Ashley Westwood

[Woodytom]

Pulling up a quote from 3 years ago to prove a point.

Wow, I've seen some pathetic things on this forum, but that takes the cake.

Oh, especially when your point isn't even't proven because you know, people can change their opinion in 3 years? Novel and difficult concept to grasp I know.

Newcastle were 5th in 2012. I used to think they were a decent team.

That's changed now because things change in 3 years in football.

I was asked to get them. I was quite happy to just keep my word as it was. I could probably find ones from 3-6 months ago.

 

[Woodytom]

You don't like people enjoying football do you? It's just something I've picked up over the years. You think it's churlish. 

eh? What you on about. You asked who raved about him? 

 

It clearly annoys you. That is a general point.

So if a player has a really good game, and I say he's good, really good, that means from henceforth I think he's a superstar? 

Do you not understand basic things like context or are you so wrapped up in your disgust at anyone taking pleasure in the game that you don't care a shit about it?

hahahahahahahaha. Like you've never taken things out of context. 

nothing annoys me here doug. Certainly not someone thinking ashley westwood is good. I just disagree.

I made a point to support my disagreement and you then challenged it. So I proved it. 

Instead of you holding your hands up and saying, yeah maybe there was a time where people raved about him a bit more than they do now, you just criticise my opinion further.

Maybe there are a few examples of people raving about him more than they do now. That proves nothing in the wider context of the debate. You have stated that it proves he's not very good, it really does not do that. On any level. 

I didn't say that people raving about him proves he's not very good. 

I said, that the way that people speak about him now (having previously raved about him) shows that he's not very good. The quotes I used were the first I came to. Like I say theyl be a lot more recent ones linking him to an England call up. 

People are starting to realise that he's not very good. He's previously had better players around him. 

[Woodytom]

He has been disspointing so far this year. Still rate him. Will be intresting to see how he'll do under Remi. Think there is a gem to be unlocked in Westwood. Seriously lacking in confidence at the moment. 

And Woodytom, no one wins by you being right. 

i don't give my opinion for people to win. I want nothing more than AW to be the best midfielder on the planet. It's just blatantly obvious that this is a level above him.

[Tomaszk]

Pulling up a quote from 3 years ago to prove a point.

Wow, I've seen some pathetic things on this forum, but that takes the cake.

Oh, especially when your point isn't even't proven because you know, people can change their opinion in 3 years? Novel and difficult concept to grasp I know.

Newcastle were 5th in 2012. I used to think they were a decent team.

That's changed now because things change in 3 years in football.

I was asked to get them. I was quite happy to just keep my word as it was. I could probably find ones from 3-6 months ago.

 

Do it.

[dont_do_it_doug.]

You don't like people enjoying football do you? It's just something I've picked up over the years. You think it's churlish. 

eh? What you on about. You asked who raved about him? 

 

It clearly annoys you. That is a general point.

So if a player has a really good game, and I say he's good, really good, that means from henceforth I think he's a superstar? 

Do you not understand basic things like context or are you so wrapped up in your disgust at anyone taking pleasure in the game that you don't care a shit about it?

hahahahahahahaha. Like you've never taken things out of context. 

nothing annoys me here doug. Certainly not someone thinking ashley westwood is good. I just disagree.

I made a point to support my disagreement and you then challenged it. So I proved it. 

Instead of you holding your hands up and saying, yeah maybe there was a time where people raved about him a bit more than they do now, you just criticise my opinion further.

Maybe there are a few examples of people raving about him more than they do now. That proves nothing in the wider context of the debate. You have stated that it proves he's not very good, it really does not do that. On any level. 

I didn't say that people raving about him proves he's not very good. 

I said, that the way that people speak about him now (having previously raved about him) shows that he's not very good. The quotes I used were the first I came to. Like I say theyl be a lot more recent ones linking him to an England call up. 

People are starting to realise that he's not very good. He's previously had better players around him. 

Read my post again. I have quoted you verbatim. I made sure of it. It still does not prove what you say it does. Not in the slightest. You're twisting peoples words to suit an agenda.

Most people think he's decent. Still. Even when the squad as a whole is being decimated. I have already agreed that most people realised he's not "very good" a while ago, well done you.

Still an OK player with a part to play.

[PieFacE]

I'm starting to think Westwood is a bit of a problem for us. To be honest, I'd completely drop him. I think his positional awareness hinders players like Sanchez who are left looking a bit stupid because Westwood isn't where he should be for a defensive midfielder. Good squad player, hoping he drops to the bench though. 

 

EDIT Wow, reading the last couple of pages is pretty tragic haha. Worst. Thread. Ever. 

Edited November 5, 2015 by PieFacE

[dont_do_it_doug.]

Sorry!

I think we're done anyway.

[sexbelowsound]

I think the problem is playing him as a defensive midfielder because he isn't one.

I don't think Westwood works in a 2 man midfield anyway. He is the middle man, he needs a more attack minded and more defence minded midfielder along side him.

If Garde goes for his 4-1-4-1 formation I can see Westwood central of the 4 with Gana. If he goes for his 4-2-3-1 then I expect to see Westwood sitting out.

[GeordieVillan]

He's a neat tidy player, but for some reason I don't think he does enough. I would also say that he hasn't been out of the team long enough for an alternative combination of central midfielders to be given another go. He's and Delph are the 2 consistent factors in one of the worst Villa midfield's I've ever seen.

