New Manager...

[AvfcRigo82]

8 minutes ago, OxfordVillan said:

Smith isn’t going anywhere, and rightly so. He’ll be manager next season, whatever league we end up in, and there’ll be one or two tweaks in the background. Hopefully Suso and Terry move on, and Dean Smith has more of an input in replacements and transfers. UTV

That's a bit of a bold statement. 

I think either way another team will need to be built on top of what remains from players leaving and what league we are in.

I am not sure Dean Smith is the answer anymore no matter what league we end up in.

As for Suso, yes he can go all day long and noises also being made that Terry could also be leaving us at the end of the season anyway.

If we remain in the PL and Suso and Terry depart I think replacing Smith wouldn't be too harsh as long as it was for a decent manager showing a statement of intent from the club.

There could be some big positions being replaced in the coming weeks.

 

Edited July 20, 2020 by AvfcRigo82

[MaVilla]

Still not sold on getting rid of Smith.

But on a general note, pity we didn't get bielsa instead of Leeds, its clear how hard and combative his teams are, but they also play good football.

I reckon Leeds will stay up next season.

I do wonder if dean smiths ideal role would be kind of a DOF position where he is responsible for overseeing the culture and youth development, as well as being on the transfer panel, from what I have seen I tend to feel that kind of role would be ideal for him.

 

[AvfcRigo82]

3 minutes ago, MaVilla said:

I do wonder if dean smiths ideal role would be kind of a DOF position where he is responsible for overseeing the culture and youth development, as well as being on the transfer panel, from what I have seen I tend to feel that kind of role would be ideal for him.

100% bang on.

I would not begrudge this happening and Dean playing some sort of role in our club wouldn't do any harm. 

I just don't think he is what we need at team management level of where we want to go as a club.

[Mjvilla]

7 minutes ago, AvfcRigo82 said:

That's a bit of a bold statement. 

I think either way another team will need to be built on top of what remains from players leaving and what league we are in.

I am not sure Dean Smith is the answer anymore no matter what league we end up in.

As for Suso, yes he can go all day long and noises also being made that Terry could also be leaving us at the end of the season anyway.

If we remain in the PL and Suso and Terry depart I think replacing Smith wouldn't be too harsh as long as it was for a decent manager showing a statement of intent from the club.

There could be some big positions being replaced in the coming weeks.

 

Is that because you put it in bold?

[useless]

If we're relegated we will likely have gone down having won one of our last sixteen games, people can insist that he's going nowhere all they like and they might even be right, but I think the most likely scenario would be him leaving, he was on the verge of getting the sack before lockdown after all, so it's not as if the club have a policy where they're going stick by him no matter what.

Him leaving if we stay up, would surprise me less than him keeping his job if we go down.

[AvfcRigo82]

13 minutes ago, Mjvilla said:

Is that because you put it in bold?

Haha, Touché

[DaveAV1]

4 hours ago, M_Afro said:

I just think that this a risky strategy Dave. We all assume that because a guy has worked well at a small club with limited funds, that he will instantly join a bigger club, with greater funds and be a success. The problem is, it is a different job with different demands and pressures. The only way of mitigating this risk is to appoint someone who has already experienced a similar situation and been successful. 

There’s always an element of risk and  we do have history of crushing the spirit out of managers. Listen I was a big fan of appointing Lambert, so don’t take any notice of me! 
 

Out of interest is there anyone you’d particularly be keen on? 

[romavillan]

30 minutes ago, MaVilla said:

Still not sold on getting rid of Smith.

But on a general note, pity we didn't get bielsa instead of Leeds, its clear how hard and combative his teams are, but they also play good football.

I reckon Leeds will stay up next season.

I do wonder if dean smiths ideal role would be kind of a DOF position where he is responsible for overseeing the culture and youth development, as well as being on the transfer panel, from what I have seen I tend to feel that kind of role would be ideal for him.

 

Bielsa is a legend for a generation of coaches, he would have been a fantastic appointment for us or for any second tier club, well any club to be honest.

Got nothing to do with Smith though and I hate to see this thread keep popping up, Smith will hopefully be our head coach next season regardless of which division we will play in.

[hippo]

58 minutes ago, OxfordVillan said:

Smith isn’t going anywhere, and rightly so. He’ll be manager next season, whatever league we end up in, and there’ll be one or two tweaks in the background. Hopefully Suso and Terry move on, and Dean Smith has more of an input in replacements and transfers. UTV

In your opinion. The fact is nobody knows. At the turn of the year i heard that the villa board are convinced they have the right man in Smith. but things change. If/When relegation is confirmed a deafening silence will speak volumes. 

