TrentVilla Posted April 4, 2017 Moderator Share Posted April 4, 2017 17 minutes ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: Christ, that's ridiculous. Obviously I had hoped he was over his disciplinary issues, clearly I was wrong. Not sure where we go from here with him. It was the England Under 21 rather than Villa but I agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 5 hours ago, TrentVilla said: It was the England Under 21 rather than Villa but I agree. I know, but at this stage it doesn't really matter. It points to a wider issue with the lad which demonstrably still exists. I'm kinda done defending him now, basically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted April 4, 2017 Moderator Share Posted April 4, 2017 8 minutes ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: I know, but at this stage it doesn't really matter. It points to a wider issue with the lad which demonstrably still exists. I'm kinda done defending him now, basically. I agree, I passed that stage some time ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lapal_fan Posted April 5, 2017 Share Posted April 5, 2017 Like a lot of young players now, you do question his motivation/determination to succeed. Even Zlatan alluded to it yesterday when he said "I am a lion, surrounded by pussy cats" - and that's at Man Utd. I just hope that making a handful of 1st team appearances for Villa isn't his ultimate goal, and that he's got the will to try and win a cup and play for Englands 1st team. At the moment it seems like he's happy being a local lad in the squad. I'd hope for a bit more than that from someone with his talent. He really now needs to think about what he wants, and whether he has the motivation to go and get it - like Debbie Allie at Spurs.. He's got a nasty bastard in him, but sometimes, that's what it takes to become a winner. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilS Posted April 5, 2017 Share Posted April 5, 2017 7 minutes ago, lapal_fan said: Like a lot of young players now, you do question his motivation/determination to succeed. Even Zlatan alluded to it yesterday when he said "I am a lion, surrounded by pussy cats" - and that's at Man Utd. I just hope that making a handful of 1st team appearances for Villa isn't his ultimate goal, and that he's got the will to try and win a cup and play for Englands 1st team. At the moment it seems like he's happy being a local lad in the squad. I'd hope for a bit more than that from someone with his talent. He really now needs to think about what he wants, and whether he has the motivation to go and get it - like Debbie Allie at Spurs.. He's got a nasty bastard in him, but sometimes, that's what it takes to become a winner. Debbie Alli? I think you are correct with what you are saying though, I think he has found himself comfortably well off at a young age as per a lot of young British players from Premier League teams, a few have the desire to really push themselves on but lots are happy thinking they have made it when in reality they have not. It is a catch 22 situation for teams like us, pay the money to keep a potential star or lose them to the bigger teams who can afford to pay the wages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted April 5, 2017 Share Posted April 5, 2017 People saying he's the next Lee Hendrie are being optimistic. Heading for a much worse career than Lee. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villaglint Posted April 5, 2017 Share Posted April 5, 2017 Think you are all being a bit harsh. He's got talent but deserves to be where he is right now. It will do him good to be trying to force his way into a successful team rather than being a key figure who is relied on in a very unsuccessful team. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phumfeinz Posted April 5, 2017 Share Posted April 5, 2017 We're doing just fine without him, and he very rarely impacted any game when we did play him. Not bothered with this guy anymore to be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodders0223 Posted April 5, 2017 Share Posted April 5, 2017 Nobody to blame but himself but I get the impression the penny will never drop with him. Will be turning out for Kidderminster whilst slating the club for failing him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khizzy Posted April 5, 2017 Share Posted April 5, 2017 If he hasn't kicked on yet in a mid-table Championship side that has, at many times this season cried out for some creativity then I doubt he'll make it here at all. In 10 years time, he'll be telling people that he once played for Villa in a "Do you know who I am?" kind of tone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post BOF Posted April 5, 2017 Moderator Popular Post Share Posted April 5, 2017 1 hour ago, Phumfeinz said: We're doing just fine without him, and he very rarely impacted any game when we did play him. Not bothered with this guy anymore to be honest. Can we just ... a little perspective here. Firstly let me say I'm well aware of his flaws. He has a long way to go and it's clear that the side has progressed while he has been out of it. But, he is still our joint 3rd highest scorer in the league this season AND our joint 3rd highest assister as well. This despite 18 starts, 9 of which he finished the game. Whatever about what he does NOT do, which is plenty. It is simply not true that he rarely impacts games. It is his ability to unlock a defence either with a pass or a shot that makes him the exciting player he is. Where and how (and whether...) we use him as we progress is up for discussion but he is effective in the final third. