magnkarl Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 14 minutes ago, Awol said: It’s never happened, except for that time it happened. Cool. Again though, if it’s such a non-subject we might ask why Pelosi floated the idea of mutiny to address it. With Mad Mitch and Liz Cheney now going for him it’ll be very interesting to see if they can get Trump out before the 20th. He’s more than outlived his usefulness to the establishment R party, but this won’t save it. Dem voters hate them for enabling, the MAGA crowd will hate them for folding. What goes around... The point being; the one time that it did happen it was widely discussed in the government, amongst generals and key staff before it happened. 100% of the time it happened it happened in a way which directly contradicts the Chain of Command principle. The other side never happened, so I don't get why people are so into fear mongering about a single man potentially ruining the planet without any of his generals being able to stop it when evidence shows that this is extremely unlikely to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted January 13, 2021 Moderator Share Posted January 13, 2021 2 hours ago, Rugeley Villa said: First female in 67 years has been executed in the US. Doctors described her as mentally unstable and should not have been given the death sentence. I'm no advocate of the death sentence, far from it in fact however there was no doubt about this women's guilt and the crime was beyond horrific. Given the detail in the planning it is hard to accept the mitigation offered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 6 minutes ago, TrentVilla said: I'm no advocate of the death sentence, far from it in fact however there was no doubt about this women's guilt and the crime was beyond horrific. Given the detail in the planning it is hard to accept the mitigation offered. I've only read part of it but its a truly horrendous crime. However executing someone with serious mental health issues does not sit right with me. It's awful. I'm glad we don't have the death penalty here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted January 13, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted January 13, 2021 2 hours ago, Genie said: How many needed for the 2/3 majority? Last night CNN were taking about 17 needed. I have to say when you read the statements put out about why they are voting to impeach, it's pretty unarguable. You could argue anyone who doesn't impeach him now are actually in violation of their own oaths. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted January 13, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted January 13, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, Genie said: How many needed for the 2/3 majority? Edited January 13, 2021 by sidcow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted January 13, 2021 Moderator Share Posted January 13, 2021 44 minutes ago, DCJonah said: I've only read part of it but its a truly horrendous crime. However executing someone with serious mental health issues does not sit right with me. It's awful. I'm glad we don't have the death penalty here. The point I was making is that the level of planning involved in the crime to my mind places serious doubt about the mental incapacity at the time of the crime. As I say I'm not pro death penalty but I find it very very difficult to be sympathetic in this particular case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolta Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 (edited) 30 minutes ago, TrentVilla said: The point I was making is that the level of planning involved in the crime to my mind places serious doubt about the mental incapacity at the time of the crime. As I say I'm not pro death penalty but I find it very very difficult to be sympathetic in this particular case. I read this the other day and it definitely made me sympathetic: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/05/lisa-montgomery-death-row-execution-history Quote ‘A lifetime of torture’: the story of the woman Trump is rushing to execute Lisa Montgomery, the only woman on federal death row, was found guilty of an ‘especially heinous’ crime – but those who have looked deeply into her agonized life see it differently Warning: this article contains graphic details of sexual abuse and violence which some readers may find upsetting But yes it's about as awful a crime as you can imagine. Edited January 13, 2021 by blandy added extract 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted January 13, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted January 13, 2021 Quote Ten former nuclear launch control officers who once held the keys needed to fire on the president’s order have signed an open letter saying they think Donald Trump should not be entrusted with the nation’s nuclear codes. The letter, issued Thursday, says the decision to use nuclear weapons requires “composure, judgment, restraint and diplomatic skill” — all qualities that the former Air Force officers who signed it said Trump lacks. “On the contrary, he has shown himself time and again to be easily baited and quick to lash out, dismissive of expert consultation and ill-informed of even basic military and international affairs — including, most especially, nuclear weapons,” the letter says. “Donald Trump should not be the nation’s commander-in-chief. He should not be entrusted with the nuclear launch codes. He should not have his finger on the button.” The letter is the latest in an extraordinary series of missives signed this year by diplomats and national security experts warning of the dangers they think a Trump presidency would pose. Last month, in a break from the trend, 88 retired military leaders endorsed the Republican presidential nominee. But most of the letters have reflected the views of those who consider Trump unfit to be commander in chief. The former missileers who signed Thursday’s letter served at the nation’s four underground launch centers in the Great Plains from as long ago as the 1960s to, most recently, 2013. They do not endorse Democratic nominee Hillary Clinton, or even mention her name, in the letter. 