John Percy who is a good itk - said smith was safe for the next 6 games (speaking just after the restart) - but nothing beyond that - I would say DS himself isn't sure of the implications of relegation

We don't know who makes the call on DS staying I suspect Purslow/Edens/Nasir in that order.

 

Edited July 20, 2020 by hippo

[hippo]

The most worrying thing of keeping Smith for is that the board feel unable attract anyone better so stick with him. If those at the higher echelons of the club don't feel able to get better than someone who has achieved moderate success at Walsall and Brentford then I fear we will be stuck in limbo for a long while.

[TRO]

12 hours ago, Mjvilla said:

Someone like Hassenhuttl who you would've wanted sacked after losing 9-0 at home and really struggling at the start of this season.

 

One game.....not one season.

[AvfcRigo82]

1 hour ago, hippo said:

The most worrying thing of keeping Smith for is that the board feel unable attract anyone better so stick with him. If those at the higher echelons of the club don't feel able to get better than someone who has achieved moderate success at Walsall and Brentford then I fear we will be stuck in limbo for a long while.

Unless we remove the person that could get in the way of attracting someone better.

[thabucks]

Rather keep Purslow than have the cult of Benitez who would no doubt be moaning within 6 months about how hard done by he is... Just don’t get the FSW Luv-in 

Edited July 20, 2020 by thabucks

[Nabby]

3 hours ago, OxfordVillan said:

Smith isn’t going anywhere, and rightly so. He’ll be manager next season, whatever league we end up in, and there’ll be one or two tweaks in the background. Hopefully Suso and Terry move on, and Dean Smith has more of an input in replacements and transfers. UTV

If he stays and Terry and Suso go and we are still not performing who do we lay the blame on then ?

They may well be part of the problem I just don't buy into them going makes us better.I'll say again why when the coaching is questioned its town to Terry not Smith (who is hands on) and Richard O'Kelly ? 

On signings Smith is on record as saying Mapauy for him was too expensive so we looked elsewhere.Suso's experience is from time in  Spanish football brings in Targett / Konsa and Drinkwater ? Engels was close to signing for Brentford was Suso scouting him then as well  https://tbrfootball.com/incoming-brentford-star-bjorn-engels-rejected-arsenal-2016/

The only player we brought in with link to Spanish football is Luiz who was on loan then and has turned out to be the best of the signings 

So then of the other signings who weren't on loan previously we have Nakamba ,Wesley,Guilbert ,Samatta ,Trez  and Heaton .Heaton we know Smith wanted and was a good signing.Wes struggled but had 5 goals and I think would have gotten at least to double figures if he stayed fit but we should have gotten another exp striker I think that much is clear and though more exp Samatta has clearly struggled with the step up in league.Nakama started off well but has gone backwards as the season as gone on.Trez though underwhelming is still our 2 nd highest scorer .For comparison he has 5 goals and cost about 9 mil .Pepe at Arsenal cost 72 mil and has 5 goals..

There is clear issues with coaching ( defending in general and at corners ) and with the signing Smith is as much to blame as anyone else for  this IMO.

In some ways this reminds me of when Lamberts back room staff were sacked and there was this idea they were the big issue and Lambert with them gone would improve ..he didn't  

 

[AvfcRigo82]

3 hours ago, DaveAV1 said:

There’s always an element of risk and  we do have history of crushing the spirit out of managers. Listen I was a big fan of appointing Lambert, so don’t take any notice of me! 

I too was all for and part of the Lambert project and had him down as our equivalent to an Arsené Wenger type dynasty at Villa based on what he did with Norwich.

Didn't end well for him in the end as the board had already begun losing interest and wanted out leaving the wrong people running the club.

[SuffolkVillan]

26 minutes ago, Nabby said:

If he stays and Terry and Suso go and we are still not performing who do we lay the blame on then ?

They may well be part of the problem I just don't buy into them going makes us better.I'll say again why when the coaching is questioned its town to Terry not Smith (who is hands on) and Richard O'Kelly ? 

On signings Smith is on record as saying Mapauy for him was too expensive so we looked elsewhere.Suso's experience is from time in  Spanish football brings in Targett / Konsa and Drinkwater ? Engels was close to signing for Brentford was Suso scouting him then as well  https://tbrfootball.com/incoming-brentford-star-bjorn-engels-rejected-arsenal-2016/

The only player we brought in with link to Spanish football is Luiz who was on loan then and has turned out to be the best of the signings 

So then of the other signings who weren't on loan previously we have Nakamba ,Wesley,Guilbert ,Samatta ,Trez  and Heaton .Heaton we know Smith wanted and was a good signing.Wes struggled but had 5 goals and I think would have gotten at least to double figures if he stayed fit but we should have gotten another exp striker I think that much is clear and though more exp Samatta has clearly struggled with the step up in league.Nakama started off well but has gone backwards as the season as gone on.Trez though underwhelming is still our 2 nd highest scorer .For comparison he has 5 goals and cost about 9 mil .Pepe at Arsenal cost 72 mil and has 5 goals..

