Ghosts

[Rugeley Villa]

When my gran died the run up to her death she was saying weird things and talking to people etc. I believe in the supernatural but I also know my gran was very poorly and was having deliriums due to bad water infections and her body starting to shut down so I put it down to that.  . Her friend was in hospital around that time and she ended up passing away but we didn’t let my gran know because we felt she didn’t need to know. The next day my gran said during the night that same friend had come to her through the night. My gran never knew that person was in hospital or anything, so that was pretty weird. I imagine people who work in hospices and end of life care experience some unusual stuff. You either believe or you don’t. 

[bannedfromHandV]

1 hour ago, TheAuthority said:

Isn’t DMT released as we die? A strong naturally occurring psychodelic. 
People who take it recreationally claim to have so called “near death “ experiences and even see aliens etc.

The really interesting thing with DMT is that people who have no connection to eachother whatsoever are apparently seeing the same kind of visions, down to some relatively fine detail. I didn’t even know DMT existed until earlier this week.

edit - that’s people taking it recreationally

Edited September 23, 2023 by bannedfromHandV

[Rolta]

34 minutes ago, bannedfromHandV said:

The really interesting thing with DMT is that people who have no connection to eachother whatsoever are apparently seeing the same kind of visions, down to some relatively fine detail. I didn’t even know DMT existed until earlier this week.

edit - that’s people taking it recreationally

It's not a drug. It's crossing into another dimension. Unfortunately the only time I took it I was smashed, and I don't remember what the aliens said. I only remember saying, 'It's true. It's all true.'

No idea what that was in fact—what was true—and I and the people I was with were all so temporarily space travelly that we broke the pipe and couldn't take any more to go back and find out. Good stuff. Would do it again. It only lasts fifteen minutes, but they're the most unexpected fifteen minutes you can imagine.

[fruitvilla]

9 hours ago, limpid said:

We can't propose that "supernatural" is a candidate explanation for anything until we can demonstrate that there is such a thing.

The problem with the "supernatural" is the moment we demonstrate it, it becomes part of the natural.

[fruitvilla]

I have been getting a lot of ghostly double posts recently.

edit

I am currently reading Julian Jaynes' Origin of Consciousness: The Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind. This may explain a good deal of ghostly phenomena.

edit
Getting my money's worth out of this double post:
Consciousness, a trip of a lifetime.

 

Edited September 24, 2023 by fruitvilla

[limpid]

4 hours ago, fruitvilla said:

The problem with the "supernatural" is the moment we demonstrate it, it becomes part of the natural.

Which implies that there is no such thing. It's a classification error.

[mjmooney]

Quote

Jinn (Arabic: جِنّ‎, jinn) – also romanized as djinn or anglicized as genies – are invisible creatures in early religion in pre-Islamic Arabia and later in Islamic culture and beliefs. Like humans, they are accountable for their deeds and can be either believers (Muslims) or unbelievers (kafir), depending on whether they accept God's guidance. 

According to a survey undertaken by the Pew Research Center in 2012, at least 86% of Muslims in Morocco, 84% in Bangladesh, 63% in Turkey, 55% in Iraq, 53% in Indonesia, 47% in Thailand and 15% elsewhere in Central Asia, affirm a belief in the existence of jinn. The low rate in Central Asia might be influenced by Soviet religious oppression. 36% of Muslims in Bosnia and Herzegovina believe in jinn, which is higher than the European average (30%), although only 21% believe in sorcery and 13% would wear talisman for protection against jinn. 12% support offerings and appeal given to the jinn.

Wiki

[Mark Albrighton]

In our mid twenties, me and my mates stayed at the Station Hotel in Dudley because supposedly it was haunted and we decided that we wanted to do our bit for paranormal research while getting drunk.

Two rooms, both of which were purportedly the most haunted in the hotel were booked. Presumably to add to the atmosphere, my mate brought dvds of the 2005 remake of The Amityville Horror, Gothika and The Mothman Prophecies. And a lot of beer.

We didn’t technically see a ghost, but when I was trying to sleep I felt a barrage of bottle caps hit me and when I politely* asked my mates to refrain from doing so, they insisted that they hadn’t. 

I shall leave it up to the reader to decide whether it was a spectral encounter or whether my pissed up mates were fibbing.

Regardless, probably the most successful night I’ve experienced in Dudley.

 

*I may not have been that polite. 

[Seat68]

8 hours ago, Mark Albrighton said:

In our mid twenties, me and my mates stayed at the Station Hotel in Dudley because supposedly it was haunted and we decided that we wanted to do our bit for paranormal research while getting drunk.

Two rooms, both of which were purportedly the most haunted in the hotel were booked. Presumably to add to the atmosphere, my mate brought dvds of the 2005 remake of The Amityville Horror, Gothika and The Mothman Prophecies. And a lot of beer.

