Bertrand Traoré

[Villaphan04]

Not sure I'd want him near penalties for us 

[nick76]

4 hours ago, PaulC said:

Jack could play the number 10 role quite brilliantly, so I think two wide men are a top priority. 

I think I still prefer him out wider where he has more space than cramped up in the middle as it can get with the central defenders and deep lying midfielders.  Out wider, he's generally more able to start with the ball against the full back and then the right sided central defender, i think really shows him at his best.

Either way, it also depends on who we can get.  If left winger/forward is available then great but if a CAM or number 10 is available then great.  I think we definitely need another right winger/forward but we can choose the best of the other CAM/No.10 or left forward/winger that is available.

[nick76]

8 hours ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

I’m noticing debates about who is the worst of a bad bunch. We got Trez, AEG and Traore. Then there’s Davis and Wes. 
 

Goes to show how much of a rebuild is still needed. 

Yes and No. 

Yes because we know we have a small squad and very little options outside our best XI.

No because when our best XI are out there only one of the above players is getting a start, which RW as Davis and Wes are behind Ollie and then Trez and AEG are back up for Jack or they are sparring with Traore for RW.

 

I still overall think we have much work to do because you go past our core players and we need more strength in our first eleven and some of the current first XI need to push into subs and our current subs then sold, plus we need options.

[Tomaszk]

50 minutes ago, Villaphan04 said:

Not sure I'd want him near penalties for us 

It would be the worst and best thing ever at the same time. He'd probably try to play a 1-2 with the bar and hit the keeper on the way back out so he could tap it in.

[nick76]

7 hours ago, TRO said:

Its an observation that can be levelled at many players.

It's still one of the reasons, i still cringe when we go in to the transfer Market.....I am still not convinced, despite us being better of late.

To have the character to help lift a team in adversity, is a hugely valueable attribute....I think we are short, in the squad of those types.

Luxury players are great, in great times, but when the going gets tough, they disappear...we want some players for "all seasons" players with more consistency.

Not sure I agree with your argument somewhat.  I think you are crossing two themes, one which I agree with and one that I dont.

I think we were hugely successful in the last transfer market.  We couldnt have brought better than Emi and Cash to really solidify our defence.  Emi at times feels unbeatable and that along with working with the defence and that overall character has really given confidence to our defence.  Watkins has been brilliant, a character that is not luxury, who works his socks off and is always an outlet.

Now Barkley started well but faded very quickly so fair on that one but that looked a really good deal and i think most were impressed with that deal....a loan and started so well.  It's so hard to understand why it fell off a cliff.  Traore is the only one that I was dubious about because of the reputation before and he's had spells and he's been poor a lot.

It's incredibly hard to knock when three out of our four permanent players have been brilliant and are players that others look to in Emi, Cash and Ollie.  Our problem is creativity end of the pitch and yes we dont have, other than Jack, somebody to pull us out of a pinch.  It's also that players can lift us up our of adversity but because they cant create or score we dont win.  I think a lot of teams seem to be short of the type of players that I am used to watch in the 80's and 90's that coudl in a bad match, grab the match by the scruff of the neck and try and turn it around.  You just dont see that type of player very often these days, Liverpool have suffered with it, Chelsea and many others.

I also dont think we have that many luxury players. Not our defence, our central midfield are all just players that are essentially the same, that do a job but are neither brilliant or crap.  Jack is the star and Ollie is the striker.  Then two positions, the RW which has the luxury player in and then CAM which either has one of the jobby midfielders in or previously until dropped a "luxury" player in Barkley but now he's dropped we really only have RW with Traore. 

My issue is that we just dont have enough quality.  I believe the likes of McGinn do have that character and the ability to lift a team in adversity just not at the level we are playing these days.  We are at such a higher level now that you need more quality so I think to your point it's not that we have luxury player it's that some of our players arent able to do what you are asking them to do.  When we are playing well they are great but when we arent, they cant do it on their own because they arent quality enough.  I think that's why when we go in front we can stay in front but when we go behind we cant come back.  Part psychological but a massive part that we dont have the quality.  So re your last sentence I think it's the quality we have or lack of it rather than the luxury side, although having upgrades on barkley and Traore would make a huge difference.

[villalad21]

Been a poor signing for us.

The likes of Barkley, Traore and Trezeguet have really been exposed in the time Grealish been out.

We needed players to step up in his absence. None of them did it.

[DCJonah]

11 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

Been a poor signing for us.

The likes of Barkley, Traore and Trezeguet have really been exposed in the time Grealish been out.

We needed players to step up in his absence. None of them did it.

Desperate to be right just once. 

He hasn't been a poor signing at all. He's contributed to our best season in a decade. 

[tomav84]

1 hour ago, villalad21 said:

Been a poor signing for us.

The likes of Barkley, Traore and Trezeguet have really been exposed in the time Grealish been out.

We needed players to step up in his absence. None of them did it.

line 1 - totally incorrect

line 2 - also incorrect...barkley and trez were exposed way before grealish got injured. traore hasn't been exposed at all

line 3 - bang on the money, but the other waffle makes you difficult to take seriously

[TRO]

12 hours ago, Tomaszk said:

Good grief.

