Bertrand Traoré

[Vive_La_Villa]

32 minutes ago, YouUnastanFren said:

I think he's been roughly as inconsistent as AEG so far in his Villa career.

In Trez's case consistent is not a compliment

Hopefully not this inconsistent after 2 and a half seasons with us. 

[Philosopher]

3 hours ago, tomav84 said:

traore: 6 goals, 3 assists

ghaz: 7 goals (2 of which pens), 0 assists

trez: 0 goals, 2 assists

what exactly would justify it for you out of interest?

Traore was OK in a team playing well same as the other two. As soon as he has to carry real creative responsibility what has he done? Buggar all. 

For me all three are in the same bracket (not good enough). If I had to pick one I'd go for the trier or the new guy. 

 

[YouUnastanFren]

41 minutes ago, Philosopher said:

Traore was OK in a team playing well same as the other two. As soon as he has to carry real creative responsibility what has he done? Buggar all. 

Was Trezeguet OK in a team playing well or did he only manage 1 assist and 0 goals while missing chance after chance after chance?

Traore hasn't currently been good enough to carry our attack singlehandedly and output the same excellent numbers he was before but that doesn't mean he's on the same level as a guy who has missed more sitters than I've had hot dinners.

[Philosopher]

13 minutes ago, YouUnastanFren said:

Was Trezeguet OK in a team playing well or did he only manage 1 assist and 0 goals while missing chance after chance after chance?

Traore hasn't currently been good enough to carry our attack singlehandedly and output the same excellent numbers he was before but that doesn't mean he's on the same level as a guy who has missed more sitters than I've had hot dinners.

Yes he was. Trez is about more than goals and assists, unlike the other two. Look at the Results with him starting this season and the other two starting. With him in the team Jack was tracking back less and Barkley was mostly covering Jack's defensive work. Trezguet was doing the same defensive work as the two them himself on the right hand side, plus bursting forward and along with Watkins doing most of the high pressing. 

[PaulC]

Yes Trez did a lot more off the ball than Traore does. His work-rate is far higher. So hes contributing more even when hes not scoring or making assist. That doesnt make him good enough but neither have bene good enough in my opinion. 

[Vive_La_Villa]

I’m noticing debates about who is the worst of a bad bunch. We got Trez, AEG and Traore. Then there’s Davis and Wes. 
 

Goes to show how much of a rebuild is still needed. 

[barry'sboots]

I think BT is the far more skilful player and is capable of doing special things.  Again, he has come in and done okay.  With a full pre-season behind him and being a bit more settled I am hopeful that we will see a really good player next season, especially if we can bring in some real quality alongside and in competition.

Trez works hard but he is devoid of quality and has had long enough now.

I don't like AEG at all.  He has all the talent but looks soft to me and is selfish - he is all about creating goalscoring opportunities for himself - and is becoming very predicatble and easy to mark in that respect - and never gets his head up to look for others.

[Vive_La_Villa]

9 minutes ago, barry'sboots said:

I think BT is the far more skilful player and is capable of doing special things.  Again, he has come in and done okay.  With a full pre-season behind him and being a bit more settled I am hopeful that we will see a really good player next season, especially if we can bring in some real quality alongside and in competition.

Trez works hard but he is devoid of quality and has had long enough now.

I don't like AEG at all.  He has all the talent but looks soft to me and is selfish - he is all about creating goalscoring opportunities for himself - and is becoming very predicatble and easy to mark in that respect - and never gets his head up to look for others.

Spot on.

[YouUnastanFren]

Trez's workrate is good but his first season he looked exhausted after 20 minutes every game like Traore did at the start of this one. To his credit he seemed to have worked hard over lockdown and came back fully fit. After a full preseason Traore's workrate will be similar I'm sure.

The difference will be that Traore can convert chances into goals as well as converting possession into chances. Trez can do neither.

[Philosopher]

27 minutes ago, YouUnastanFren said:

Trez's workrate is good but his first season he looked exhausted after 20 minutes every game like Traore did at the start of this one. To his credit he seemed to have worked hard over lockdown and came back fully fit. After a full preseason Traore's workrate will be similar I'm sure.

The difference will be that Traore can convert chances into goals as well as converting possession into chances. Trez can do neither.

