Eastie Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 (edited) 1 minute ago, TRO said: Further disruption.....when you are trying to build your way back it's brittle and you lose your talisman.....the team had a wobble, losing their main man. its all part and parcel of getting your overall strength back......look at Johnstone and his turn around. Losing the 2 main men I'd say with jedinak and kodija. Throw in 7 new signings and it's easy to see why things went tits up - onwards and upwards from here . Edited March 18, 2017 by Eastie 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 6 minutes ago, Eastie said: Losing the 2 main men I'd say with jedinak and kodija. Throw in 7 new signings and it's easy to see why things went tits up - onwards and upwards from here . I agree on the signings, probably the only thing Dr T has been guilty of was signing too many players. I guess in hindsight Bruce might have held some of them back a bit rather than throwing them all in together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 37 minutes ago, Genie said: I agree on the signings, probably the only thing Dr T has been guilty of was signing too many players. I guess in hindsight Bruce might have held some of them back a bit rather than throwing them all in together. It had to happen such was the magnitude of the surgery required.....its done now. I think it will be more focussed and controlled moving forward. Its easy to say it was too many, but not every club had the same level of rectification to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alreadyexists Posted March 18, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted March 18, 2017 20 minutes ago, TRO said: It had to happen such was the magnitude of the surgery required.....its done now. I think it will be more focussed and controlled moving forward. Its easy to say it was too many, but not every club had the same level of rectification to do. Yep, it had to happen. To think where we were this time last year, bottom of the PL, 17 points, was it 3 wins? ... to where we are now with, on paper, one of the best squads in the Championship, it's been a transformation. Revolution is often painful, but necessary in this case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 1 minute ago, alreadyexists said: Yep, it had to happen. To think where we were this time last year, bottom of the PL, 17 points, was it 3 wins? ... to where we are now with, on paper, one of the best squads in the Championship, it's been a transformation. Revolution is often painful, but necessary in this case. I think we all say these things......but it does make you wonder at times if it is fully appreciated how far we had actually fallen......and much is required to get back. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post dont_do_it_doug. Posted March 19, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted March 19, 2017 I have to be fair and say that the football today was **** awful. By the same token we weren't exactly 'lucky', we ground it out. The semblance of a quality side is there, and we are making it count with results. If we can do that for another 54 games or so we will be in the Premier League again. Where we belong. 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted March 19, 2017 Moderator Share Posted March 19, 2017 20 hours ago, Tommo_b said: Some one must have the means to upload this as I'd quite like to see it. http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b08k47n4/football-focus-18032017 And scroll to 23 minutes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grasshopper Posted March 19, 2017 Share Posted March 19, 2017 7 hours ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: I have to be fair and say that the football today was **** awful. By the same token we weren't exactly 'lucky', we ground it out. The semblance of a quality side is there, and we are making it count with results. If we can do that for another 54 games or so we will be in the Premier League again. Where we belong. This is the fact that bothers me If, for example 26 W 10 D 10 L = 82pts gets us promoted, lets say. 6 lucky/undeserved wins 10 grinders We would still be left with around 20 games to play well (10w 5d 5l). I can see this coming from our player quality but not from Bruces tactics/style Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted March 19, 2017 Share Posted March 19, 2017 8 minutes ago, blandy said: http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b08k47n4/football-focus-18032017 And scroll to 23 minutes Thanks for this link. I really do like Bruce. There is something about him, makes me love having him as manager. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted March 19, 2017 Share Posted March 19, 2017 7 hours ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: I have to be fair and say that the football today was **** awful. By the same token we weren't exactly 'lucky', we ground it out. The semblance of a quality side is there, and we are making it count with results. If we can do that for another 54 games or so we will be in the Premier League again. Where we belong. With the crap we have had and the way confidence had been shredded (previous managers, previous owner causing the rot) we just needed to do this - grind out results, get that feeling back, feel like we can win any game and then things will improve from there. I'm really happy with how things are right now. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lerner's Driver Posted March 19, 2017 Share Posted March 19, 2017 7 hours ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: I have to be fair and say that the football today was **** awful. By the same token we weren't exactly 'lucky', we ground it out. The semblance of a quality side is there, and we are making it count with results. If we can do that for another 54 games or so we will be in the Premier League again. Where we belong. I know it's the million dollar question Dave, but in your opinion, what might bring about the eventual shift to 'attractive', as well as successful? Do you think that matters to Bruce and that he wants that too? I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted March 19, 2017 Share Posted March 19, 2017 8 hours ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: I have to be fair and say that the football today was **** awful. By the same token we weren't exactly 'lucky', we ground it out. The semblance of a quality side is there, and we are making it count with results. If we can do that for another 54 games or so we will be in the Premier League again. Where we belong. Good football/ performances are few and far between this season, there's no point expecting it from a Steve Bruce side. It's just not, and has never been, in his MO. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexicon Posted March 19, 2017 Share Posted March 19, 2017 1 hour ago, Grasshopper said: This is the fact that bothers me If, for example 26 W 10 D 10 L = 82pts gets us promoted, lets say. 6 lucky/undeserved wins 10 grinders We would still be left with around 20 games to play well (10w 5d 5l). I can see this coming from our player quality but not from Bruces tactics/style MUST... NOT.... CHANGE.... AGENDAGAHHHHHHH 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alreadyexists Posted March 19, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted March 19, 2017 Maybe we should just wait and see what happens. