Gareth Southgate

[KentVillan]

The annoying thing is that people aren't telling Southgate exactly what XI to pick. We know that it's hard to choose between Sterling / Grealish / Foden / Bowen / Saka and similarly between Walker / James / Trippier / TAA. Everyone understands he has hard decisions in those positions.

But if he played a 4-1-4-1 / 4-3-3 he'd have a much easier time getting it right.

            Pickford
Trent   Stones    Maguire    Shaw
              Rice
     Bellingham     Mount
  Foden               Sterling
              Kane

That's the obvious shape, and then you can stick Grealish in for Sterling or James in for Trent or Mings in for Maguire... whatever you want. But it's similar to the shape these guys play for their clubs, and where they've had their best performances.

He's playing a weird formation as if the available players make it necessary. But look at that lineup above and you can see we comfortably have the talent to play a normal formation. Every single position is loaded with Champions League quality talent, except maybe CB and keeper.

[Vancvillan]

3 hours ago, KentVillan said:

It’s the Sven era all over again.

To be fair to Sven, he'd won something like 19 club competitions including two in Europe. He was a decorated club manager.

Southgate got Middlesbrough relegated and led the England U21 when they finished bottom of their group at the Euros.

It's baffling that he was ever chosen, and what should be the most exciting team since 1990 is absolutely wasted on him.

I agree with everything else in your post.

[KentVillan]

12 minutes ago, Vancvillan said:

To be fair to Sven, he'd won something like 19 club competitions including two in Europe. He was a decorated club manager.

Southgate got Middlesbrough relegated and led the England U21 when they finished bottom of their group at the Euros.

It's baffling that he was ever chosen, and what should be the most exciting team since 1990 is absolutely wasted on him.

I agree with everything else in your post.

Oh yeah, as I said, Sven was a bit unlucky. His system would have been great if he'd been named England manager a few years earlier.

But there's no doubt the whole "Gerrard Lampard problem" would have been solved in a heartbeat by just playing a lone striker and sticking Hargreaves or Scholes behind Gerrard and Lampard. So his inflexibility cost us badly.

But you're right, Southgate was a worse appointment in that he had no track record whatsoever, and his track record with England (World Cup semi, Euro final) is based on two very lucky draws.

He's a decent person with great values, who deserves credit for what he's done to promote a modern, diverse England, and to protect the players from the media. That doesn't give his dog shit football a free pass, though. Terrible manager, needs binning ASAP.

Edited June 4, 2022 by KentVillan

[sharkyvilla]

I'll stick my head on the line and say Southgate has done an OK job so far.  The 2018 squad was largely garbage and I think he did well to construct a team that edged our side of the draw, albeit it wasn't a very high quality half.  Stuff like the set pieces we were doing and Walker in a back 3 were quite innovative for an England team.  It was a rare World Cup where the public had zero expectations which helps massively of course and still gives him a lot of credit in the bank for casual fans.

Then the Euros he realised to get far in tournaments it's often the most defensive and boring teams that go into the latter stages/finals.  He set us up that way and I absolutely hated watching it but like everyone else, come the quarter finals it was great to get wrapped up in.  The ends pretty much justified the means, though I felt Italy were there for the taking when we were 1-0 up and he ballsed it up with his game management.  Still the penalties could have gone either way.

Now though there are no excuses.  He's got so much depth with some top class players that have grown as a group together and have plenty of tournament experience that he has to let them loose.  This Hungary game was an embarrassment.  There is no need for the back 3 any more and shoehorning favourite players in is a load of dogshit.  I joked in the match thread that Jack running 20 yards with the ball made him a very naughty boy, as he is now only deemed good enough because his contributions of walking with it, turning and passing backwards is better teamwork only learnable at a team like City.  It's nonsense and giving Jack freedom might just be the kind of thing that makes the difference this time.  If it's not Jack, then it could be Foden, or preferably both.

[Davkaus]

1 hour ago, Vancvillan said:

To be fair to Sven, he'd won something like 19 club competitions including two in Europe. He was a decorated club manager.

Southgate got Middlesbrough relegated and led the England U21 when they finished bottom of their group at the Euros.

It's baffling that he was ever chosen, and what should be the most exciting team since 1990 is absolutely wasted on him.

I agree with everything else in your post.

He was chosen because that bent **** Allardyce humiliated the FA, and they'd rather fail safe than risk a wildcard showing them up in the tabloids again.

They want a nice man, who only does missionary with his wife, in bed by 10 after a meat and two veg supper, maybe has a cheeky wine in front of Saturday night primetime ITV. Football comes second to the image of a boring, wholesome respectable man.

Honestly, Southgate has massively exceeded expectations, even though a good manager would have won something with this generation. Expectations are simple; do not embarrass the FA.

