Ratings & Reactions: Man United v Villa

[Okonokos]

3 hours ago, TRO said:

Bravo, for reminding us......Man Utd was clearly reminded, before they came out ,doubling up regularly on our players, stopping them from playing and putting us off our game.

They were the dirtiest team I've seen in a long time. So many fouls and the ref just let them do it.

[Okonokos]

 

[Sulberto21]

Pogba's arm had a lot to do with Douglas' body position during the penalty call.

[Brumstopdogs]

 

[DaveAV1]

3 hours ago, sheepyvillian said:

I was one of the Highbury thousands. I don't think I'll ever see an away day turnout like that again. I would take that over a World Cup win every time. Such a privilege to have them glory years in our lifetime. 

Look forward to that read.

I was there too, what an incredible day. I’m sure every bus in Brum was there. There was also a rugby league final on at Wembley and a rugby union final at Twickenham. The M1 was mental on the way down. I was 18, what a time to be a Villa fan and little did we know what was coming up 12 months later

[mykeyb]

Man Utd fans are an embarrassment to themselves. If they lose then Twitter is alive with Oleout tweets, they beat us with a dubious penalty and all.of.a.sudden they are winning the league........

[Stevo985]

10 hours ago, Tomaszk said:

@OutByEaster? @Paul33 @Stevo985

Plucked a few there who think it was a pen.

Out of interest do you think Grealish would have been given that pen? I don't.

Do you think if Oliver hadn't given it, VAR would have got involved and said yeah that's a pen. They would for Utd, no chance for us.

Painfully lopsided officiating. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy.

It isn't refs picking up bungs or anything, they simply don't want to be the ones to stop the run or make headlines by giving anything against Utd.

 

Do I think Grealish would have got it? Yeah maybe. Maybe not. I’m not arguing that Man Utd don’t get an unfair amount of penalties. But that doesn’t change my opinion of this incident. 

Do I think VAR would have got involved? It’s impossible to say. If we’d been given it I don’t think VAR would have overruled it.

I’ll tell you what I am sure of though. If Jack did get that decision then there wouldn’t be many, if any, Villa fans saying it wasn’t a penalty 

Edited January 3, 2021 by Stevo985

[Stevo985]

9 hours ago, Okonokos said:

What people need to remember is football is a contact sport and not every piece of contact is a foul.

Correct. 
 

Unfortunately tripping an attacker over in the penalty area is a foul. 

[VillaChris]

3 hours ago, Sulberto21 said:

Pogba's arm had a lot to do with Douglas' body position during the penalty call.

Honestly thought that should've been called as a foul, Doug should've just gone down and Oliver would've likely blown up.

If you're getting a hand in the face that is impacting on what you see for split second you're obviously not going to know exactly where your feet are in relation to your opponent (and Pogba manufactured all that anyway).

Game after game VAR is implemented so disappointingly. If Oliver goes to have a look at the overturned penalty v Brighton he has to do it here.

Right at the end of game when Davis had that shot blocked Maguire had his arms up and the cross seemed to hit him very close so interested if it was a good shout from anyone that actually saw a replay.

[fightoffyour]

16 hours ago, blandy said:

The ref gave it in real time - even Deano said it looked like a clear pen in real time - anyone would have got it, I agree.

Detailed zooming in and video analysis showed Pogba's leg and foot hitting Doug's leg and the that caused him to trip himself up. Completely accidental by Pogba, but it shouldn't have been given really on detailed analysis. But that's not what VAR is for (in my mind) - it wasn't a howler, it was the wrong decision in some people's eyes having reviewed the videos a day later. VAR should be left to eliminate absolute clear errors, not split interpretations of an incident, where it should go with the on field ref's (or Lino's) real time verdict. Maybe they could have called him to the monitor and maybe he'd have changed his view, but I'm not at all sure he would.

I don’t know, I mean thinking an opposition player tripped an attacker up when actually the latter did it to himself is about as much of a howler as it gets besides, say, mistaken identity.

[YouUnastanFren]

6 hours ago, Stevo985 said:

Correct. 
 

Unfortunately tripping an attacker over in the penalty area is a foul. 

