thabucks Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 Gravenberch won’t leave Ajax to come to mid table Aston Villa - fact! Kamara may end up here but depends on the level of competition. Phillips isn’t world class but only maybe 2-3 English players are. I would personally prefer someone like Mikel Merino but wouldn’t be upset with Phillips whom I rate higher than Bissouma. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 If he played for us, I'd cash in at £60M... I think that's indicative of how we should look at things. I'd take half of that for McGinn. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul514 Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 2 hours ago, thabucks said: Gravenberch won’t leave Ajax to come to mid table Aston Villa - fact! Kamara may end up here but depends on the level of competition. Phillips isn’t world class but only maybe 2-3 English players are. I would personally prefer someone like Mikel Merino but wouldn’t be upset with Phillips whom I rate higher than Bissouma. I'm not saying he will or won't, just using him as an example of value. I suspect you won't get to know if you are right or wrong this summer either. Having said that going to a mid table in the Premier League with a famous ex player as manager and owners who consistently spend loads of money every year is far more attractive than being at a big name club in a far inferior league on far less money. Going back to value who are the other DCM's who have been brought for 60m in the past? Even in the ball park of that number.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thabucks Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 I think you just need to look at what players we need and not worry about the reported cost. If they think Phillips is the man to make the midfield click then do whatever it takes to get him, regardless of the cost & fans perceived value. We need a CDM badly and we have the resources so it’s a no brainer. Don’t desperately want Phillips btw but if he’s #1 then do what it takes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul514 Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 Just now, thabucks said: I think you just need to look at what players we need and not worry about the reported cost. If they think Phillips is the man to make the midfield click then do whatever it takes to get him, regardless of the cost & fans perceived value. We need a CDM badly and we have the resources so it’s a no brainer. Don’t desperately want Phillips btw but if he’s #1 then do what it takes. They also currently want to play a narrow formation with a squad who's best element is their wide players..... They also have failed to buy a DCM since the summer we came up..... Sorry costs also matter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 18 minutes ago, paul514 said: I'm not saying he will or won't, just using him as an example of value. I suspect you won't get to know if you are right or wrong this summer either. I think we’ll know sooner… 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
messi11 Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 7 hours ago, av1 said: You’re talking rubbish. Crystal Palace are 3 places and two points behind us. And why are those players at Palace rather than Chelsea/Liverpool/City etc? Because they are exactly that, talents that haven’t yet achieved anything. Like it or not, to move to the next level you need a few “finished articles” and they cost money. You're talking rubbish and how many places is 60 million Kalvin Phillips behind us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwi1890 Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 1 hour ago, messi11 said: You're talking rubbish and how many places is 60 million Kalvin Phillips behind us? The same amount as that £100m player we sold to City Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 God almighty. It's MON all over again. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laughable Chimp Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 (edited) 11 hours ago, nick76 said: Apart from the elite players I don’t think any level of scouting shows whether foreign players can cope with the PL. So many hits and misses down the years for so many teams for Mid range players ie not elite and not shit. I think the risk is incredibly high even in this day and age because our league is so different to the European leagues. I agree re the last paragraph hence why I don’t think he’d leave Leeds for us. Even PL players can't cope with the PL. Plenty of cases where a PL players moves to another club in the league and fails to perform at their prior level. I've yet to see any evidence whether the rate at which this happens is any different to when a player comes from a foreign league into the PL. Edited March 21, 2022 by Laughable Chimp 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 8 hours ago, paul514 said: Going back to value who are the other DCM's who have been brought for 60m in the past? Even in the ball park of that number.... Rodri. He came from a Champions League team and is in the top 3-4 players in his position in the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshVilla Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 8 hours ago, nick76 said: I think we’ll know sooner… If Raiola is involved the 25m will probably just be his agent fee. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoony Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 7 hours ago, Tomaszk said: God almighty. It's MON all over again. In what way? We signed some really good players under MON. We would be distraught if one of our near rivals like Wolves got Phillips and we didn’t. He may not be a sexy name but he is world class. He would be in the Milner/Young bracket rather in the Reo-Coker/Warnock bracket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 2 hours ago, Laughable Chimp said: Even PL players can't cope with the PL. Plenty of cases where a PL players moves to another club in the league and fails to perform at their prior level. I've yet to see any evidence whether the rate at which this happens is any different to when a player comes from a foreign league into the PL. How would you even get stats for that because it’s largely subjective. With my eyes over 40 years, players unfamiliar with the different style of this league are a much higher risk of not succeeding than players who have already been successful in the premier league. Common sense would tell you if they have been successful in the league already it reduces the risk of knowing whether they can, whereas if they haven’t played a very different style of football it’s a far bigger risk. If you don’t think so then or you think a player is just as likely to succeed as a player already playing in the premier league then I’m not sure you understand the risk elements involved that it might not be successful between the two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichW Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 I like Phillips and would be very happy with the signing but I don't think there's a chance this is going to happen. If Leeds get relegated possibly, but if they stay up I just don't see it happening. Don't think Leeds would want to sell to Villa - like it or not next season they will see Villa as a rival and I don't think Phillips will be pushing for the move unless it was a UCL club that was coming in for him. His their equivalent of Grealish asset wise and they are going to want every £1 they can get for him, West Ham had a £50 million bid rejected in January for him so there is definitely clubs further ahead than us going to be interested. The Athletic have already reported in the last few months that he wants to sign a new deal so unless something has changed in the last few months and I think Leeds will probably stop up now it's a non starter for me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wainy316 Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 I couldn't care less about the money. It's his injury record I'd be worried about. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 1 hour ago, Spoony said: In what way? We signed some really good players under MON. We would be distraught if one of our near rivals like Wolves got Phillips and we didn’t. He may not be a sexy name but he is world class. He would be in the Milner/Young bracket rather in the Reo-Coker/Warnock bracket. If Wolves paid the reported 60 million 200k a week for a player that has played one full season in the top flight then we would be laughing at them as well 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, nick76 said: How would you even get stats for that because it’s largely subjective. With my eyes over 40 years, players unfamiliar with the different style of this league are a much higher risk of not succeeding than players who have already been successful in the premier league. Common sense would tell you if they have been successful in the league already it reduces the risk of knowing whether they can, whereas if they haven’t played a very different style of football it’s a far bigger risk. If you don’t think so then or you think a player is just as likely to succeed as a player already playing in the premier league then I’m not sure you understand the risk elements involved that it might not be successful between the two. Cant find an accurate list but on the top 30 internal transfers include flops like Benteke, Wan Bissaka, Fernando Torres, Luke Shaw, Andy Carroll, Richarlison, Sigurdsson. Even the record Grealish deal has not really worked out yet Wan Bissaka is incredibly 6th on the transfer fee list Edited March 21, 2022 by Zatman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fun Factory Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 16 hours ago, paul514 said: He has talent, no one will say otherwise. Personally I don’t think the risk is that big buying foreign players who haven’t played in the league before. These days with scouting and data analysis you know an awful lot about a player than you used to. That might be true but that hasn't reallly worked with Bailey, Traore, and Sanson as we don't seem to know what to do with them anymore. That is about £60 million of transfer fees just rusting on the bench. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul514 Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 24 minutes ago, The Fun Factory said: That might be true but that hasn't reallly worked with Bailey, Traore, and Sanson as we don't seem to know what to do with them anymore. That is about £60 million of transfer fees just rusting on the bench. That is down to bad management. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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