Traore had a lazy reputation amongst the Lyon fans so I don’t expect to see him running his arse off like Trez he simply isn't that guy. Traore has 2 or 3 moments a match where he does something nice with the ball at his feet otherwise does bugger all. 

While I do hope that he can improve with a preseason, but I'm not going to hold my breath. 

[YouUnastanFren]

4 minutes ago, Philosopher said:

Traore had a lazy reputation amongst the Lyon fans so I don’t expect to see him running his arse off like Trez he simply isn't that guy.

Lyon fans are the United fans of Ligue 1, I wouldn't put any weight in anything they say. Glory hunters that started supporting when they were winning the league every year, now they win nothing and are very bitter about it. I saw one on Reddit say Traore was the worst player he'd ever seen and another say he couldn't trap a bag of cement. 

There's a reason Liverpool were circling him a few seasons ago and were only put off because they couldn't negotiate down the €40m price tag, he has a very high ceiling imo.

[TRO]

3 hours ago, Philosopher said:

Traore was OK in a team playing well same as the other two. As soon as he has to carry real creative responsibility what has he done? Buggar all. 

For me all three are in the same bracket (not good enough). If I had to pick one I'd go for the trier or the new guy. 

 

Its an observation that can be levelled at many players.

It's still one of the reasons, i still cringe when we go in to the transfer Market.....I am still not convinced, despite us being better of late.

To have the character to help lift a team in adversity, is a hugely valueable attribute....I think we are short, in the squad of those types.

Luxury players are great, in great times, but when the going gets tough, they disappear...we want some players for "all seasons" players with more consistency.

[Mjvilla]

9 minutes ago, TRO said:

Its an observation that can be levelled at many players.

It's still one of the reasons, i still cringe when we go in to the transfer Market.....I am still not convinced, despite us being better of late.

To have the character to help lift a team in adversity, is a hugely valueable attribute....I think we are short, in the squad of those types.

Luxury players are great, in great times, but when the going gets tough, they disappear...we want some players for "all seasons" players with more consistency.

Perhaps a little harsh, if we had wasted the money that almost every other premier league club had wastedbon their squad builds, we would almost certainly be a championship club right now. We haven't been perfect but we've been better than most.

[Philosopher]

30 minutes ago, TRO said:

Its an observation that can be levelled at many players.

It's still one of the reasons, i still cringe when we go in to the transfer Market.....I am still not convinced, despite us being better of late.

To have the character to help lift a team in adversity, is a hugely valueable attribute....I think we are short, in the squad of those types.

Luxury players are great, in great times, but when the going gets tough, they disappear...we want some players for "all seasons" players with more consistency.

It's a matter of consistency of the player. If he was consistent during games and over the course of a season Traore would be great. However even in good time we only really see flashes. 

Those players with proven consistency and a big game mentalities get snapped up by the top sides generally. A few get missed or prove themselves later. Bit they are hard to come by. Very much clubs in situation need a great scouting department and a have to be clinical once they identify good targets.

[Delphinho123]

1 hour ago, YouUnastanFren said:

Lyon fans are the United fans of Ligue 1, I wouldn't put any weight in anything they say. Glory hunters that started supporting when they were winning the league every year, now they win nothing and are very bitter about it. I saw one on Reddit say Traore was the worst player he'd ever seen and another say he couldn't trap a bag of cement. 

There's a reason Liverpool were circling him a few seasons ago and were only put off because they couldn't negotiate down the €40m price tag, he has a very high ceiling imo.

I won’t comment on Lyon fans as I don’t know them but so far, Traore has been a poor signing for us. He’s been mostly rubbish apart from perhaps 3 games. 

It’s nice that he has a high ceiling but I’d like to see him actually play well for us consistently before talking about how good he might become. 

There’s a reason a right sided attacking player is the top of everyone’s wishlist for the summer and that’s because Traore has been massively underwhelming. 

His only positive for me has been he is ever so slightly less crap that Trezeguet. 

[Dave-R]

I think Traore will be better next season and so he should be settled more. I think he's done enough this season so far and has certainly tried hard. Sure there have been games he's been missing in but hey with had many games where much of our front line since Covid has been invisible, it's been frustrating with them.

How does Smith find a way to bring our frontline players in the game more than what were seeing them as of late. Creativity from an attacking midfielder were severely lacking in and unless we pay big this summer then next season we may struggle as well. We have no one to really open up defences at any moment apart from Grealish. The answer is simple isn't it that our Wingers are not dangerous enough, I doubt any defence in the premier threats them and our Wingers are that easy to nullify opposition defences hardly break of sweat against us.

