handsworthlion Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 I think he is no way a premier league defender, probably no even a championship one. the thing that annoys me most, not just with clark, but most of our 'youngsters' is that they are still referred to as 'youngsters' up until the age of about 25! Clark has had chance after chance and has never ever looked like improving or learning from mistakes. IMO our excellent youth development is an absolute myth, all we is channel players into league 1 and 2 at 22/23 after realising they are deemed not good enough or 'too small' Everton for instance, seem to produce 17/18 year olds who look and play like men and ready for the 1st 11, whilst Our Ciaran still looks like a Virgin. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 Didn't see the USA/ROI game last night. How did he do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villastine Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 Well you’d have to question if some of the fault is with our first team coaching staff or lack thereof. As far as I know we are one of the few teams without a proper first team coaching setup. It’s a pathetic situation and we have been all over the place with this in recent years. We need a first team coach and an assistant first team coach as the bare minimum. As far as the academy goes it’s hard to rate the success of Everton’s. If we compared players who came through the youth structure, into the first team and who are still playing in the Premier League. They’d have Rooney, Barkley, Richard Dunne, Osman, Hibbert and Rodwell While we produced Davis, Barry, Cahill, C Gardner, Gabby, Ridgewell, Weimann oh & Baker, Clarke, Albrighton and Bannan. Obviously Rooney is the stand out player. But I don’t think our academy has done too badly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevpants Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 The problem with him is he's not a centre half and never will be. He was so much more promising as a deep lying midfielder but for whatever reason was convinced to move or started getting picked at CB. Those few howlers in his first season there burned him big time, his distribution is now poor because his first priority is not having the ball taken off him. His safety first attitude leads him to playing a long ball with a 0% chance of the ball being given to the opposition in an attacking position over a short pass with a 25% chance of interception in that position. I'd prefer him as back up to Sanchez than back up to Vlaar. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DelboyVilla Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 The problem with him is he's not a centre half and never will be. He was so much more promising as a deep lying midfielder but for whatever reason was convinced to move or started getting picked at CB. Those few howlers in his first season there burned him big time, his distribution is now poor because his first priority is not having the ball taken off him. His safety first attitude leads him to playing a long ball with a 0% chance of the ball being given to the opposition in an attacking position over a short pass with a 25% chance of interception in that position. I'd prefer him as back up to Sanchez than back up to Vlaar. But he's likely to be back up to Vlaar, Senderos and Baker? Look at Manure and Arsenal and their defensive frailties this season because if Arsenal had their 3 first choice CB's out who would they be playing? Gibbs? Arteta? Flamini? Manure have their 3 first choices out and have to play Carrick there. We are not that badly off! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 I think he is no way a premier league defender, probably no even a championship one. the thing that annoys me most, not just with clark, but most of our 'youngsters' is that they are still referred to as 'youngsters' up until the age of about 25! Clark has had chance after chance and has never ever looked like improving or learning from mistakes. IMO our excellent youth development is an absolute myth, all we is channel players into league 1 and 2 at 22/23 after realising they are deemed not good enough or 'too small' Everton for instance, seem to produce 17/18 year olds who look and play like men and ready for the 1st 11, whilst Our Ciaran still looks like a Virgin. Come off it, he plays semi-regularly for his country, he's obviously better than League One standard. If we do get relegated, he'll probably look amazing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corcaigh Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 Clark played well enough last night for Ireland, though probably could have done better for the goal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DelboyVilla Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 Clark played well enough last night for Ireland, though probably could have done better for the goal. Well at least he didn't get injured? