Team shape, tactics and personnel

[Tom13]

We're very lucky to have Kamara.

Only player that comes near any of those in today's game is Xhaka. He is a massive presence. Superb passer of the ball as well.

[Laughable Chimp]

7 hours ago, El-Reacho said:

Teams are playing much higher risk passes from the back nowadays though. City have been picked off a few times recently with high risk passes when they’re being pressed. Pep’s (and maybe Emery’s) analysts will probably have worked out the risk of conceding versus the reward of beating a high press through the middle and reckon it’s worth it.

This was probably true in the past and still is right now but as we saw with this game, other people are catching on to it. No tactic reigns supreme forever as other teams learn to counter them.

Being stubbornly dogmatic to one specific football philosophy is probably the main reason why once successful football managers fall off. Just because it worked very well once doesn't mean it will work forever. Football isn't a static game.

Edited February 6, 2023 by Laughable Chimp

[Kiwivillan]

3 hours ago, TRO said:

I guess you don't watch other teams, in the Prem.....or appreciate the art of tackling...

but Vinnie was an extreme example....every team needs a hard B****** to some degree.

 

That kind of football at top level was stamped out ages ago for good reason

[Sulberto21]

5 hours ago, TRO said:

I guess you don't watch other teams, in the Prem.....or appreciate the art of tackling...

but Vinnie was an extreme example....every team needs a hard B****** to some degree.

 

We’ve been tackling very well under Emery. We lost because we made 4 catastrophic errors and they got punished. That’s unprecedented. 1 maybe 2 catastrophic errors usually get punished but not 4. 

[Stevo985]

5 hours ago, TRO said:

Not with the same Venom....The ones I like, is where opponents are too scared to come near them....and too afraid to look at them in the tunnel.

Roy Keane and Paul Ince......Viera and Petit......Souness and Case.....Jones and Wise.....Giles and Bremner.

We miss Steve McMahon too......snapping at the heels.

...all pussies today.

Unai needs one of that type, in the squad.

 

It’s not 1987 anymore

[Vive_La_Villa]

For the record a hospital pass is one where it’s weak so a defender has time to put a challenge in before it gets to you.  It wasn’t a hospital pass and I’m pretty sure Kamara would have asked for it. It’s a way of playing we have to get used to under Unai to beat the press. Hopefully it doesn’t cost us too many goals! 

[StefanAVFC]

[CVByrne]

14 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

For the record a hospital pass is one where it’s weak so a defender has time to put a challenge in before it gets to you.  It wasn’t a hospital pass and I’m pretty sure Kamara would have asked for it. It’s a way of playing we have to get used to under Unai to beat the press. Hopefully it doesn’t cost us too many goals! 

We just lack the players to build up from the back to a high level. We need two new players in the back line for it. Carlos is one and a new RCB/RB will be another.

[Laughable Chimp]

16 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

For the record a hospital pass is one where it’s weak so a defender has time to put a challenge in before it gets to you.  It wasn’t a hospital pass and I’m pretty sure Kamara would have asked for it. It’s a way of playing we have to get used to under Unai to beat the press. Hopefully it doesn’t cost us too many goals! 

I disagree. There's a time and place for that pass, and that was not it. The risk vs reward just isn't worth it.

 

[Tomaszk]

City losing the ball in their own box at Spurs.

They need to get rid of Rodri and bring in a Vinnie Jones type.

[Vive_La_Villa]

1 minute ago, Laughable Chimp said:

I disagree. There's a time and place for that pass, and that was not it. The risk vs reward just isn't worth it.

 

I agree the pass shouldn’t have been made I just heard the term hospital pass used and that wasn’t one. Playing from the back should be out wide really. An Arsenal fan told me they once conceded the exact goal under Emery. Under Arteta they only ever play it wide of the box.
 

 I do wonder what Emery’s instruction is about the initial pass but sometimes if your outfield players calls for it you just trust them.