Traore may be kept on for a second season but I'd find it absolute crackers if we keep Ghazi and Trezegeut another season, in fact we had better find two brand new Wingers come Summer one at least who is one heck of a delivery specialist and can cross a ball.

[YouUnastanFren]

8 minutes ago, Delphinho123 said:

I won’t comment on Lyon fans as I don’t know them but so far, Traore has been a poor signing for us. He’s been mostly rubbish apart from perhaps 3 games. 

I don't think that's accurate at all really. He put in more than 3 good performances in a row over Christmas imo, let alone in total for the whole season.

I'd say he was definitely not "rubbish" against Wolves, Burnley, West Brom, Palace, Chelsea and United in a row. That's basically every game from when he broke into the starting lineup right up until the whole team got covid.

Arguably played well against City and Newcastle after covid as well really. Just seemed a lot less energetic again.

17 minutes ago, Delphinho123 said:

There’s a reason a right sided attacking player is the top of everyone’s wishlist for the summer and that’s because Traore has been massively underwhelming. 

Definitely not the case for me. A number 10 is way more important imo, Barkley has been a failure and we have nobody else even threatening to play that role well aside from the two first choice wingers.  I would like more depth on the wings instead of Trezeguet but I think we need depth elsewhere before that. Full back for instance.

[PaulC]

Jack could play the number 10 role quite brilliantly, so I think two wide men are a top priority. 

[Dave-R]

39 minutes ago, Delphinho123 said:

I won’t comment on Lyon fans as I don’t know them but so far, Traore has been a poor signing for us. He’s been mostly rubbish apart from perhaps 3 games. 

It’s nice that he has a high ceiling but I’d like to see him actually play well for us consistently before talking about how good he might become. 

There’s a reason a right sided attacking player is the top of everyone’s wishlist for the summer and that’s because Traore has been massively underwhelming. 

His only positive for me has been he is ever so slightly less crap that Trezeguet. 

We ain't going to get rid of three Wingers that's for sure so who would you keep out of Traore, Ghazi or Trezegeut, the answer for me is keep Traore as he could get better by a second season with us at least. Ghazi and Trezegeut have been at the club for seasons and there's a trend with hose two now where you know it's going to be a few goals a season and that's all it is with them. There's nothing else to Ghazi or Trezegeuts game, they can't open defences up, deliver to Watkins or a lone striker, ones better than the other at attacking and the other better at defending but it's just always mostly poor with those two. Time has come for us to realise that Ghazi and Trezegeut should go first in the Winger department, they are frustrating to have here now.

Sure we could pick up a couple of championship stars who could perform way better than Ghazi and Trezegeut. If we really want to get into Europe and not be a disappointment were going to have to bring in two lads who can cause any defence in this premier a horrid time for 70 mins or more.

I think Traore would be last sold out of the three all because he's the most recent and shows most signs of actually benefiting from Smith's training. When Traore plays with Jack and they both swap sides throughout the game they can actually be a heck of a menace, that's when I see Traore being most menacing. One game me and my lad were watching and we forgot how many times he had Grealish had swapped sides but it was San awful lot. They were confusing opposition so much all game that they struggled to cope with the pair, especially who they should mark and the work they had to do in keeping such tight compact gaps.

Edited April 1, 2021 by Dave-R

[Tomaszk]

4 hours ago, TRO said:

Its an observation that can be levelled at many players.

It's still one of the reasons, i still cringe when we go in to the transfer Market.....I am still not convinced, despite us being better of late.

Good grief.

What will it take for you to be convinced? Because I can't believe we'll have many more successful transfer windows in the next five years than the one last summer.

Looking forward to see what moves we make.

4 hours ago, TRO said:

To have the character to help lift a team in adversity, is a hugely valueable attribute....I think we are short, in the squad of those types.

Luxury players are great, in great times, but when the going gets tough, they disappear...we want some players for "all seasons" players with more consistency.

Luckily our manager you seem insistent on micro-analysing talks about all the time. It's his #1 priority in signing a player.

The buffoon Steve Bruce, who you defended month after month despite crap performances, spent over £20m on James Bree, Henri Lansbury, Scott Hogan and Orjan Nyland.