TrentVilla Posted September 4, 2014 Moderator Share Posted September 4, 2014 Ciaran Clark 24 and 107 appearances Nathan Baker 23 and 107 appearances Not bad for age and experience as cover which may help them. Full time first team players they are not Not many clubs would have players of that youth and experience as squad players. But they have that experience through necessity rather than having earned it and it shows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Wouldn’t be in any rush to move him on permanently just yet. A loan spell to a Championship club with guaranteed first team football would be a good opportunity for him. Opportunity to do what? He has played 107 games at this level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Ciaran Clark 24 and 107 appearances Nathan Baker 23 and 107 appearances Not bad for age and experience as cover which may help them. Full time first team players they are not Not many clubs would have players of that youth and experience as squad players. But they have that experience through necessity rather than having earned it and it shows. They were both thrust into the team too early, ultimate responsibility for which falls (again) on Lerner's cost-cutting. It would be good if at least one of them got a loan, but we'll see I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie09 Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Clark is streets ahead of Baker so I'd keep him at Baker's expense.Still too early to write him off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 (edited) Ciaran Clark 24 and 107 appearances Nathan Baker 23 and 107 appearances Not bad for age and experience as cover which may help them. Full time first team players they are not Not many clubs would have players of that youth and experience as squad players. But they have that experience through necessity rather than having earned it and it shows. They were both thrust into the team too early, ultimate responsibility for which falls (again) on Lerner's cost-cutting. It would be good if at least one of them got a loan, but we'll see I guess. I'm kinda done with both of them. I liked Clark, a fair bit. He has a lot of natural ability but he can't seem to keep it together mentally. I really don't think that can be taught. He's of a championship level as a starter which makes him an amicable 4th choice for a lower premier league club, which we are. Maybe if he drops down a league and finds the right partnership and the right manager for him we could see him back in the big time, but I have my doubts. I hope we don't see too much of him this season. Edited September 4, 2014 by dont_do_it_doug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romavillan Posted September 5, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted September 5, 2014 Ciaran Clark 24 and 107 appearances Nathan Baker 23 and 107 appearances Not bad for age and experience as cover which may help them. Full time first team players they are not Not many clubs would have players of that youth and experience as squad players. But they have that experience through necessity rather than having earned it and it shows. Now though they can be used as cover, instead of having the weight of the villan world on their young shoulders. They could both benefit from this and being introduced into a back four unit that is working nicely will help them. Really don't like all the chuckle brother stick they've been getting as a pair, they can become good assets still IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted September 5, 2014 Moderator Share Posted September 5, 2014 Ciaran Clark 24 and 107 appearances Nathan Baker 23 and 107 appearances Not bad for age and experience as cover which may help them. Full time first team players they are not Not many clubs would have players of that youth and experience as squad players. But they have that experience through necessity rather than having earned it and it shows. Now though they can be used as cover, instead of having the weight of the villan world on their young shoulders. They could both benefit from this and being introduced into a back four unit that is working nicely will help them. Really don't like all the chuckle brother stick they've been getting as a pair, they can become good assets still IMHO. They can and I have no real issue with that but the point I was making is that their number of appearances is the result of circumstance rather than ability, they are therefore not really plus points for the two of them. Yes they may well be useful squad players and for making the odd appearance but beyond that I don't really see a future for them at the club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Steve Posted September 5, 2014 Share Posted September 5, 2014 Neither Clark or Baker have long-term futures at the clubs. They are only here because of the current restrictions in place. Injuries or otherwise, we won't be seeing them play too often, thankfully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeyAnty Posted September 5, 2014 Share Posted September 5, 2014 Ciaran Clark 24 and 107 appearances Nathan Baker 23 and 107 appearances Not bad for age and experience as cover which may help them. Full time first team players they are not Not many clubs would have players of that youth and experience as squad players. But they have that experience through necessity rather than having earned it and it shows. Now though they can be used as cover, instead of having the weight of the villan world on their young shoulders. They could both benefit from this and being introduced into a back four unit that is working nicely will help them. Really don't like all the chuckle brother stick they've been getting as a pair, they can become good assets still IMHO. They can and I have no real issue with that but the point I was making is that their number of appearances is the result of circumstance rather than ability, they are therefore not really plus points for the two of them. Yes they may well be useful squad players and for making the odd appearance but beyond that I don't really see a future for them at the club. I honestly believe if Clark was to get a chance this season we would all start to sing his praises again. He got no support last season from the rubbish we were forced to play. If you are constantly being bombarded with crosses from both wings and players constantly running at you down the middle like last season then no young CB would stand a chance. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillanousOne Posted September 5, 2014 Share Posted September 5, 2014 Clark looked more composed than Baker but doesn't have the blood and thunder 'i'll throw my head at a speeding car' approach which Lambert seemed impressed by., despite the fact Baker has the defensive intelligence of a confused sparrow. I think Clark could play in midfield, i guess thats ship has sailed though unless he moves to the championship. But it feels like their time is running down as surely Okore will be the next in line if Senderos and Vlaar are injured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted September 5, 2014 Moderator Share Posted September 5, 2014 I honestly believe if Clark was to get a chance this season we would all start to sing his praises again. He got no support last season from the rubbish we were forced to play. If you are constantly being bombarded with crosses from both wings and players constantly running at you down the middle like last season then no young CB would stand a chance. I really don't think so, but that is football it would be dull if we all agreed. Whatever the limitations of the team and those around him last season, Clark made too many basic mistakes for me to not think he was part of the problem. Yes he was in at the deep end but I saw no improvement from him, no evidence he was learning from his mistakes. At times I thought the basic elements of his game, position and decision making were poor and I think the same would be true this season even if those flaws were less exposed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Steve Posted September 5, 2014 Share Posted September 5, 2014 The problem with Clark and Baker was the amount of basic mistakes they routinely made and it put more pressure on Vlaar. I've seen no evidence that either has improved. Watching Villa with Clark or Baker in the starting X1 means I expect a mistake at some point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-Reacho Posted September 5, 2014 Share Posted September 5, 2014 If Clark came through at a club like Utd. where he would have slowly gained experience alongside the likes of Vidic and Rio I think he definitely could have been a prospect similar to the development of Jonny Evans. Being repeatedly thrown in at the deep end when he should have gone back to the reserves has harmed his development IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AntrimBlack Posted September 5, 2014 Share Posted September 5, 2014 Okore, we are assuming, though yet to be proven, will be ahead of Clark and Baker. And Donacien has had good reports from those who have seen him, is it possible that he may overtake them as well. We have seen, however, that injuries can quickly decimate the middle of our defence, so certainly Clark and Baker are viable options as back up, however limited we perceive them to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caddy Posted September 20, 2014 Share Posted September 20, 2014 (edited) A Sunday leaguer could do better than this chucklef*** Baker shined in his chance. Clark has s*** the bed. Get this garbage off my team Edited September 20, 2014 by Caddy 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packoman Posted September 20, 2014 Share Posted September 20, 2014 He's looked no worse than Senderos in this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted September 20, 2014 Share Posted September 20, 2014 He's a poor player who can't even be trusted as decent back-up, hopefully this is the last we'll see of him in a Villa shirt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted September 20, 2014 Share Posted September 20, 2014 Turned off at HT for the racing… Okore must be double fcukt!.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HongKongVillan Posted September 20, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted September 20, 2014 So much chance for him to prove but fail yet again - there is no coincident that he seems to be the part of that defence which collapse under against pressure . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVTuco Posted September 20, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted September 20, 2014 Not as poor as claimed in match thread. However, I hoped for better since he was fine early last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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