We didn’t technically see a ghost, but when I was trying to sleep I felt a barrage of bottle caps hit me and when I politely* asked my mates to refrain from doing so, they insisted that they hadn’t. 

I shall leave it up to the reader to decide whether it was a spectral encounter or whether my pissed up mates were fibbing.

Regardless, probably the most successful night I’ve experienced in Dudley.

 

*I may not have been that polite. 

I think this place may have been on an episode of Most Haunted. 

[Mark Albrighton]

34 minutes ago, Seat68 said:

I think this place may have been on an episode of Most Haunted. 

Having just checked, it would appear you’re correct. I don’t think I’ve ever watched an episode of Most Haunted but I can imagine the friend who suggested we visit did so after seeing it. 

As an aside, the hotel bar/restaurant seems to have fully embraced a Peaky Blinders theme. Apparently this is more to do with the real history of the gang rather than the tv show but despite that assertion there appears to be quite a few pictures of Cillian Murphy that can be seen.

[bielesibub]

If ghosts are a thing, where are all the ghost dinosaurs?

[Chindie]

Where are the ghosts of anything?

Even if you set aside any scientific considerations and say 'ok, lets assume ghosts are possible', the numbers thing kills the whole story. Why numbers?

Well...

If ghosts are thing, even if a very rare thing, there's been so many living creatures on the planet that there should be ghosts absolutely everywhere. We should be wading through a ghostly tide of bacteria, of billions upon billions of untold generations of bacteria across hundreds of millions years. Even if we assume bacteria don't count, there's still been billions and billions of 'higher' developed creatures, you'd see ghosts everywhere all the tall even if it's only a fraction of a percentage of living creatures that get to be ghosts they'd be everywhere. Even if you chop it down further (and there's no reason to) and say only humans get to be ghosts, which raises further questions itself, we'd still see them all the time, hospitals would be riddled with them, historic buildings would all have a couple at least, every street over the entire world would have have a few wandering about.

And why would you chop it down to humans only? For a start there's long been stories of ghostly cats and dogs, are they just all to be discounted? If so, why are humans special? And if it is only humans that are special, when do we become special? We don't seem to have caveman ghosts, so presumably there must have been a time at which we got to be special humans and not just some other non-ghost enabled species, when and why was that?

It's nonsense.

[fightoffyour]

8 minutes ago, Chindie said:

Where are the ghosts of anything?

Even if you set aside any scientific considerations and say 'ok, lets assume ghosts are possible', the numbers thing kills the whole story. Why numbers?

Well...

If ghosts are thing, even if a very rare thing, there's been so many living creatures on the planet that there should be ghosts absolutely everywhere. We should be wading through a ghostly tide of bacteria, of billions upon billions of untold generations of bacteria across hundreds of millions years. Even if we assume bacteria don't count, there's still been billions and billions of 'higher' developed creatures, you'd see ghosts everywhere all the tall even if it's only a fraction of a percentage of living creatures that get to be ghosts they'd be everywhere. Even if you chop it down further (and there's no reason to) and say only humans get to be ghosts, which raises further questions itself, we'd still see them all the time, hospitals would be riddled with them, historic buildings would all have a couple at least, every street over the entire world would have have a few wandering about.

And why would you chop it down to humans only? For a start there's long been stories of ghostly cats and dogs, are they just all to be discounted? If so, why are humans special? And if it is only humans that are special, when do we become special? We don't seem to have caveman ghosts, so presumably there must have been a time at which we got to be special humans and not just some other non-ghost enabled species, when and why was that?

It's nonsense.

There haven't been that many humans ever living though - only about 117 billion apparently. So if you assume - and I think you'll agree that this is a fair assumption -that only about 7% of the 110 billion dead people get to ascend to ghostliness, then there are only as many ghosts as there are people alive now.

Ergo, there's one sitting next to you.

 

[chrisp65]

15 minutes ago, Chindie said:

Where are the ghosts of anything?

Even if you set aside any scientific considerations and say 'ok, lets assume ghosts are possible', the numbers thing kills the whole story. Why numbers?

Well...

If ghosts are thing, even if a very rare thing, there's been so many living creatures on the planet that there should be ghosts absolutely everywhere. We should be wading through a ghostly tide of bacteria, of billions upon billions of untold generations of bacteria across hundreds of millions years. Even if we assume bacteria don't count, there's still been billions and billions of 'higher' developed creatures, you'd see ghosts everywhere all the tall even if it's only a fraction of a percentage of living creatures that get to be ghosts they'd be everywhere. Even if you chop it down further (and there's no reason to) and say only humans get to be ghosts, which raises further questions itself, we'd still see them all the time, hospitals would be riddled with them, historic buildings would all have a couple at least, every street over the entire world would have have a few wandering about.