I don't believe Luiz tripped him over as much as he intentionally tripped himself on Luiz's leg. The contact between them (not including the foul Pogba is committing with his arm) was Pogba's toes on the back of Luiz's standing leg. From the angle they replayed repeatedly it looked like to me that Pogba brought his foot through at an unnatural angle to make sure it happened.

Of course it's difficult to tell from the angle we saw whether Pogba turned his foot outwards to engineer the contact, the key angle (the one from directly behind them) was strangely only shown once at full speed not zoomed in. In real time when they cut to that angle I was thinking "Finally!" but then they just let it roll with a useless closeup of the ref for ages before the eventual cut back to a live shot of the ref instead of showing it close up and slowly like they did with the inconclusive first angle. Seemed almost conspiratorial at the time. 

https://streamable.com/6a30rg

 

[villalad21]

The fact that they were celebrating like they had won a trophy at the end speaks volumes.

This is against a team that played in the Championship only 2 years ago. They looked physically and mentally drained at the end and delighted to get the game over with.

[Okonokos]

10 hours ago, Stevo985 said:

Correct. 
 

Unfortunately tripping an attacker over in the penalty area is a foul. 

But an attacker tripping himself up isn't.

[danceoftheshamen]

I think we should remember this all happened in the "Theatre" of dreams, all theatre's have good actors which likely explains the 33 pens for 7 against in the last 50 games or so for them. 

[Herman22]

If Jack had won that pen if have no problem saying it was beyond soft. 

But what gets me is people on a tv falling over themselves to say it's a stone wall because Pogba kicks Doug. Just to give United fans and the refs som vindication. 

I'm afraid the idea of a unbiased football pundit is now dead. Gary Neville used his favorite term "clever" during the game on sky. This translates to he cheated to win a pen but he plays for United so I'm ok with it. Same thing he said when Bruno cheated to win a pen last season. 

[StefanAVFC]

22 hours ago, blandy said:

Maybe they could have called him to the monitor and maybe he'd have changed his view, but I'm not at all sure he would.

As evidenced in our game against brighton, Michael Oliver is only ever looking for contact (on ball or man), regardless of the context. He wouldn't have overturned it.

Best ref in the country my arse. 

[TRO]

19 hours ago, Okonokos said:

 

something ought to be done.....it should be exposed.

[TRO]

17 hours ago, DaveAV1 said:

I was there too, what an incredible day. I’m sure every bus in Brum was there. There was also a rugby league final on at Wembley and a rugby union final at Twickenham. The M1 was mental on the way down. I was 18, what a time to be a Villa fan and little did we know what was coming up 12 months later

I and a small band of brothers ( villa fans) went to a north london pub afterwards......by chance it was full to the rafters of Widnes fans, who IIRC won their rugby final....... We were well oiled and chanting Widnes ( we was well knackered from chanting Villa).....The response was totally overwhelming.....The whole pub full of Widnes fans was chanting back "Villa" at the top of their voices.....memorable isn't the word, it was totally amazing.....what a great day..............thanks to Middlesbrough for helping us out.

A day i will never forget.

[TRO]

21 hours ago, il_serpente said:

I don’t think it was a penalty, but it also wasn’t a clear and obvious error, so understandable that the call wasn’t reversed.   The only problem I have with that is the fact that they don’t consistently apply the clear and obvious error caveat for reversing calls, particularly in cases that have gone against Villa.  Our pen against Brighton should have stood if applying that standard.

In the case of offside, no one ever seems to mention the concept.   I guess it’s more difficult to define at what point a clear error has been made than it is to use lines and such to come to a definitive ruling (though there’s still a bit of subjectivity in the close ones).   Still, applying the concept would get rid of these decisions based on a shoelace or shirt sleeve.

There is so much nebolism surrounding the interpretation of these decisions, it conveniently fits in with bias............there is no motive for justice, its like playing to the audience or the popular vote.

Man Utd are the media darlings, they keep the gravy train running..... what do we expect? ..."Lil ole Aston Villa will get over it"...."cheeky buggers pretending to be good at our expense"

[Stevo985]

5 hours ago, Okonokos said:

But an attacker tripping himself up isn't.

Correct. Unfortunately that’s not what happened here.