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted March 19, 2017 Share Posted March 19, 2017 46 minutes ago, Lerner's Driver said: I know it's the million dollar question Dave, but in your opinion, what might bring about the eventual shift to 'attractive', as well as successful? Do you think that matters to Bruce and that he wants that too? I do. I'll give you my answer if I may. I'm actually not concerned overly about whether it is 'attractive' as such - for example I love good defensive performances, and good battles, and can't stand tikka takka style football. I'd say my favourite Villa sides over the last fifty years have never been 'pretty' as such.........but we've never been a Wimbledon either, we have always, at our best, had a solid side with a bit of midfield graft and a couple of good engines, a decent winger and some pace. SO that is what I, personally, both would like to see and think would be effective against better opposition. As for what would bring that shift, I think we are very close to it, especially when we put our best Eleven out. Yesterday was a classic example, where once the changes were made we played like Villa. Huddersfield first half touched on it. Lansbury is huge for us, as is Hourihane (only slightly less so IMO) - if they really were Bruces choices (and we've no reason to say they weren't, but its possible they were Rounds also) he has chosen a perfect blend which bodes well for his summer spending too. Some say some of his negative stuff has been forced , others - like me - think its been a choice. In my view he - rightly - concluded quickly we simply had to build in resilience above all else.............but (again IMO) he overdid it (fair enough he is learning too, we aren't Hull or Wigan, or Blues, and our players and our best way isn't theirs either) and particularly over compensated for the loss of JK and conceding a few goals suddenly in late December/January. This made him even more conservative (three at the back, that awful selection against Ipswich, wasting Lansbury as a holding MF). Which is how we ( needlessly IMO) started yesterday. The football HAD to be poor - at times we had a line of 6 or even 7 players so when they won the ball there was no outlets. We only had 2 (3 if you count Amavi) forward thinking players, in Hourihane and Adomah, and they were often both trapped aswell. The system/selection caused the poor football (as IMO it has done on most other occasions we've been poor in quality). As soon as he changed it we looked a far better side - most crucially the midfield stopped being an extension of the defence and became a link between defence and attack. I think he is bit like a kid with a new exciting remote control toy - he doesn't want to break it.......so errs on the side of caution (too much for me).....but I am gradually thinking he knows he needs to, and maybe even wants to, set us up to play a lot more positively. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted March 19, 2017 Share Posted March 19, 2017 1 hour ago, Grasshopper said: This is the fact that bothers me If, for example 26 W 10 D 10 L = 82pts gets us promoted, lets say. 6 lucky/undeserved wins 10 grinders We would still be left with around 20 games to play well (10w 5d 5l). I can see this coming from our player quality but not from Bruces tactics/style On the other a 'back of fag packet' calculation (so I could be wrong !) says he has got 40 points from 19 games. So he could well get 80 from 38, that allows him 2 * 4 game runs of the sort we had in January. In other words he has the priceless knack of going 'on a run'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel Posted March 19, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted March 19, 2017 Everyone bangs on about the idea that you need to grind out results in this league. Bruce if nothing else has proven he can do this with us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted March 19, 2017 Share Posted March 19, 2017 (edited) I think he is still learning about his players and the team formations are a part and parcel of that.....along with injuries ,suspensions and form drops. We, equally are learning about him and whether we favour him or not......that will change with the development of the team for better of worse.....rarely is there an intransigent stance due to the peaks and troughs of our performances. We are WIP so naturally, opinions within us will vary as team performances will vary. I have set my stall out on here as to my opinion of Bruce, but I would be a liar if I did not have that opinion challenged during that rough spell in Jan......winning and losing does play a big part in our views, which is only natural. We will all have challenges to our opinions, whatever our general view is. Personally,I am cautiously excited at what lies ahead. Edited March 19, 2017 by TRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted March 19, 2017 Moderator Share Posted March 19, 2017 9 hours ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: I have to be fair and say that the football today was **** awful. By the same token we weren't exactly 'lucky', we ground it out. The semblance of a quality side is there, and we are making it count with results. If we can do that for another 54 games or so we will be in the Premier League again. Where we belong. The football was utterly awful, and not only was it awful, it was error strewn throughout. If Wigan had been half decent at doing shooting n'that we'd have lost that. I reckon we gifted them 3 really good chances to score through defensive howlers. I think what I've learnt from watching this season is how awful a lot of sides in this league are. Where Bruce has done well is in instilling a team spirit and a team that now plays for the whole 90 minutes with maximum effort and commitment. I guess history says that unless you have a set of brilliant players, then the way to succeed in the 46 game Championship is to work your rocks off, not make too many mistakes and take your chances. That seems to be where Bruce is aiming for us, and by having the ability to have better players in many positions than the opposition, it looks like it ought to work, at least to get a side into a playoff place over a whole season. I'm with Terry really, though. I crave the assurance that seeing a team not only play solidly, but excitingly and creatively brings. There was a full away end yesterday, but to be honest until late on the volume of noise coming from it was not that loud or enthusiastic, because the game was so turgid. If the team can start to actually excite supporters, then there will be no stopping us. I think there's a fair way to go yet, but the ingredients are pretty much there, is just getting the mix right. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condimentalist Posted March 19, 2017 Share Posted March 19, 2017 I don't think we've been in a better position in late season to achieve our objectives the following year for at least 7 or 8 years and probably longer. Bruce is only part of that equation but he is a part of it. I'm glad we are pulling a run together now but this season is gone. It's about building for next year now. We shouldn't need major surgery in the summer, 3-4 key signings. Stability is key. We have a squad that should be in the top 2 and a manager with an excellent track record. For once my head - and not just my heart - tells me we will do what we need to do next season. The rebirth of Aston Villa starts here. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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