What will it take for you to be convinced? Because I can't believe we'll have many more successful transfer windows in the next five years than the one last summer.

Looking forward to see what moves we make.

Luckily our manager you seem insistent on micro-analysing talks about all the time. It's his #1 priority in signing a player.

The buffoon Steve Bruce, who you defended month after month despite crap performances, spent over £20m on James Bree, Henri Lansbury, Scott Hogan and Orjan Nyland.

The last window was very good, but one swallow, doesn't make a summer.......Martinez, Cash & Ollie was superb Business.....Traore is still a bit in and out for me, but hey, wingers usually are.

Thats my worry, we need to have the same success as in the last window, that is my very point.....I still have 10-15 years washing around in my brain, which was very hit and miss.

I have moved on from Steve Bruce, that was very much a lower level of conversation at the time......Dean has proved himself in many ways, but the team itself still has improvements to make and present form reminds us of that....Dean is a far better manager, I have no bones about that, and if I was in a debate about sacking him, i would give him the same support as I gave Bruce, perhaps More so.

I do not micro-analyse Dean at all......But if I see issues, I raise them, that does not mean that I want him gone, far from it.......if that is received as prickly, so be it.

 

[TRO]

1 hour ago, tomav84 said:

line 1 - totally incorrect

line 2 - also incorrect...barkley and trez were exposed way before grealish got injured. traore hasn't been exposed at all

line 3 - bang on the money, but the other waffle makes you difficult to take seriously

Then you have done the right thing, seperate it and register, what you agree with.....why do you call his opinion waffle?....Its hardly the best wording to get the best out of people, just because it doesn't fit your narrative.

I don't happen to disagree with you.....but your response to him is confrontational imo.

 

 

[Adam2003]

11 hours ago, nick76 said:

I think a lot of teams seem to be short of the type of players that I am used to watch in the 80's and 90's that coudl in a bad match, grab the match by the scruff of the neck and try and turn it around

I think it’s because the general standard of defending is so much higher (partly because of not being able to clatter people)... those players now are so well marshalled, have been studied on video in multiple training sessions, and when they start grabbing the match by the scruff of the neck just get somewhat shut down - it’s more a team game than it ever was in some ways. But the influence of the individual is still crucial, just look at Jack. So in short: I don’t know what point I am trying to make.

[Risso]

3 hours ago, villalad21 said:

Been a poor signing for us.

The likes of Barkley, Traore and Trezeguet have really been exposed in the time Grealish been out.

We needed players to step up in his absence. None of them did it.

I agree. Our three wingers are all terrible, and none are of the standard required. The defence has been great, we now need similar levels of ability in the support attacking roles. 

[Phil Silvers]

Bertie is a work in progress that could be super coached in to a very good player, he has great vision and a supberb ability to change direction and a magic left peg, working with Jack and the coaches will see him just keep getting better............. hopefully.

[sne]

1 minute ago, Phil Silvers said:

Bertie is a work in progress that could be super coached in to a very good player, he has great vision and a supberb ability to change direction and a magic left peg, working with Jack and the coaches will see him just keep getting better............. hopefully.

Chelsea, AJAX and Lyon notorious for not being able to coach and develop players, thank god the lad finally has a chance at learning something 

[Vive_La_Villa]

I have to be honest. I’m not a fan. Hoping for significant improvement next season. 

[Phil Silvers]

10 minutes ago, sne said:

Chelsea, AJAX and Lyon notorious for not being able to coach and develop players, thank god the lad finally has a chance at learning something 

Ahhhhh, this is why I made sure to say could be and hopefully. You know, just incase someone disagreed or thought I was talking complete bollox, always leave an out.

[sne]

1 minute ago, Phil Silvers said:

Ahhhhh, this is why I made sure to say could be and hopefully. You know, just incase someone disagreed or thought I was talking complete bollox, always leave an out.

Think he will always be a frustrating player capable of excellent moments. Don't think he'll ever be a consistent performer thou.

When he's playing with confidence he can hurt teams but I hope he isn't our starting RW next season.

[Phil Silvers]

2 minutes ago, sne said:

Think he will always be a frustrating player capable of excellent moments. Don't think he'll ever be a consistent performer thou.

When he's playing with confidence he can hurt teams but I hope he isn't our starting RW next season.

There's definitely a sporadic magical quality to some of it but not yet good enough for what our potential progress should be for next season, he's the one I would keep as backup though for now as maybe, IF! we can get more out of him, he would be an asset. 

[nick76]

50 minutes ago, Adam2003 said:

I think it’s because the general standard of defending is so much higher (partly because of not being able to clatter people)... those players now are so well marshalled, have been studied on video in multiple training sessions, and when they start grabbing the match by the scruff of the neck just get somewhat shut down - it’s more a team game than it ever was in some ways. But the influence of the individual is still crucial, just look at Jack. So in short: I don’t know what point I am trying to make.

I do know what you mean.  It’s hard to really write it down and I was so bad at trying to do.

[nick76]

26 minutes ago, Phil Silvers said:

Ahhhhh, this is why I made sure to say could be and hopefully. You know, just incase someone disagreed or thought I was talking complete bollox, always leave an out.

 

just kidding mate