Summer transfer window 2021

[Nigel]

33 minutes ago, WHY said:

If the PL isn’t a greater pull than playing in the back arse of nowhere on a Thursday nights, then we might be in for years of disappointing transfer windows.

Its not but in addition it gives players a greater spotlight 

[foreveryoung]

Surely the fact that we didn't get a player like JWP, we are a midfield player missing. We wouldn't have blown another 30m if we didn't need too. 

[fightoffyour]

When we got promoted we did so "a year ahead of schedule" - quite clearly because it required a record-breaking winning run just to reach the playoffs. Hence when we stayed up in our first season back in the Premier League we also did so a year ahead of schedule, and likewise when we improved to finish firmly in midtable (in fact closer to 6th than 12th) last season that was again a year ahead of schedule.

Now this is the first season that we could realistically be expected to challenge for Europe, and if we achieved that it would once again be a year ahead of schedule. It is therefore not a disaster if we improve marginally this year with the new players we have purchased and whilst bringing through some exciting youth talent, especially considering that we were forced to sell by far and away our best player, captain and talisman just a week before the season started.

Would I like us to buy a new (D)CM tomorrow? Yes. that would help us push for Europe this season. Will I be concerned about it if we don't? Not particularly. We can still improve upon last season and build patiently, waiting to land the right targets at the right prices and introduce more youth players gradually.

[est1874]

3 minutes ago, KMitch said:

It wasn't really broadcast in the USA before that.  Hell, up until ~2010 I had to Torrent copies of recorded games from a seedy forum just to watch most Villa games.  

Ah fair enough. Didn't realize you were Stateside! Or that it was so hard to watch Prem there for so long

[VillaFaninLondon]

It's very disappointing there are going to be no more incomings, but was obvious when Smith said he was happy with what he has. CM is an area that continues to require big investment to compete in the top half, but has once again been ignored. West Ham improving their first team, so are Spuds, while we are happy despite being bringing in more money than has gone out this summer and had an indifferent start to the season. Can only guess that the owners/management are happy with midtable again this season. They're clearly not going for top 7 because we don't have enough for that. 

[CarryOnVilla]

1 minute ago, foreveryoung said:

Surely the fact that we didn't get a player like JWP, we are a midfield player missing. We wouldn't have blown another 30m if we didn't need too. 

There’s getting a player that has been identified as needed and then there’s getting just anyone. I’m glad our club are scouting and researching what we needing to approve, rather than just getting anyone 

[DCJonah]

10 minutes ago, pintpotvilla said:

Why can't we all see things like you? You are absolutely right There is nothing to moan about We are on the way up UTV

I don't know about anyone else but for me it comes down to Paul Lambert. 

Lambert and Lerner destroyed my love of villa and destroyed my love of football. I stopped watching MOTD, champions league, I just wasn't interested.

The championship was a humbling experience and renewed some enjoyment but Bruce being Bruce made it difficult to really be back loving it.

And since Dean has joined its been a different club. So when I compare to that lowest low feeling, midtable prem team signing players like Bailey and Ings. Well that's pretty **** enjoyable to me. 

One more tomorrow would be fantastic but as I've said before, I think we've got enough in this squad to improve on last year. Just hope injuries don't ruin it.

 

[foreveryoung]

1 minute ago, DCJonah said:

I don't know about anyone else but for me it comes down to Paul Lambert. 

Lambert and Lerner destroyed my love of villa and destroyed my love of football. I stopped watching MOTD, champions league, I just wasn't interested.

The championship was a humbling experience and renewed some enjoyment but Bruce being Bruce made it difficult to really be back loving it.

And since Dean has joined its been a different club. So when I compare to that lowest low feeling, midtable prem team signing players like Bailey and Ings. Well that's pretty **** enjoyable to me. 

One more tomorrow would be fantastic but as I've said before, I think we've got enough in this squad to improve on last year. Just hope injuries don't ruin it.

 

You do realise it's just not down to Dean and maybe more to do with our Billionaire owners?

