avfcwills10 Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 No better place for Jack to develop than VP. Based on the vast majority of academy players that come through the ranks, and fail, I just don't agree with this. Quite shocking how many supposedly talented youth players we've had who just have not developed once they hit the first team: Gabby, weimann to an extent, you could argue Barry as he came at such a young age, vassell? Who else really? We produce a lot of potential yet the clubs ability to maximise that is nothing short of abysmal in all honesty. Ridgwell, Davis and Cahill all went on to have decent (and in some cases very good) premiership careers. I think Gardner#s been a bit better at this level than Davis so he'd be in that list. 1000% disagree, Davies was brilliant for Hull last season. Much better than Craig Gardner imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 No better place for Jack to develop than VP. Based on the vast majority of academy players that come through the ranks, and fail, I just don't agree with this. Quite shocking how many supposedly talented youth players we've had who just have not developed once they hit the first team: Gabby, weimann to an extent, you could argue Barry as he came at such a young age, vassell? Who else really? We produce a lot of potential yet the clubs ability to maximise that is nothing short of abysmal in all honesty. Ridgwell, Davis and Cahill all went on to have decent (and in some cases very good) premiership careers. I think Gardner#s been a bit better at this level than Davis so he'd be in that list. 1000% disagree, Davies was brilliant for Hull last season. Much better than Craig Gardner imo. Steven Davis? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 Cahill is the one that stings............ Yes, and the worst thing is that it wasn't because he wanted to go, or because he was out of contract. It's because O'Neill in his infinite wisdom thought that Curtis Davies and Zat Knight were better defensive options. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Philosopher Posted September 9, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted September 9, 2014 (edited) No better place for Jack to develop than VP. Based on the vast majority of academy players that come through the ranks, and fail, I just don't agree with this. Quite shocking how many supposedly talented youth players we've had who just have not developed once they hit the first team: Gabby, weimann to an extent, you could argue Barry as he came at such a young age, vassell? Who else really? We produce a lot of potential yet the clubs ability to maximise that is nothing short of abysmal in all honesty. You're talking out of your arse! The fact is most young prospects that break through in any premiership team end up not being good enough. Everton for example have a lot more Dan Goslings than Wayne Rooney's. West Ham had a good crop with Lampard, J Cole, Defoe, Carrick and Ferdinand (all came through when West Ham were fighting relegation or when they were relegated, in the Case of Defoe and Carrick), but since then can you really say Tomkins, Noble or Stanislas are better than any players we have brought through? Not to mention all of the names I mentioned in the first instance moved on before 23! Villa have developed 3 players that have turned out for England in the last ten years and only Southampton and West Ham and Arsenal (including Walcott not Chamberlin) have developed more! In the case of Southampton Walcott left at 15 so Arsenal have to take some credit for his development! Chambers, Chamberlin and Shaw all left before their 20th birthdays. Lallana is the only player Saints actually developed and brought through past the age of 19! The fact is the best players get snapped up by the biggest teams before they fully develop, the ones that don't get snapped up usually just aren't good enough to begin with! Although a few like Lallana, Lambert, Barry and Cahill (although in Cahill's case CD's mature later, due to the level of discipline and tactical awareness the position require and how costly a mistake is in central defense, a longer apprenticeship is required ) slip through the net! In regards to Grealish Villa is CURRENTLY the best place for him to develop! Because he won't start for Chelsea, Man U, Man City, Arsenal or even Liverpool thanks to the wealth of attacking talent in their squads. I would say Grealish would be best served playing for Villa for another 3 seasons AT LEAST. For me Rooney left Everton too soon, it went to his head and he is just a good player instead of the potentially world class talent he was. Walcott was 23 before he was a regular at Arsenal, and Chamberlin is still just a squad player. Shaw wasn't deemed fit enough to be a Man U player this summer. What determines whether a player becomes a quality player, is talent, strength of character, determination, dedication and regular first team football (which usually needs a manager to show faith in them which if they have all three of the aforementioned they should get). It seems as though Grealish has the qualities required to make it and Keane and Lambert seem to believe in him so everything he needs to succeed is here at Villa! Edited September 9, 2014 by Philosopher 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avfcwills10 Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 No better place for Jack to develop than VP. Based on the vast majority of academy players that come through the ranks, and fail, I just don't agree with this. Quite shocking how many supposedly talented youth players we've had who just have not developed once they hit the first team: Gabby, weimann to an extent, you could argue Barry as he came at such a young age, vassell? Who else really? We produce a lot of potential yet the clubs ability to maximise that is nothing short of abysmal in all honesty. Ridgwell, Davis and Cahill all went on to have decent (and in some cases very good) premiership careers. I think Gardner#s been a bit better at this level than Davis so he'd be in that list. 1000% disagree, Davies was brilliant for Hull last season. Much better than Craig Gardner imo. Steven Davis? Oh, my bad. Still disagree though he's never been a permanent starter for any other English club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyM3000 Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 Lots of people saying on here that it would be a mistake to leave us now, well I really don't think we are in any position to call that. Who know's what he might be being promised by our club or even by another club if he spoke to them in Jan when he's available to do so. Money matters, if someone offers him a great deal before we have got him tied down he would have to take a serious look at it. If we offered him 10k a week for 4 years he will lock up £2m in earnings if he makes it or not, Chelsea or any other big club could offer 30k and thats £6m, serious consideration. He should get more game time playing for us but who's to say that's what he thinks is best? Maybe he might want to go and learn off quality players like Hazard, Fabregas etc. Good thing is he is local lad, has family around here and has grown up supporting Villa, I expect he will stay with us and I hope he will but he has options open to him and this contract should have been tied up a long time ago. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRS-T Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 Cahill is the one that stings............ Daniel Sturridge for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 Sturridge wasn't here for long was he? And the way he spent the early part of his career chasing money and then moaning every chance he got about not getting an opportunity something tells me that if he had broke through we wouldn't have kept him Agree with Cahill, it was stupidity from MON, Davies maybe (but that's a push too, he was awful for us) but zat knight?! Cahill had a buzz round him too, a lot of fans were waiting for him to get a good go at it, and we flogged him cheaply to a shitter team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 Sturridge wasn't here for long was he? And the way he spent the early part of his career chasing money and then moaning every chance he got about not getting an opportunity something tells me that if he had broke through we wouldn't have kept him Agree with Cahill, it was stupidity from MON, Davies maybe (but that's a push too, he was awful for us) but zat knight?! Cahill had a buzz round him too, a lot of fans were waiting for him to get a good go at it, and we flogged him cheaply to a shitter team Cahill was clearly the next John Terry. We all saw it, I remember telling all my friends how good he is and how he will captain England one day. We could all see he was special. Why the **** couldn't MON see this!?!?!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khizzy Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 MON was too busy telling Ashley Young he was world class.... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDuck Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 I was always under the impression Cahill moved on because MON - rightly - would not guarantee him a start? He went to Bolton, not directly to Chelsea... which is probably a fair indication how highly rated he was at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 I was always under the impression Cahill moved on because MON - rightly - would not guarantee him a start? He went to Bolton, not directly to Chelsea... which is probably a fair indication how highly rated he was at the time. Yes he wanted more game time than his ability warrented at the time but I think the situation could have been handled better. There was no need to bring in 2 new centre backs ahead of him, just buying 1 and letting him compete for a place would have kept him involved. Still, this is quite off topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexicon Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 MON was too busy telling Ashley Young he was world class.... He was absolutely brilliant for most of his time with us, to be fair. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 MON was too busy telling Ashley Young he was world class.... He was absolutely brilliant for most of his time with us, to be fair. You must mean Luke Young right? As for the Ashley kind, he was awesome at the row Z free kick challenge...he didn't just become shit overnight at the Manure, it had been a long time coming. He was great for us in the beginning though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelle Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Ashley Young assisted a fair few goals from corners and freekicks when he was here. It was during his last season with us that he started to decline. Probably felt that we were on a decline and already had a move to manure in his mind. But this is off topic. This about Jack Grealish. I hope he gets a contract that makes sense for all parts and that he satys. Not yet convinced by him, but he's got a lot of potential. Still a long way to go for him. I hope he makes it and that he makes it here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Barry Cahill Weimann Agbonlahor Ridgewell Gardner Davis Hitzlsperger all got games here so have Clark, Baker, Albrighton, Bannan and even Moore and they never took their chance for whatever reason. Villa is perfect place for him to develop and a lot better than being sent on loan to Vitesse or Middlesbrough 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 MON was too busy telling Ashley Young he was world class.... He was absolutely brilliant for most of his time with us, to be fair. You must mean Luke Young right? As for the Ashley kind, he was awesome at the row Z free kick challenge...he didn't just become shit overnight at the Manure, it had been a long time coming. He was great for us in the beginning though... You must mean somebody else. He wasn't great under Houllier granted, but he wasn't bad either. Under O'Neill he was our best player, I was not aware this was debated. I can't be arsed to look up the stats, but did he not lead the league in assists over 3 years as well as scoring 7-9 goals per season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Djemba_Villan Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 MON was too busy telling Ashley Young he was world class.... He was absolutely brilliant for most of his time with us, to be fair. You must mean Luke Young right? As for the Ashley kind, he was awesome at the row Z free kick challenge...he didn't just become shit overnight at the Manure, it had been a long time coming. He was great for us in the beginning though... You must mean somebody else. He wasn't great under Houllier granted, but he wasn't bad either. Under O'Neill he was our best player, I was not aware this was debated. I can't be arsed to look up the stats, but did he not lead the league in assists over 3 years as well as scoring 7-9 goals per season? Ashley Young was absolutely fantastic for us. Bizarre to suggest otherwise IMO. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeyAnty Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Lots of people saying on here that it would be a mistake to leave us now, well I really don't think we are in any position to call that. Who know's what he might be being promised by our club or even by another club if he spoke to them in Jan when he's available to do so. Money matters, if someone offers him a great deal before we have got him tied down he would have to take a serious look at it. If we offered him 10k a week for 4 years he will lock up £2m in earnings if he makes it or not, Chelsea or any other big club could offer 30k and thats £6m, serious consideration. He should get more game time playing for us but who's to say that's what he thinks is best? Maybe he might want to go and learn off quality players like Hazard, Fabregas etc. Good thing is he is local lad, has family around here and has grown up supporting Villa, I expect he will stay with us and I hope he will but he has options open to him and this contract should have been tied up a long time ago. Yes i think what you are trying to say is that there is no loyalty in football, which im sure 99% of fans would agree. At same time it works the other way round for thousands. If he didnt make it, it wouldnt cost villa a thought to let him go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ads Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 He has been offered a new four year deal today. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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