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodders0223 Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 I think he is no way a premier league defender, probably no even a championship one. the thing that annoys me most, not just with clark, but most of our 'youngsters' is that they are still referred to as 'youngsters' up until the age of about 25! Clark has had chance after chance and has never ever looked like improving or learning from mistakes. IMO our excellent youth development is an absolute myth, all we is channel players into league 1 and 2 at 22/23 after realising they are deemed not good enough or 'too small' Everton for instance, seem to produce 17/18 year olds who look and play like men and ready for the 1st 11, whilst Our Ciaran still looks like a Virgin. Come off it, he plays semi-regularly for his country, he's obviously better than League One standard. If we do get relegated, he'll probably look amazing. Have you seen the standard of player ROI have had to call up recently. When you are forced to call up English players on the regular you are in trouble, when you are calling up English players the standard of David McGoldrick, then you are done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 Cardiff are in the middle of the Championship table right now. Their last game was against Blues. The back 4 was: Connolly - - - Turner - - - Morrison - - - Brayford with Fabio and Gabbidon coming off the bench. You're welcome to tell me that Ciaran Clark couldn't get into that team, and I'm welcome to laugh at you if you do. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corcaigh Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 I think he is no way a premier league defender, probably no even a championship one. the thing that annoys me most, not just with clark, but most of our 'youngsters' is that they are still referred to as 'youngsters' up until the age of about 25! Clark has had chance after chance and has never ever looked like improving or learning from mistakes. IMO our excellent youth development is an absolute myth, all we is channel players into league 1 and 2 at 22/23 after realising they are deemed not good enough or 'too small' Everton for instance, seem to produce 17/18 year olds who look and play like men and ready for the 1st 11, whilst Our Ciaran still looks like a Virgin. Come off it, he plays semi-regularly for his country, he's obviously better than League One standard. If we do get relegated, he'll probably look amazing. Have you seen the standard of player ROI have had to call up recently. When you are forced to call up English players on the regular you are in trouble, when you are calling up English players the standard of David McGoldrick, then you are done. Except of course McGoldrick was very good last night. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DelboyVilla Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 For all the anti Clark people, with Vlaar, Senderos and Baker all likely to be out injured for Monday night, who should play at CB if neither Clark is good enough or Okore is 'not ready'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhInTrinity Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 I actually think playing Clark as a DM, has taken him backwards. I remember his debut against Fulham under MON, looked a very assured CB, think half the problem with CB's is they need a run of games in the side. Since Lambert has been here I'd be surprised if we have had a CB pairing that has played 10 games consecutively. On Clark, think like Bannan, they are too much in a comfort zone here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted November 22, 2014 Share Posted November 22, 2014 (edited) I am not saying our CB's are anything special, but our midfield has been too lightweight for years...its too easy to "get at" our back four. Edited November 22, 2014 by TRO 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nik986 Posted November 22, 2014 Share Posted November 22, 2014 Clark isn't great but as a fourth choice or even fifth choice CB, he's not bad. Problem we have is many of our players are too similar. So, at present not a massive difference between a non-playing Okore, baker or Clark. Our squad is full of a lot of average players, whereas other teams have much stronger first XIs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smetrov Posted November 22, 2014 Share Posted November 22, 2014 I think he is no way a premier league defender, probably no even a championship one. the thing that annoys me most, not just with clark, but most of our 'youngsters' is that they are still referred to as 'youngsters' up until the age of about 25! Clark has had chance after chance and has never ever looked like improving or learning from mistakes. IMO our excellent youth development is an absolute myth, all we is channel players into league 1 and 2 at 22/23 after realising they are deemed not good enough or 'too small' Everton for instance, seem to produce 17/18 year olds who look and play like men and ready for the 1st 11, whilst Our Ciaran still looks like a Virgin. Been saying the same about the excellent Academy for years. We seem to produce a lot of players of the same type - workman like grafters - and strikers who have one reasonable season season - then struggle - but stay at the club for a further 3 or 4 years. I think we need to start moving them on sooner - on the whole if you ain't cutting it at 21 - you probably aren't going to. As for Clark he offers nothing, his tacking and heading aren't good enough - his passing is reasonable but nothing spectacular. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVTuco Posted November 22, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted November 22, 2014 You guys are way too critical of Ciaran. My opinion. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 Great performance tonight - man of the match for me. Lead the line well and can't remember him actually doing anything wrong. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farlz Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 Fair play tonight. I've given him tons of stick but he was superb. Didn't do a single thing wrong. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 He had a great game. Was a leader out there. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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