[Jbvilla909]

Were the JWP and ESR bids just for bants ? Or do we have targets in mind that aren't available this summer ? 

[DCJonah]

Just now, foreveryoung said:

You do realise it's just not down to Dean and maybe more to do with our Billionaire owners?

And I absolutely love both of those guys as well. 

Great owners, great manager, exciting players. Good time to be a villa fan.

[DCJonah]

Just now, Jbvilla909 said:

Were the JWP and ESR bids just for bants ? Or do we have targets in mind that aren't available this summer ? 

I think ESR was a desperate grealish replacement. 

Not sure about JWP. I can only assume we want a midfield player but aren't going to bring in 2nd/3rd choices. 

TBH it's the right thing. Look at the players we signed under Suso, a lot of them are not good enough and need to be replaced. 

There's no need to panic and bring someone in for the sake of it, who we then need to replace in 12 months time. 

[KMitch]

3 minutes ago, est1874 said:

Ah fair enough. Didn't realize you were Stateside! Or that it was so hard to watch Prem there for so long

2002-2012, Fox held the rights to the Premier League and pretty much only broadcast games from the "Big 4" live.  Over time, they added one additional PPV channel to get access to a second match and only once streaming became more common, they added additional streaming access to all additional games.  I was paying a lot of money ($60-80/month) at this time just to view Villa games legally and the stream quality/reliability was very poor.  The website crashed a lot and they didn't invest anything into the system after launch.

2013-Present, NBC won the rights from Fox and the coverage has been spectacular.  It's been a huge reason why the USA has had so many new fans recently.  All games were broadcast live on basic cable or on their website for free for the first few seasons, then they slowly added additional pricing for streaming the additional matches, but you could access every Premier League game for ~$20/month.  Today, you can get everything with basic cable and Peacock for $5/month.  It's probably easier to watch the Premier League in the USA than it is in England now.  

[Czarnikjak]

23 minutes ago, a-k said:

Sorry, but this is a moot point. We know that Buendia was brought in to play with JG, Young was already incoming, and that we were offering JG a new deal of around +100k p/w more. It can be argued whether Bailey would also have come even if JG stayed, but let's consider that he was brought in with the JG money. So, irrespective of other fees to be paid from dealings from previous windows, we were at minimum looking of an outlay of 35mil in transfer fees and around 200k p/w in wages (in addition to JG's original salary, although I may even be underestimating Young's + Buendia's weekly pay). We then end up with 100mil incoming and JG's p/w off the books. We have since brought in Bailey (30 mil), Ings (25 mil), Tuanzebe (5 mil? loan fee), at let's say a combined 300k p/w. 

So, our plans were at minimum to spend 35 mil in fees and increase the wage bill by around 200k p/w. We have since received 100 mil in fees and spent 60 mil. We have then decreased the wage bill by 100k p/w (underestimating JG's deal for simplicity) and increased the bill by 300k p/w. Therefore, we now have 40mil in the bank from transfers fees when we were meant to outlay 35mil (i.e., net difference of 75mil worth of money to spend), and have broken even on weekly salary (meant to increase by 200k p/w, in the end got 3 players in at 300k p/w combined while dropping 100k p/w from JG).

These calculations are all based on the original outlay that was planned even knowing we had other payments from previous years. Now, we may have since looked at players and tried to get some but they didn't work out for whatever reason (fee was too much even though we have the money, player didn't want to come, etc.), but to say that net spend is meaningless in our case and that we don't have cash to spend is incorrect, sorry. The only other reason I could see us holding on to the extra money is if we feel our commercial value (or the extra revenue) from having JG has dropped by a substantial amount now that he is gone, but who knows. NSWE have brought us a long way and I believe we will continue in the right direction with them, but from the outside looking in it is disappointing that we are well off our initial planned spend.

I appreciate your post, as it looks like you have put some effort into it.

My premise still stands that the "Transfer Net Spend" as Sky like to present it to an average punter is a meaningless figure to football clubs.

Clubs don't look at, or use this figure in their plans and calculations. We shouldn't be using it either if we want to accurately describe our situation.