[Leeroy]

14 hours ago, Sulberto21 said:

Wolves have a world class manager too Lopetegui is a great manager and knows Don Unai well. They also have good players. They’re in a false position. 

Leicester probably are too given the quality of some of their players especially in midfield but it doesn't mean it wasn't a poor result to both teams given how rubbish both teams have been most of the season.

 

I'd also say we're in a slightly false position as quality wise we're probably better than a few teams above us and had Gerrard holding us back for over a quarter of the season.

[Sulberto21]

53 minutes ago, Tomaszk said:

City losing the ball in their own box at Spurs.

They need to get rid of Rodri and bring in a Vinnie Jones type.

Eff that get this guy in:

like to see our midfield get breached then!

[wict01]

I thought we played relatively well, as others have said. On another day, we could've had 5 ourselves. The main issue for me was Kamara being off it (no criticism, it just wasn't his best game - he has more than enough credit in the bank) and as a result, any mistakes made by the back 4 were amplified. I thought Mings was shaky, as much as I like him, and Digne offered absolutely nothing defensively or offensively in the first half. Moreno was an improvement but, again, punished decisively for his error on the 4th goal.

Leicester's front 4 worried me before kick off because it has the capacity to cause trouble and score goals, as it did on Saturday. Defensively they are poor, but they do carry a threat going forwards. That combined with our own complacency cost us the game. Plus Iheanacho, Maddison and Barnes love playing against us so to have all 3 of those on the pitch together was just pure kryptonite. 

You can see what Emery wants us to do and we have to persist with it. Would not be surprised in the slightest to see us go to the King Power (whenever that is) and put this right. 

 

[The Other Mat]

19 minutes ago, Sulberto21 said:

Eff that get this guy in:

like to see our midfield get breached then!

Not sure he'd get away with 10 consecutive German suplexes nowadays with VAR being in play. 

[IrishVilla10]

 This is what we’re trying to do 

[AntrimBlack]

I think Martinez needed to judge whether that pass to Kamara was a good idea.  All the defenders need to consider on every occasion if the best option is to work it out from the back or hit it long.

Just use your head and your experience and err on the side of caution.

 

[TRO]

10 hours ago, Kiwivillan said:

That kind of football at top level was stamped out ages ago for good reason

I see excerpts from it, in games now.

sure my reference to it, is a purposeful exaggeration, to showcase a point.....we are the opposite and that can be just as bad.

as an example....where was Cashs tackle on Harvey Barnes for their 4th goal, sure we all know Moreno, was the main culprit, but the passive approach from Cash, allowed the lottery ball to come in.

There are clear examples this year of X rated tackles, culminating in 8 Red cards in half a season.

I would say that in terms of niggly tackles and sly physical challenges, it's worse now than it was then....I didn't see many players pulled by the arm, or shirt pulling as rife as it is now....or ankle taps.

Sure it was far more blatant, years back, and referee's turned a blind eye....but in a more stealthy way, it sill goes on.

Its just that, we don't do much of it.

PS The reference to Vinne was light hearted, not to be taken literally.....but I wished we had a watered down version of him, like our own Steve McMahon.

Edited February 6, 2023 by TRO

[TRO]

4 hours ago, Sulberto21 said:

We’ve been tackling very well under Emery. We lost because we made 4 catastrophic errors and they got punished. That’s unprecedented. 1 maybe 2 catastrophic errors usually get punished but not 4. 

we didn't tackle Barnes, for their 4th.....just shadowed him, and watched him launch a bomb in to our defence.

[TRO]

54 minutes ago, AntrimBlack said:

I think Martinez needed to judge whether that pass to Kamara was a good idea.  All the defenders need to consider on every occasion if the best option is to work it out from the back or hit it long.

Just use your head and your experience and err on the side of caution.

 

He saw Olsen make a the same mistake against Stevenage, He was in the stand watching....He made a similar mistake against Brighton.

How much learning do they need?

Its just simple stupidity....These are no Sunday Morning league Goal Keepers.