And why would you chop it down to humans only? For a start there's long been stories of ghostly cats and dogs, are they just all to be discounted? If so, why are humans special? And if it is only humans that are special, when do we become special? We don't seem to have caveman ghosts, so presumably there must have been a time at which we got to be special humans and not just some other non-ghost enabled species, when and why was that?

It's nonsense.

 

This doesn’t stack up.

From the other perspective, you could be a ghost in a long deserted mine, or in a lake, or up a chimney and be thinking ‘why are there no people anymore?’.

You could wander the corridors of some castle every night at 2:00am and think all the people must have gone, a lifeless planet. You wouldn’t understand concepts such as national trust opening hours.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

 

[Wainy316]

What do ghosts wear?  Can they change clothes?

Do ghosts have the appearance and age of when they died?

Is the ghost of a vaporised person just a collection of dust and particles?

Does ghost hair grow?

Do ghosts urinate?

Can ghosts go and watch football games and gigs without tickets?

Do ghosts have their own football league?

Why do ghosts never have a sense of humour and show up on the news and shout "**** rarrrrrrrrrrrrrr!" or something?  Instead they just bang on walls and turn taps on and off.

Do ghosts have sex?  Is a ghost fraternising with another ghost cheating on their still alive widow/er?

Are ghosts staring at my member when I'm having a shower?

Do I have a ghostly audience when I'm doing other things?

Am I attractive to ghosts?  How many ghosts get themselves off over me? 

 

 

[Dante_Lockhart]

1 hour ago, Chindie said:

Where are the ghosts of anything?

Even if you set aside any scientific considerations and say 'ok, lets assume ghosts are possible', the numbers thing kills the whole story. Why numbers?

Well...

If ghosts are thing, even if a very rare thing, there's been so many living creatures on the planet that there should be ghosts absolutely everywhere. We should be wading through a ghostly tide of bacteria, of billions upon billions of untold generations of bacteria across hundreds of millions years. Even if we assume bacteria don't count, there's still been billions and billions of 'higher' developed creatures, you'd see ghosts everywhere all the tall even if it's only a fraction of a percentage of living creatures that get to be ghosts they'd be everywhere. Even if you chop it down further (and there's no reason to) and say only humans get to be ghosts, which raises further questions itself, we'd still see them all the time, hospitals would be riddled with them, historic buildings would all have a couple at least, every street over the entire world would have have a few wandering about.

And why would you chop it down to humans only? For a start there's long been stories of ghostly cats and dogs, are they just all to be discounted? If so, why are humans special? And if it is only humans that are special, when do we become special? We don't seem to have caveman ghosts, so presumably there must have been a time at which we got to be special humans and not just some other non-ghost enabled species, when and why was that?

It's nonsense.

Because most of them have already crossed over. Duh.

[colhint]

Some while back I was at a dinner party . My brother good lad volunteered as designated driver. He actually did three trips taking locals home. He took me on the last trip about one in the morning. We saw two blokes walking along the road. He said that's really strange as he said he was them on his last trip about four miles in the opposite direction. Then told me that was about twenty minutes ago. No way could they have walked that far. 

Anyway Sunday lunch we were in the village pub and he related the story to a few locals who told him that would be Bert and Ted. Everyone in the village had seen them. They both died in the fifties.

What struck me was multiple people had seen the same images.

[Wainy316]

26 minutes ago, colhint said:

Bert and Ted

[LondonLax]

I had previously wondered about ghosts and their lack of any physical body. Our bodies are located on earth due to gravity but if you had no physical form there would be nothing keeping you on earth. The earth also travels through space at a fair old speed on its trip around the sun.

Which led to an amusing thought of a person dying and waking up as a ghost only to find the earth was no longer in the same position as when they died and they were now standing alone out in space.

I have also wondered about this problem from a time travel perspective. If you went back in time by a week or so you’d end up floating in space as a week ago the earth was not yet in the position it was when you left it

[luckyeddie]

8 hours ago, Wainy316 said:

What do ghosts wear?  Can they change clothes?

Do ghosts have the appearance and age of when they died?

Is the ghost of a vaporised person just a collection of dust and particles?

Does ghost hair grow?

Do ghosts urinate?

Can ghosts go and watch football games and gigs without tickets?

Do ghosts have their own football league?

Why do ghosts never have a sense of humour and show up on the news and shout "**** rarrrrrrrrrrrrrr!" or something?  Instead they just bang on walls and turn taps on and off.

Do ghosts have sex?  Is a ghost fraternising with another ghost cheating on their still alive widow/er?

Are ghosts staring at my member when I'm having a shower?

Do I have a ghostly audience when I'm doing other things?

Am I attractive to ghosts?  How many ghosts get themselves off over me? 

 

 

What they died in. No

Yes

Yes

Don't know

Probably

I would

Yes, Scottish League 2

They're boring

No (your thinking of goats). No

Yes

Yes

Yes. 76%

Could you let me know how well I did on this test