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSV Posted April 5, 2017 Share Posted April 5, 2017 9 minutes ago, BOF said: Can we just ... a little perspective here. Firstly let me say I'm well aware of his flaws. He has a long way to go and it's clear that the side has progressed while he has been out of it. But, he is still our joint 3rd highest scorer in the league this season AND our joint 3rd highest assister as well. This despite 18 starts, 9 of which he finished the game. Whatever about what he does NOT do, which is plenty. It is simply not true that he rarely impacts games. It is his ability to unlock a defence either with a pass or a shot that makes him the exciting player he is. Where and how (and whether...) we use him as we progress is up for discussion but he is effective in the final third. That says more about the season we have had.. and our reliance on Adomah/Kodjia in creating and scoring goals. I was hoping he would be taking out of the side as he is a massive liability at this stage. I was proven correct. Our run has been amazing since hes been out of the side. Doesnt impact games enough and doesnt work hard enough. Good luck in league 2 if you keep it up Jack. I am sure you are a nice kid but you need to work hard on and off the pitch to get the success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted April 5, 2017 Moderator Share Posted April 5, 2017 1 minute ago, KSV said: That says more about the season we have had.. and our reliance on Adomah/Kodjia in creating and scoring goals. That's as may be, but if we are somehow discounting our 3rd highest scorer and assister as being an ineffectual/ineffective player, then it's a criticism that can surely be reasonably levelled at anyone in the squad who has an attacking responsibility and who hasn't met his numbers as well, and to be honest I don't think we can make that criticism. Not fairly any way. I know he's not flavour of the month. But that doesn't mean the only conversations can be negative ones and it doesn't mean we should dismiss the positive aspects of his game in the process. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted April 5, 2017 Share Posted April 5, 2017 22 minutes ago, BOF said: That's as may be, but if we are somehow discounting our 3rd highest scorer and assister as being an ineffectual/ineffective player, then it's a criticism that can surely be reasonably levelled at anyone in the squad who has an attacking responsibility and who hasn't met his numbers as well, and to be honest I don't think we can make that criticism. Not fairly any way. I know he's not flavour of the month. But that doesn't mean the only conversations can be negative ones and it doesn't mean we should dismiss the positive aspects of his game in the process. Does the same apply for Ross McCormack? Another with apparent attitude problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phumfeinz Posted April 5, 2017 Share Posted April 5, 2017 10 hours ago, BOF said: Can we just ... a little perspective here. Firstly let me say I'm well aware of his flaws. He has a long way to go and it's clear that the side has progressed while he has been out of it. But, he is still our joint 3rd highest scorer in the league this season AND our joint 3rd highest assister as well. This despite 18 starts, 9 of which he finished the game. Whatever about what he does NOT do, which is plenty. It is simply not true that he rarely impacts games. It is his ability to unlock a defence either with a pass or a shot that makes him the exciting player he is. Where and how (and whether...) we use him as we progress is up for discussion but he is effective in the final third. When you put it like that then yeah it sounds like I'm being somewhat unfair. My counterpoint is, you say joint 3rd highest goalscorer and assists - ok it's true but (and I had to look this up because I didn't know) the stats are: 3 goals and 2 assists. That's somewhat indicative of the poor team we had until after January but personally I was hoping that Grealish would have really kicked on and lit up the Championship this season. 2 assists is poor for a player of Jack's position and supposed talent. That said I've hardly watched any games this season due to being very busy and them simply not being broadcast, so all I'm going on are goals and assists which maybe doesn't reflect his true contribution (as you say, defence-unlocking passes). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villan_of_oz Posted April 6, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted April 6, 2017 I don't rate him..... Have watched and waited for his potential to materialise. I know he is only 21 but his attitude for me is just not there. Plenty of 21 olds with less talent but better application, and hence more 'potential' to become better footballers. An opinion only. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted April 6, 2017 Share Posted April 6, 2017 I'm not surprised we are winning games without him starting to be honest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted April 6, 2017 Share Posted April 6, 2017 been awarded the PFA community player of the year for his work off the pitch doubt that will get 10+ pages of people moaning about his attitude... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted April 6, 2017 Share Posted April 6, 2017 1 minute ago, villa4europe said: been awarded the PFA community player of the year for his work off the pitch doubt that will get 10+ pages of people moaning about his attitude... What's that got to do with his performances on the pitch though? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villan_of_oz Posted April 6, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted April 6, 2017 (edited) 6 minutes ago, villa4europe said: been awarded the PFA community player of the year for his work off the pitch doubt that will get 10+ pages of people moaning about his attitude... Fair play to him and good on you for posting it but I'm only questioning his attitude towards his football. I don't think myself or anyone has said anything about his personal life other than when he is daft enough to let things become public news. Basically I genuinely think what he has done in the community is fantastic, However I genuinely don't want him in the first team and by next season possibly not on the bench either. Edited April 6, 2017 by Villan_of_oz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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