently similar commercial revenue to Real Madrid. They wouldn't have been in a position to get Guardiola / Txiki Begiristain if they didn't cheat to begin with. That's the point. Yes, I agree that's a reasonable argument (assuming they did actually falsify their sponsorship income and sundry other offences as appears). But everything that happens, happens on the shoulders of everything that happened before. The reason their particular multi-billion pound squad beat other interested multi-billion pound squads to sign Grealish and Phillips is more specifically because they're out on their own as the top side in England, and that is because of Guardiola (they were not out on their own as the 'best' club in England under Mancini or Pellegrino). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacketspuds Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 6 hours ago, duke313 said: Supposedly agreed terms with Paqueta, isn't he under investigation for betting offences still. It's a bit of a joke Everton and Forest getting handed out points deductions, whilst City are allowed to continue their pursuit for trophies unhindered. I realise that their 115 charges are more complicated, and that City are dragging their feet in order to delay any punishment. They should be hit with a transfer embargo until they agree to co-operate with the investigation. Which will make the last game of the season interesting when Man City play West Ham. "Hey Lucas, we need a win to clinch the title, any chance you can phone in your final performance before you join the PL Champions?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 The Brazilian they signed from Wolves has about 8 starts to his name Takes the piss that they just keep spending hundreds of millions on other PL teams best players that they don't even need 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rds1983 Posted April 9 VT Supporter Share Posted April 9 2 hours ago, HanoiVillan said: they're out on their own as the top side in England, and that is because of Guardiola (they were not out on their own as the 'best' club in England under Mancini or Pellegrino). The fact that they've spent nearly £2b on transfers since he came in (when they already had a top tier and expensive squad), has probably helped him establish them as the top team in the UK. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted April 9 Author Share Posted April 9 20 minutes ago, Rds1983 said: The fact that they've spent nearly £2b on transfers since he came in (when they already had a top tier and expensive squad), has probably helped him establish them as the top team in the UK. The man who thinks he works on a budget has spent nearly 600 million on defenders alone since joining City. Doesn't include signing on fees or wages on or off the books Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rds1983 Posted April 9 VT Supporter Share Posted April 9 24 minutes ago, Zatman said: The man who thinks he works on a budget has spent nearly 600 million on defenders alone since joining City. Doesn't include signing on fees or wages on or off the books To be fair to him, he joined in 2016, so that's only £75m on defenders each season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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