2016 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 7 minutes ago, mjmooney said: 2016 Like the former British Generals who run to the papers about how short of kit the army is - after retiring. When they’re still in uniform it’s ‘yes, Prime Minister’, ‘cos that’s the job. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted January 13, 2021 Moderator Share Posted January 13, 2021 2 hours ago, KenjiOgiwara said: I don't get why people claim he's being censored. He's consisently broken the rules of social media companies for 4-5 years. He got away with it cause he was either a presidential candidate or president. Now he's out thus he doesn't. This isn't spesific to him. Ordinary people breaking the rules are banned every day. I actually think they should have banned him before. I see no reason why there should be different rules based on your job description. I agree. The thing with world leaders etc. from the policy that Twitter Inc,. as a business decided for themselves asa policy that the views of these leaders are inherently Newsworthy and of greater interest, so they decided, themselves, to apply different sets of conditions upon their tweets. Twitter is quite at liberty to review that policy and has now done so. Better late than never. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post HanoiVillan Posted January 13, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted January 13, 2021 15 minutes ago, Rolta said: I read this the other day and it definitely made me sympathetic: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/05/lisa-montgomery-death-row-execution-history (I think I should be pasting in the text as per the rules, but this seems like a side topic atm, so I haven't). But yes it's about as awful a crime as you can imagine. Feels weird to say 'thank you' for what was honestly a deeply upsetting and unpleasant read, but that seems like extremely important context to the situation. On a separate level to the specifics of this case, Trump's efforts to rush through executions before his term ends - just like his pardoning of military war criminals - speaks to what a depraved man he really is. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choffer Posted January 13, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted January 13, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 5 hours ago, Awol said: Welcome to every professional armed forces on earth. Not something to celebrate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted January 13, 2021 Moderator Share Posted January 13, 2021 7 minutes ago, Awol said: Like the former British Generals who run to the papers about how short of kit the army is - after retiring. When they’re still in uniform it’s ‘yes, Prime Minister’, ‘cos that’s the job. Quite - with the exception about the "running to the papers" bit - the Generals/Admiral(s) of the Fleet Air Chief Marshall(s) can and may disagree in private with the PM or Ministers, but not publicly. As you say, it's in the job description. The other thing I was gonna say is when you said 5 hours ago, Awol said: 11 hours ago, chrisp65 said: It’s legal if its legal is a really scary view of the world. data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAPABAP///wAAACH5BAEKAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAICRAEAOw== data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAPABAP///wAAACH5BAEKAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAICRAEAOw== data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAPABAP///wAAACH5BAEKAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAICRAEAOw== Welcome to every professional armed forces on earth That kind of overlooks QRs - so it's not just "if it's legal it's legal" and that's all there is to it - there's a whole bunch of rules for the Military which are in addition to criminal/civil law around conduct, RoEs etc. It is absolutely not a free for all as long as you don't break the law. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 @blandy for the benefit of civilians, what are 'QRs'? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted January 13, 2021 Moderator Share Posted January 13, 2021 Sorry, Queen's Regulations - a long list of regulations that service personnel have to adhere to. There's also other rules and regs outside of QRs, often specific to locations or situations etc. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnkarl Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 (edited) Next in line, Josh Hawley and Ted Cruz.. Edited January 13, 2021 by magnkarl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 59 minutes ago, TrentVilla said: The point I was making is that the level of planning involved in the crime to my mind places serious doubt about the mental incapacity at the time of the crime. As I say I'm not pro death penalty but I find it very very difficult to be sympathetic in this particular case. I'm not really sympathetic, I just think its **** up to execute mentally ill people. There was planning involved in her crime but that doesn't mean she wasn't seriously mentally ill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post LondonLax Posted January 13, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted January 13, 2021 Executing people is wrong full stop but that doesn't matter to the 'eye for an eye' crowd. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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