terrytini Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 (edited) For those doubting how good he could be for us next year (including myself !) A Big Plus - Bruce has shown twice now (with us) that he can go on winning runs. You simply HAVE to have that to get promoted. A Big Minus - he has shown us once he can go on a losing run. Everyone who gets promoted will have at least one. On the other hand if you have two you will definitely struggle. Jury out. Another Big Plus - he has shown us once that he can recover from a poor run and go on a good one (twice if you count when he took over). You HAVE to have that in your locker too. So in terms of results there is little question his Pros, from the evidence we have at present, is that he does in fact have a good chance of success. Despite my doubts I find it hard to picture how the Club could go into next season with anybody who significantly betters that outlook. As such he will be with us next season - so all the more reason IMO he tries stuff now to see what works for him, as clearly some of his ideas have proven, shall we say, more successful than others. As such I don't mind what he tries as long as there is some discernible logic in it. Edited March 17, 2017 by terrytini Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 2 hours ago, Jas10 said: Where did you get the idea that I am blaming Bruce for the failures of the past? I didn't indicate that at all, maybe you are relating previous posts to mine... It's simply not the case, I've actually put the past to one side and don't see the need to draw on it at all really. As I stated, I fully appreciate the changes that have been made off the field involving the new boardroom and staff. I feel a lot of good work is being done, and is continuing, in that sense and am confident that we are in much better hands with Dr. Xia and Wyness. I've never said otherwise. On Bruce, I've only judged him on his time with us and, although I don't want to repeat all of the previous thoughts and sentiments yet again, there are undeniable factors that demonstrate that he has made some bad decisions and often given the impression that the job is too big for him or that he could not find solutions to "on the field" issues. Hopefully that is over now but we had a terrible run of poor results and bad performances too so I don't see how anyone can just let that slide. I'm giving him (some) credit for winning games now and, as I've said before, I don't have anything against him personally but if he's not doing well for us then I, and other fans, have every right to be critical and annoyed. Ultimately, if he keeps getting results and winning us games and that leads to promotion I will be completely happy. I just don't know if that will definitely happen though and I don't think it's an unreasonable stance. Again, I have yet to see true evidence that we will definitely be pushing for promotion next season. I am in the wait and see boat! I feel that my concerns are justified but I am hoping for the best anyway. I could say, "I hope I am proven wrong" but I am not definitively stating whether that will or will not happen just my current feeling and thoughts on the matter. I absolutely hope we will continue to improve, I realise that takes time and don't think there is anyone who doesn't realise that and needs that explaining to them, and I very much hope we get promoted next season - that is the priority. If that happens, Bruce will get the praise (don't worry about that) but if there aren't encouraging signs early on then I am afraid that swift action will need to be taken - we can't afford to spend another year in this league imo...the Doc has given all the support he can (and I believe that will continue, we're lucky to have him), it's up to the management and players to do the rest... I appreciate your comments, but still say they seem paradoxical to me you make references to "looking for evidence" to negate your doubt in him, but you equally have no evidence to the contrary, but you seem to have chosen to accept that as your default position. i think some of us see him as a success, until he proves he is a failure.....and some see him as a failure until he proves he is a success......by definition, some will be happy Now, some will have to wait, I'm afraid. I accept you reserve the right to have doubt in his ability and I accept that you are not blaming him for our overall state. However, what I fail to understand is when a team is in transition, why are comments being made that insinuate we are the finished article.The team won't be the free flowing blow the opposition away force that we ALL want to see. I can't speak for the man himself, but I am sure by his comments that he is clear on the strengths and weaknesses of his team.....These things take time to fully fix, so is it any wonder that when still see flaws is part of the journey. It may wel be this team will look different again in A few seasons time , in having to improve each players attributes. Steve has started out with an impressive start, then hit a rocky spell of losing 2 key players and stumbling in to window that could have been 2 months earlier ideally....He has now found some form once again as his players are getting to know how each other operates. Progress, too, is not ALL plain sailing.....it is quite customary to zig zag your way to success. UTV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 10 minutes ago, TRO said: I appreciate your comments, but still say they seem paradoxical to me you make references to "looking for evidence" to negate your doubt in him, but you equally have no evidence to the contrary, but you seem to have chosen to accept that as your default position. i think some of us see him as a success, until he proves he is a failure.....and some see him as a failure until he proves he is a success......by definition, some will be happy Now, some will have to wait, I'm afraid. I accept you reserve the right to have doubt in his ability and I accept that you are not blaming him for our overall state. However, what I fail to understand is when a team is in transition, why are comments being made that insinuate we are the finished article.The team won't be the free flowing blow the opposition away force that we ALL want to see. I can't speak for the man himself, but I am sure by his comments that he is clear on the strengths and weaknesses of his team.....These things take time to fully fix, so is it any wonder that when still see flaws is part of the journey. It may wel be this team will look different again in A few seasons time , in having to improve each players attributes. Steve has started out with an impressive start, then hit a rocky spell of losing 2 key players and stumbling in to window that could have been 2 months earlier ideally....He has now found some form once again as his players are getting to know how each other operates. Progress, too, is not ALL plain sailing.....it is quite customary to zig zag your way to success. UTV And another larger group see neither (or both) as yet. Without answering for him that's what I read from the OP. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 50 minutes ago, tinker said: Well Gardner needs to step up or we need a replacement that can play that role, For me, Jed was never suited to being a defensive midfielder, good in the air and strong but slow and cumbersome while chasing down, tackling and intercepting the ball. Jed was very good defensive midfielder . Happy to see him in centre defence and get back to 442 though - could work very well with these players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 2 hours ago, Farlz said: 433 is our best formation, not pleased he's trying to force 2 up front yet again. Although 442 against Wednesday was arguably our best performance under Bruce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imavillan Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 (edited) i for one am already looking forward to next season, where with Bruce in charge, we will be in a far stronger position to mount a promotion challenge than we were at the start of this season. imo, he knows what he's doing. He is not stupid (could question that managing the shits). He knows what it takes to get out of this league. He will more than likely make a couple or so more signings in the close season. For obvious reasons, this is the first time i've watched the championship at close hand and the top teams have one thing in common, solidarity, this is something that everyone can see is being built and installed into the team. Couple that with the undoubted quality of players we have and there is so much to be optimistic about next season. Yes, you can say the same for some of the other teams, but i have no doubt we will spend all of next season in the top 4 of this division. Then once you have momentum.... .....boom. Bring it on, with Bruce leading the charge. Edited March 17, 2017 by imavillan correct spelling error, again!!!!!! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farlz Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 I do agree the switch to 442 worked against Wednesday but we can't forget how poor we were with the formation previously. Maybe now the players have settled in things will be a lot different and it'll click, I just think it's no coincidence whenever we move away from 433 we struggle. For what it's worth I'd love us to be able to use 2 up top because Kodjia and Hogan could be the best partnership in the league. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post sne Posted March 17, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted March 17, 2017 27 minutes ago, imavillan said: i for one am already looking forward to next season, where with Bruce in charge, we will be in a far stranger position to mount a promotion challenge than we were at the start of this season. This sounds exciting! About time we had a bit of mystery about us. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, terrytini said: And another larger group see neither (or both) as yet. Without answering for him that's what I read from the OP. sadly, I didn't. Edited March 17, 2017 by TRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imavillan Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 36 minutes ago, sne said: This sounds exciting! About time we had a bit of mystery about us. lol......i'm off to the edit button again !!!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodders0223 Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 1 hour ago, kurtsimonw said: Although 442 against Wednesday was arguably our best performance under Bruce and our worst against Forest, Newcastle, Ipswich and Barnsley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 14 minutes ago, rodders0223 said: and our worst against Forest, Newcastle, Ipswich and Barnsley. Three of those games we were the better side. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
srsmithusa Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 I don't think Jedi at the back is a good idea. He's not fast enough for center half if an opponent tries to break quickly. But I'm aware that I could be wrong and there are some ways to compensate. So, I'm OK with Bruce trying it, as long as he quickly adapts if it doesn't work. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Nigel Posted March 17, 2017 VT Supporter Popular Post Share Posted March 17, 2017 38 minutes ago, rodders0223 said: and our worst against Forest, Newcastle, Ipswich and Barnsley. Now is the time to try new things out. Next season we need to know what works and what doesnt! 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveAV1 Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 1 hour ago, srsmithusa said: I don't think Jedi at the back is a good idea. He's not fast enough for center half if an opponent tries to break quickly. But I'm aware that I could be wrong and there are some ways to compensate. So, I'm OK with Bruce trying it, as long as he quickly adapts if it doesn't work. I'm also concerned about Jedi's lack of pace as a centre half. However I'm not sure who Wigan have up front and if they have any speed merchants. More of a worry is who will play at DM instead of him? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 1 hour ago, rodders0223 said: and our worst against Forest, Newcastle, Ipswich and Barnsley. We played with a back 3 against Forest, Kodjia played wide left against Newcastle. Fairly sure we played back 3 against Ipswich as I recall Adomah/Green playing wing back. Barnsley I can't remember too well, I know Kodjia scored from the left but not sure if he played there or up front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel Posted March 17, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted March 17, 2017 2 hours ago, DaveAV1 said: I'm also concerned about Jedi's lack of pace as a centre half. However I'm not sure who Wigan have up front and if they have any speed merchants. More of a worry is who will play at DM instead of him? Not all great defenders needed pace! Positioning and reading of play are far more desirable attributes, both of which he seems to posess. Only time will tell if he can adapt them to the new position but I think he has it in his locker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 Interesting to see how it works out tomorrow with a 4-4-2. I'm not sure it's the right move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted March 17, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted March 17, 2017 1 hour ago, Nigel said: Not all great defenders needed pace! Positioning and reading of play are far more desirable attributes, both of which he seems to posess. Only time will tell if he can adapt them to the new position but I think he has it in his locker Oh come on, Defenders absolutely have to have pace. Where would McGrath have been without his lightning turn of pace? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAMAICAN-VILLAN Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 To be honest I still think 3-5-2/5-3-2 changeable into 4-3-3 is a great way forward. I could be wrong, but I think people may be too quick to jump to the conclusion that we are aiming for a traditional 4-4-2 simply based on Bruce wanting 2 up front! We just need the right personnel. Another Jedi, and the players acclimatised properly with confidence. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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