However, that doesn't mean he can't come good and develop into a much better player under a new manager. Everyone has a clean slate.

[Woodytom]

I think the problem is playing him as a defensive midfielder because he isn't one.

I don't think Westwood works in a 2 man midfield anyway. He is the middle man, he needs a more attack minded and more defence minded midfielder along side him.

If Garde goes for his 4-1-4-1 formation I can see Westwood central of the 4 with Gana. If he goes for his 4-2-3-1 then I expect to see Westwood sitting out.

I don't get this he doesn't work in a 2 thing? He hasn't worked full stop.

He's less exposed in a 3 but that goes for any midfielder. Unless an additional 2 midfielders allows you to then impose yourself on the game (like it does yaya toure  (no I'm not comparing him to yaya toure)), then it's pretty pointless playing that person. You might as well play 2 midfielders who suit either or. 

We can't use another midfielder to help get the best out of ashley westwood who is never going to stamp his authority on the game.

[BOF]

Westwood has been one of our best players in the past 2 or 3 games.  As someone who wanted him out in place of Veretout up to recently I have to admit that he has raised his own game even if the team haven't been able to deliver results off the back of it.  He was far and away our most creative player against Southampton for example, creating a huge amount of opportunities for the forward players.  More power to him and the better he and everyone else plays, the better for us.  If he continues to get picked for the side then it's only the 'fault' (sic) of the other players who haven't been able to oust him.

[sexbelowsound]

I think the problem is playing him as a defensive midfielder because he isn't one.

I don't think Westwood works in a 2 man midfield anyway. He is the middle man, he needs a more attack minded and more defence minded midfielder along side him.

If Garde goes for his 4-1-4-1 formation I can see Westwood central of the 4 with Gana. If he goes for his 4-2-3-1 then I expect to see Westwood sitting out.

I don't get this he doesn't work in a 2 thing? He hasn't worked full stop.

He's less exposed in a 3 but that goes for any midfielder. Unless an additional 2 midfielders allows you to then impose yourself on the game (like it does yaya toure  (no I'm not comparing him to yaya toure)), then it's pretty pointless playing that person. You might as well play 2 midfielders who suit either or. 

We can't use another midfielder to help get the best out of ashley westwood who is never going to stamp his authority on the game.

He needs to play in a 3 because when he plays in a 2 there is too much emphasis placed on the defensive aspect of the game because we aren't very good as a team. 

Westwood is not a defensive minded player and does not possess the traits needed to be one so when he is asked to do so it completely negates the positive impact he could have on a game.

He is a decent player and a player that given the right role can offer something to the squad.

[villaglint]

Westwood has been one of our best players in the past 2 or 3 games.  As someone who wanted him out in place of Veretout up to recently I have to admit that he has raised his own game even if the team haven't been able to deliver results off the back of it.  He was far and away our most creative player against Southampton for example, creating a huge amount of opportunities for the forward players.  More power to him and the better he and everyone else plays, the better for us.  If he continues to get picked for the side then it's only the 'fault' (sic) of the other players who haven't been able to oust him.

I had a reluctant look in this thread (easily the worst on VT) and have now been drawn into an even more reluctant post!

I dont want to enter the debate on our Westy because I know the rivers run high on both sides. 

However I wondered if you could jog my memory on the Southampton game. I dont remember him creating a huge amount of chances. I was at the game and I only remember 1 decent chance and a couple of half chances for us in the whole game. May have been the booze wiping out some brain cells though so please do prove me wrong.

 

[VILLAMARV]

I hate this thread.

[BOF]

I dont want to enter the debate on our Westy because I know the rivers run high on both sides. 

I don't enter the debate in that sense either because the rivers don't run high with me regarding Westwood; as evidenced by me being able to criticise him one week and applaud him the next.  I can't find the stats that Sky used on the night that showed he had provided (at the time) 8 key passes compared to his nearest team-mate's 3.

[bobzy]

I dont want to enter the debate on our Westy because I know the rivers run high on both sides. 

I don't enter the debate in that sense either because the rivers don't run high with me regarding Westwood; as evidenced by me being able to criticise him one week and applaud him the next.  I can't find the stats that Sky used on the night that showed he had provided (at the time) 8 key passes compared to his nearest team-mate's 3.

Oh God, not key passes again... we'll never hear the end of them being a "pointless statistic"

[BOF]

Oh God, not key passes again... we'll never hear the end of them being a "pointless statistic"

Depends who's posts you read I find.

[penguin]

Without meaning to start a debate on them, I had always thought a key pass was a pass which lead to a good goal scoring chance, obviously this would be open to interpretation but I still thought it was a good metric; almost like an assist except where the shooter has messed it up or only come close. But I've just looked and Opta record a key pass as simply a pass to someone who then shoots, certainly reduced the importance I placed on it.

[Stevo985]

Without meaning to start a debate on them, I had always thought a key pass was a pass which lead to a good goal scoring chance, obviously this would be open to interpretation but I still thought it was a good metric; almost like an assist except where the shooter has messed it up or only come close. But I've just looked and Opta record a key pass as simply a pass to someone who then shoots, certainly reduced the importance I placed on it.

Some people have decided it's not a good metric because it was used as a positive for Westwood.

I'm sure if it reflected poorly on Westwood it would be a great metric.

[Tom13]

A key pass is a pass that leads to a shot I think. Whether they count when someone lays the ball off for a 30-yard effort, I'm not sure.