There is clear issues with coaching ( defending in general and at corners ) and with the signing Smith is as much to blame as anyone else for  this IMO.

In some ways this reminds me of when Lamberts back room staff were sacked and there was this idea they were the big issue and Lambert with them gone would improve ..he didn't  

 

Great stat comparing Trez to Pepe, yet as much as I love his effort and I'm happy he got 5 goals Trez infuriates the hell out of me and I cannot see him improving. Pepe was very overpriced but when I watch him play I cant help thinking one day he is really going to click.....just hope its not the next game.

[DaveAV1]

42 minutes ago, AvfcRigo82 said:

I too was all for and part of the Lambert project and had him down as our equivalent to an Arsené Wenger type dynasty at Villa based on what he did with Norwich.

Didn't end well for him in the end as the board had already begun losing interest and wanted out leaving the wrong people running the club.

One of the problems we had throughout the Randy Lerner era was he didn’t really have anyone running the football side of things. He just initially let MON do it all and once he turned the tap off MON threw his toys out of the pram and left us in the smelly stuff. I believe the timing of his departure, 5 days before the start of the season was deliberate and meant to inflict damage. Unforgivable in my eyes. However that effectively exposed Lerner at a time when his interest was already fading. 

When Lerner first bought the club Graham Taylor offed his services and although a meeting was arranged Lerner didn’t show up and sent a stand in instead. All that vast football knowledge was lost in that moment. Add to that the letting go of Steve Stride, a man who knew more about the running of the club than anyone for years and although it didn’t make any headlines at the time, a huge amount of damage was done to the club. 

Our new owners need to invest in football men not just businessmen. Otherwise it’s like trying to be a car manufacturer with no one who knows anything about cars. 

[M_Afro]

5 hours ago, DaveAV1 said:

There’s always an element of risk and  we do have history of crushing the spirit out of managers. Listen I was a big fan of appointing Lambert, so don’t take any notice of me! 
 

Out of interest is there anyone you’d particularly be keen on? 

Ha ha. That’s the million dollar question. I don’t have enough knowledge to be honest. I like the bloke at Southampton but I don’t know enough about his previous experience. I would love Rafa to be honest. The guy at Leipzig would be a bit of a coup.

If we have true ambition then I think the owners and CP can sell it to a very good manager. We will only be in the Championship for 1 season (if we do go down) and then we will have a much firmer foundation to build from. The club, stadium, fan base, owners, training ground, city, history all are enough to sell the club to a very good manager if the ambition of the owners is really there. I want them to take our breath away with a signature announcement. The appointment of Dean was the only thing that the owners have done so far which really disappointed me.

[Johnnyp]

8 hours ago, Mjvilla said:

I don't think it's his name or where hes from that makes it a bland appointment.

It's absolutely to do with style. We've all seen a Burnley side play... Well drilled, physical (see Ben mee), direct (wood and Rodriguez upfront suggest they aren't playing much football on the deck). Is that where we want to go? 

We would require a full rebuild, again. We don't have the players for this style. It's just the kind of appointment that makes no sense to me whatsoever. We have selected the way we want avfc to play, which is being implemented through all the avfc age groups. Are we going to rip up the work of the last 20 months to start again and appoint a dyche?

I think he's a good manager, but wrong for us.

 

Care to enlighten me as to what way that is ? We've no style. It's made up as we go along. Don't be silly.  You totally dismiss all the intangibles, what we can't see, that's got them to 54 points. He doesn't suffer fools. Nobody in their team that is above work. They are without ego. Doesn't seem to get too close to any of his players - which i like. He's a bloody good manager and we'd be lucky to have him. Don't get too hung up on his style. It's horses for courses. He has a limited budget and knows what he has to do with it. I've watched Burnley play and win games and play much better than Villa. You don't get to 54 points with a football style alone without all the other things i mentioned .

Edited July 20, 2020 by Johnnyp
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[Zatman]

39 minutes ago, M_Afro said:

Ha ha. That’s the million dollar question. I don’t have enough knowledge to be honest. I like the bloke at Southampton but I don’t know enough about his previous experience. I would love Rafa to be honest. The guy at Leipzig would be a bit of a coup.

 

It would be the greatest managerial coup in the history of coups. Would probably be the most shocking thing to happen in football in a very long time