What clubs are interested in is:

1. Total cost of ownership of the player (wages plus amortisation)

2. Actual cash flow behind the transfers (which can be very different to the Sky touted "net spend")

It's too simplistic to quote the "net spend" like the original poster did and complain that we have negative value.

Regarding the figures you're quoting, I mostly agree with them. Looking from the outside, yes we could spend more money this summer. But the management and coaching staff decided it's not necessary/beneficial in the long-term (or maybe simply the players they really wanted were not available). I have trust in their decisions as they are much better informed then us to make them.

 

Edited August 30, 2021 by Czarnikjak

[Xela]

41 minutes ago, KMitch said:

I can't wait for the window to shut so I can stop checking this thread daily for transfer updates, but instead find myself reading page after page of the doom mongers spewing the same garbage for the last 8+ seasons.  Some of you moaners must be great at parties...  Unbelievable. This culture of instant gratification/entitlement makes me hate being a fan of sports.  Nothing is good enough for some people...

 

Great post. 

The culture of want it now and instant gratification is more society in general than just this board. People don't want to wait for nice things anymore, it's an alien concept. People want everything now and to pay later and bugger the consequences. It's just the way the western world is now. 

I'm kind of annoyed that i'm working tomorrow as I imagine this thread would be fun! Like you, I will be glad when the window closes though. I imagine the forum traffic will die down a fair bit then as there will be no chance of anymore dopamine hit signings. 

[Amed]

2 minutes ago, Jbvilla909 said:

Were the JWP and ESR bids just for bants ? Or do we have targets in mind that aren't available this summer ? 

Probably not bants but if both Arsenal / Soton didn’t want to sell, should we just go and buy a 3rd choice for the sake of it? Do we need to? 
 

Personally I’d rather we didn’t go and waste 30m on 3rd choice, and go with options we have. Figure out another 1st choice when time is right. Our needs might change by January / Next summer.

[VillaFaninLondon]

16 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

I am. Absolutely. Happiest I've been supporting this club since MON left. 

Apart from those MON years, I can't remember a time I've been more excited about our future. A time I've liked so many of our players and manager. 

What's there to be unhappy about? You've seen life in the championship. What's so bad about average in the Premier league? 

I might get bored of it after a few years. But right now? Iove it. Absolutely love it.

 

It is an exciting time I agree, these owners have transformed us in a short space of time, no denying that.

 

But you mentioned MON and I also have nightmares of Lerner where everything was rosy for a time and then suddenly went to sh** because we didn't progress like he wanted to and then we spent years being cannon fodder. 

 

I think that's why some of us fans want us to keep progressing rather than standing still which given how our window has gone seems unlikely we will make sufficient progress to truly challenge the European spots.

[Xela]

15 minutes ago, VillaFaninLondon said:

West Ham improving their first team, so are Spuds, while we are happy despite being bringing in more money than has gone out this summer and had an indifferent start to the season. 

We've improved our first team! We've just done it earlier than other teams

 

[Jbvilla909]

3 minutes ago, Amed said:

Probably not bants but if both Arsenal / Soton didn’t want to sell, should we just go and buy a 3rd choice for the sake of it? Do we need to? 
 

Personally I’d rather we didn’t go and waste 30m on 3rd choice, and go with options we have. Figure out another 1st choice when time is right. Our needs might change by January / Next summer.

You sure? Felt like banter

 

[Peter Griffin]

We just missed out on Danny Drinkwater. Gone to Reading on loan. 

[Jbvilla909]

11 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

I think ESR was a desperate grealish replacement. 

Not sure about JWP. I can only assume we want a midfield player but aren't going to bring in 2nd/3rd choices. 

TBH it's the right thing. Look at the players we signed under Suso, a lot of them are not good enough and need to be replaced. 

There's no need to panic and bring someone in for the sake of it, who we then need to replace in 12 months time. 

Yeah you're right, I think the club will look at the squad and the youngsters coming though and ask themselves, we need better than what we have and what is potentially coming through the ranks