[KentVillan]

23 minutes ago, sharkyvilla said:

I'll stick my head on the line and say Southgate has done an OK job so far.  The 2018 squad was largely garbage and I think he did well to construct a team that edged our side of the draw, albeit it wasn't a very high quality half.  Stuff like the set pieces we were doing and Walker in a back 3 were quite innovative for an England team.  It was a rare World Cup where the public had zero expectations which helps massively of course and still gives him a lot of credit in the bank for casual fans.

I think he did a decent enough job in the Russia World Cup, but since then the quality of player available to him has improved a lot, and he's still doing the same things.

[Dodgyknees]

55 minutes ago, Davkaus said:

He was chosen because that bent **** Allardyce humiliated the FA, and they'd rather fail safe than risk a wildcard showing them up in the tabloids again.

They want a nice man, who only does missionary with his wife, in bed by 10 after a meat and two veg supper, maybe has a cheeky wine in front of Saturday night primetime ITV. Football comes second to the image of a boring, wholesome respectable man.

Honestly, Southgate has massively exceeded expectations, even though a good manager would have won something with this generation. Expectations are simple; do not embarrass the FA.

I bet he triple layers condoms. 

[Hank Scorpio]

45 minutes ago, Dodgyknees said:

I bet he triple layers condoms. 

The Rice Phillips manoeuvre

Followed by a lovely double pivot 

[PaulC]

If I have to make am excuse for his tactics, he doesnt trust his centre backs. No matter which ones play. Theres a serious lack of pace there so he either plays a back 3 unless Kyle Walker plays at RB so he can cover the cbs. I dont thinks hes rigid in his formation like Sven with his 4-4--2. He has tried different things. But to me hes just a yes man. Says all the right things, keeps the players happy but hes not a top manager and it would be a shame if this crop of players failed to win a major trophy for the want of picking a less safe choice. 

Edited June 5, 2022 by PaulC

[Zatman]

Just now, PaulC said:

If I have to make am excuse for his tactics, he doesnt trust his centre backs. No matter which ones play. Theres a serious lack of pace there so he either plays a back 3 unless Kyle Walker plays at RB so he can cover the cbs. I dont thinks hes rigid in his formation like Sven with his 4-4--2. He has tried different things. But to me hes just a yes man. Says all the right things, keeps the players happy but hes not a top manager and it would be a shame of this crop of players failed to win a major trophy for the want of picking a less safe choice. 

He doesn't trust his centre backs but then makes a tactic none of his centre backs have played at club level except Coady who is really out of his depth at international level

[PaulC]

1 minute ago, Zatman said:

He doesn't trust his centre backs but then makes a tactic none of his centre backs have played at club level except Coady who is really out of his depth at international level

Yes I agree with you 

[Xela]

Maguire is terrible at the minute, Stones hardly plays for his club, Walker is not a CB and Coady is a cheerleader. White, Guehi and Tomari are injured but still picked. Yet he drops Mings.

Southgate is no manager, he's just a spokesman for the FA. I have no doubt he's an inherently decent bloke but he's out of his depth. 

[R.Bear]

13 hours ago, Davkaus said:

They want a nice man, who only does missionary with his wife

[Zatman]

 

[Rds1983]

"Gareth Southgate has urged England fans not to ’embarrass’ the nation as the Three Lions prepare to face Germany in Munich". 

Don't worry Gareth, you'll embarrass us enough on your own. 

[stewiek2]

He is far too defensive. Hoof ball all game. Subs were defenders and when chasing the game rather than bring on Abraham or Sterling he opts for Kalvin Philips, having already brought Saka on but play him at full back and John Stones on. We've a cracking group of attacking players being destroyed by his negativity. He's been vastly lucky in tournament draws and is again with the world cup group. Sat what you like about Mings but England's record with him at left side of defence rather than shoehorn right footed carthorse Maguire is there to see. 3 at the back plus two defensive midfielders then subs are defensive (Grealish aside) is just a joke.

[villa4europe]

53 minutes ago, Zatman said:

 

He gets it

The phillips stuff is bang on

[TheAuthority]

On 05/06/2022 at 05:57, Xela said:

Maguire is terrible at the minute, Stones hardly plays for his club, Walker is not a CB and Coady is a cheerleader. White, Guehi and Tomari are injured but still picked. Yet he drops Mings.

Southgate is no manager, he's just a spokesman for the FA. I have no doubt he's an inherently decent bloke but he's out of his depth. 

I actually think Tyrone's decision to speak out on certain "controversial" (not really) issues has cost him his place. Garth and the FA want bland faceless players who say nothing - just like Garth was as a player funnily enough.

[The_Steve]

Danny Murphy said on TS that United should have appointed Southgate. Never has a manager failed so upwardly. Utter fraud in a waistcoat. 

[villa4europe]

6 minutes ago, The_Steve said:

Danny Murphy said on TS that United should have appointed Southgate. Never has a manager failed so upwardly. Utter fraud in a waistcoat. 

I would bet everything I own on Danny Murphy not being able to give a detailed technical explanation as to why