rjw63 Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 I think Grealish should now pull out with an "injury". 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avfc1982am Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 45 minutes ago, HanoiVillan said: I have a maybe unpopular take on this, which is that fundamentally it is the manager's job to pick the team, not the media or the FA or the fans, and I'm starting to cringe at what is in danger of becoming a circus. I mean, my reaction to sentences like 'Perhaps someone higher up has had a word that he's out of a job if Jack isn't in the squad' (from the previous page) is that that had better not be **** true. I'm not an idiot, and I want Grealish to play for England as well. But I want him to play *because the manager wants him to play*, not because the manager has caved in because an FA suit has told him to, or because he's embarrassed about memes on social media. I understand your point but cannot completely agree. The National Team is a totally different thing compared to club football. As for instance in the case of Jack and England. Most want him in because it's bloody obvious he is head and shoulders above most other players in the squad. Patriotism will far outweigh the concerns over a nob of a bloke that can't see the wood for the trees. Nobody but maybe a few people actually give a shit whether a failed manager rates a player or not. The Nation will have it's own opinion, which will either side with the manager or not, Southgate is becoming more isolated because of his stupidity and stubbornness and his own excuses. How can anyone therefore expect him to make the right decision when he is wrapped up in his own nonsense trying to turn this into a him v Villa issue?! Southgate has only himself to blame in all this. F*** him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveAV1 Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 27 minutes ago, HanoiVillan said: I have a maybe unpopular take on this, which is that fundamentally it is the manager's job to pick the team, not the media or the FA or the fans, and I'm starting to cringe at what is in danger of becoming a circus. I mean, my reaction to sentences like 'Perhaps someone higher up has had a word that he's out of a job if Jack isn't in the squad' (from the previous page) is that that had better not be **** true. I'm not an idiot, and I want Grealish to play for England as well. But I want him to play *because the manager wants him to play*, not because the manager has caved in because an FA suit has told him to, or because he's embarrassed about memes on social media. I agree with your general point that the manager should pick the team and not outside parties like the press. However the England manager’s job goes way beyond simply picking the team and matters on the pitch. Rightly or wrongly dealing with the press now plays a significant role in his job as it does in most high profile sports. To be drawn into a public spat and in such an immature way is frankly just wrong. To say that Mason Mount’s only fault is not to be Jack, is something I’d expect from a teenager on Facebook. He’s right Mason Mount hasn’t done anything wrong but neither has Jack. Surely the England manager shouldn’t be using either of them in his childish slanging match with the press. If the England manager even looks at memes, let alone be effected by them, he’s in the wrong job I feel equally for both players. Both of them are being failed by their international manager, who should be protecting them from the press, not involving them in this way. I doubt the players or their clubs are impressed. I’d imagine their clubs are quietly furious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom13 Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 12 hours ago, Keyblade said: I'm starting to wonder if he even watched Jack last season. He was doing all of that too? He had more goal contributions than both Greenwood and Foden last season, and when it came to chances created, no English players created more than him last season. In fact, nobody not named Kevin De Bruyne created more chances than him last season, especially from open play where the gap widens even further. If I'm remembering it correctly, only 4 players in all of Europe created more chances than him last season. He's just making an excuse because his stats are currently world class. None of the players he mentioned had more than 1 goal contribution per game last season. By his logic now, Jack is easily first choice then, but I expect him to come up with some other excuse on that too. Those quotes from Southgate are hilarious and prove how basic he is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom13 Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 13 hours ago, kieranavfc said: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2020/11/11/england-not-blind-good-player-jack-grealish-handed-another-chance/ Can someone please c+p the full article? I don't wanna put my card details in for a trial. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrBlack Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 1 hour ago, VillanousOne said: he'll probably start in the meaningless/pointless Ireland friendly and play well again and then get dropped for the other games and not even get a sniff. Gareth might give him a five minute cameo in one of the competitive matches, but the goofy twonk will do anything he can to avoid starting Grealish in a competitive match. Hope i'm wrong. I just cant see how he will do this again, and expect to keep his job. Given the level of criticism and questions he has faced since doing that after the MotM performance against Wales, there is no way he's planning to do the same again. If he does, he is asking for ridicule and an untenable position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Silvers Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 I would love to plant Southgate just in front of Bryson DeChambeaus Tee box on the range when he whips out that 48" driver for a bit of long range practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodders Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 i think fans on social media are complete bell-ends but southgate should be ignoring it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 21 minutes ago, Phil Silvers said: when he whips out that 48" driver 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Silvers Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 14 minutes ago, Rodders said: i think fans on social media are complete bell-ends but southgate should be ignoring it. Absolutely but he is completely out of his depth in every way possible, when the plain facts are in front of you, you simply pick a system that adapts itself to the best and most in form players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodders Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 Most people won't agree, and that's fair enough, but I think the anti-southgate rhetoric is out of proportion to his record as England manager. We've had no-one half decent since Sven? and even then he ruined Scholes. Southgate is conservative, and we can do better, but he's far more competent than some of the others we've had given the side we've had lately. I absolutely do not mean to elevate him to a level beyond criticism, but i think the stick he gets beaten with is excessive. That said, I'll welcome a more enterprising approach from someone who doesn't load the side with right backs or eric dier 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 1 minute ago, Rodders said: Most people won't agree, and that's fair enough, but I think the anti-southgate rhetoric is out of proportion to his record as England manager. We've had no-one half decent since Sven? and even then he ruined Scholes. Southgate is conservative, and we can do better, but he's far more competent than some of the others we've had given the side we've had lately. I absolutely do not mean to elevate him to a level beyond criticism, but i think the stick he gets beaten with is excessive. That said, I'll welcome a more enterprising approach from someone who doesn't load the side with right backs or eric dier One or two recent lacklustre performances suggests Southgates limitations have been found out, but beating Belgium also shows Southgate does seem to have the capacity to "pull a Homer" . Jack has the potential to get him out of a hole and give him a Plan B ... forgetting the meme comments , Southgate has been speaking positively about Jack ,about him listening to what "we" have been telling him and his pressing play also improving .. it suggests to me Southgate knows he **** up by not playing him v Denmark and has given himself manoeuvre room to start Jack now without looking like he's bowed to media pressure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barry'sboots Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 4 minutes ago, Rodders said: Most people won't agree, and that's fair enough, but I think the anti-southgate rhetoric is out of proportion to his record as England manager. We've had no-one half decent since Sven? and even then he ruined Scholes. Southgate is conservative, and we can do better, but he's far more competent than some of the others we've had given the side we've had lately. I absolutely do not mean to elevate him to a level beyond criticism, but i think the stick he gets beaten with is excessive. That said, I'll welcome a more enterprising approach from someone who doesn't load the side with right backs or eric dier You said it yourself in that last paragraph. The way he is setting this England team to play counter attacking defensive football is crazy when you look at the players that he has at his disposal. This England team should expect to go into every game and dominate possession with a few exceptions where we should still be looking to go toe to toe and backing the talent that we have. Even if we lose a few it is not wasted as this is a young English team that should, if properly coached, only get better! His record as England Manager is okay but is certainly no better than the team/talent he has at his disposal imho. The best team we beat in the World Cup was the Swedes, so hardly a wringing endorsement for Southgate being a terrific manager. I know that the Belgians have some very good players - De Bruyne and Hazard etc. - but I also think they have some average players that we should be taking advantage of but probably won't why Southgate is running the show with his uber cautious approach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Silvers Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 His record is fake though and based on hand picked friendlies against weak opposition. He is tactically inept, has no vision, puts personal preferences in the way of picking better and inform players, how Pickford and Maguire get in the squad let alone starting is bewildering. He is a safe yes man, the people above need to grow a pair and get someone in who can really take us out for a real spin. No one deserves to be treated with that level of nastiness that he gets on social media but he does everything he possibly can to bring on some criticism. Southgate out. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted November 12, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted November 12, 2020 2 hours ago, VillanousOne said: he'll probably start in the meaningless/pointless Ireland friendly and play well again and then get dropped for the other games and not even get a sniff. Gareth might give him a five minute cameo in one of the competitive matches, but the goofy twonk will do anything he can to avoid starting Grealish in a competitive match. Hope i'm wrong. Jack deserves a chance to play with the big boys now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodders Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 2 minutes ago, tonyh29 said: One or two recent lacklustre performances suggests Southgates limitations have been found out, but beating Belgium also shows Southgate does seem to have the capacity to "pull a Homer" . Jack has the potential to get him out of a hole and give him a Plan B ... forgetting the meme comments , Southgate has been speaking positively about Jack ,about him listening to what "we" have been telling him and his pressing play also improving .. it suggests to me Southgate knows he **** up by not playing him v Denmark and has given himself manoeuvre room to start Jack now without looking like he's bowed to media pressure Maybe. I guess for me he's a coach who had his settled side and didn't want to immediately disrupt it, and is guilty of being a couple of games late in giving Jack a bigger chance to shine. 7 minutes ago, barry'sboots said: You said it yourself in that last paragraph. The way he is setting this England team to play counter attacking defensive football is crazy when you look at the players that he has at his disposal. This England team should expect to go into every game and dominate possession with a few exceptions where we should still be looking to go toe to toe and backing the talent that we have. Even if we lose a few it is not wasted as this is a young English team that should, if properly coached, only get better! His record as England Manager is okay but is certainly no better than the team/talent he has at his disposal imho. The best team we beat in the World Cup was the Swedes, so hardly a wringing endorsement for Southgate being a terrific manager. I know that the Belgians have some very good players - De Bruyne and Hazard etc. - but I also think they have some average players that we should be taking advantage of but probably won't why Southgate is running the show with his uber cautious approach. Fair. And it's not a point I'm sufficiently passionate about to argue strongly on, given that I think he's a 6, 6.5/10 manager, no more but I just think the Grealish hype and chat that has occurred over the past few squads has spilled over into embarrassing by some of our fans, that was all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolta Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 3 hours ago, sidcow said: Yeah, it's now become a monster of a "thing" and he's clearly got his nose out of joint over it, which with Southgate is a pretty serious problem. The national team and Grealish can do without the circus that's now developing. But I still say Southgate created the circus, if he just answered the questions put to him this whole Mason Mount situation would not even exist. And also if he hadn't played Mount at left wing in the last game. Mind boggling decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdman Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 Southgates handling of Jack has been curious at best but generally quite petulant. Behind the scenes in camp I suspect they all get on and have a laugh about it all but he definitely has a chip on his shoulder with Villa which has emerged in various interviews. As a England manager he shouldn't allow himself to be dragged down to meme level and although I appreciate him trying to have a bit of banter, it seems tainted with a little bitterness. Just my take on it anyway. In a more positive note I think it has finally dawned on him that Jack can massively improve this England team. I just hope he's braver with future team selections. It would be shame to waste all the talent he has at his disposal! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danceoftheshamen Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 (edited) Have to agree that Garreth has created this whole situation himself with his constant references to Mason Mount when being asked by all & sundry why Grealish hadn't been picked "again", so to try to turn it onto Villa fans shows a high level of balloon ego, a balloon in which he clearly is struggling to see the reality of the outside World from within as it most definately isn't mainly Villa fans making the noise any longer (although maybe initially we helped get the ball rolling). No, on the contrary when i go in to work now it's not me or the other Villa fans who spark up coversations about Grealish it's quite the opposite! It's a large work area here up in the East Mids with hundreds of staff full of Fans of mainly the sky 4 & the East mids teams Leicester, Forest & Derby plus a couple of Leeds fans. There are actually a fair share of Villa fans too, around 4 or 5 which is on a par with the numbers who support the East mids teams which says something! In fact there are more Villa than a lot of the big London clubs such as Arsenal, Spurs & Chelsea. Incidentally there are zero Sha or West Brom & just the one Wolves fan. Anyway my point is it's the fans of all those clubs who constantly are talking about Grealish and shaking their heads in disbelief that he's not playing for England, not the Villa fans who i think like me tend to not mention it as it sounds like typical "fan moaning about his clubs player not being picked" stuff. So Southgate really is clearly stuck in his balloon and out of touch with the general feeling in the whole of the footballing World, not just the Villa fans who he is trying to belittle. Edited November 12, 2020 by danceoftheshamen 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post villalad21 Posted November 12, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 12, 2020 I wouldn't swap him for anyone in the world. He is everything for us. Invaluable. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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