Lupinthe5th Posted December 14, 2022 Share Posted December 14, 2022 4 minutes ago, Zatman said: They are as good as. Why would they not be better? They have different skills on the pitch but because they dont score doesnt mean they cant be called greatest either Do you know why players normally get stuck in goal and defence at school/clubs? There is no way all those players you mentioned are better than Messi, Pele and Maradona. Neuer, Xabi, Iniesta, Maldini aren't scoring 92 goals in a calendar year. They aren't scoring that Maradona goal against England. They arent producing Magic Moments to lift us of our chairs on many many occasions. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 2 hours ago, Lupinthe5th said: Do you know why players normally get stuck in goal and defence at school/clubs? There is no way all those players you mentioned are better than Messi, Pele and Maradona. Neuer, Xabi, Iniesta, Maldini aren't scoring 92 goals in a calendar year. They aren't scoring that Maradona goal against England. They arent producing Magic Moments to lift us of our chairs on many many occasions. I'm sure Maldini and Neuer had plenty of inspired performances that kept goals out that helped their teams to glory. How's Neuer meant to score 92 goals from in goal? He did however completely revolutionise the position and helped football be a more attacking game in general in the process. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juanpablosaliceband Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 Brazil Ronaldo. He could have retired at the age of 21 and been remembered as one of the three greatest players of all time. Easily the best player I’ve ever seen and I just don’t see how Pele could have been as good. He could do everything I’ve seen any other player do and more. He was the true once in a lifetime talent. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sulberto21 Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 All greats but Pele was the king amongst princes. He was that good. Theres also been very gifted players such as Garrincha and Cryuff etc. but Then again Maradona and Napoli. It’s so hard to choose. Messi ever since his debut has pretty much been the best. Gabby Agbonlahor is the goat. How many of the others have needed directions to the goal??? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted December 15, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted December 15, 2022 9 hours ago, momo said: Messi barely runs now. Don't understand the plaudits. Argentina has a good collective now. Maradona won Argentina the 1986 world cup. That team wouldn't have achieved anything without Maradona. Maradona is the real GOAT. Messi carried Argentina to the copa America last year and he’s pretty much carrying them to this World Cup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted December 15, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted December 15, 2022 11 hours ago, Zatman said: For me its flawed anyway in attackers favour. Xavi, Modric and Iniesta contributed as much as all 3 but didnt score millions of goals Then Manuel Neuer who has won nearly everything and changed how goalkeeping is actually played. Also Paolo Maldini the greatest defender ever. Was a few touches away from winning the World Cup and Euros to go with his 4/5 /European Cup/Champions Leagues I agree that these discussions are skewed towards attackers. But even if you take away that bias, the answer is still Messi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhan_Zhuang Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 I still went with Maradona... Adversary, injuries, drugs, mafia, dragging a struggling Napoli side to legendary status... But it certainly is close between Maradona and Messi. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonesy7211 Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 Earlier in the thread somebody mentioned that players are protected more now, but to also add to that I think players are handled better off the pitch too. I think Gazza would be in the conversation if he'd gone to Utd instead of Spurs. Best player at the 90 world cup. I think Maradona would have lasted far longer too, and his career wouldn't have ended in relative ignominy. But I voted Maradona. I think he'd be incredible in the modern game. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sulberto21 Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 3 minutes ago, Jonesy7211 said: Earlier in the thread somebody mentioned that players are protected more now, but to also add to that I think players are handled better off the pitch too. I think Gazza would be in the conversation if he'd gone to Utd instead of Spurs. Best player at the 90 world cup. I think Maradona would have lasted far longer too, and his career wouldn't have ended in relative ignominy. But I voted Maradona. I think he'd be incredible in the modern game. Nail on the head. We have to assume the greats of yesteryear would be fit and professional to todays standards. Pele and Maradona would score for fun in the Premier League. Gerd Muller v Ben Mee? , then there’s the defenders - Bobby Moore in today’s game wow! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 That theory only ever seems to be applied moving forwards though... Like no modern footballer could be great in the 60s/70s/80s which is unfair, they'd adapt in a different way but still be good enough to adapt Pele, Maradona, messi would all be great players in any era 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fun Factory Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 Pele for me. Unsullied by the rampant commercialism of todays game, or off the field troubles. He really did make football look like the beautiful game. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bannedfromHandV Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 What’s the point of this thread? We already have threads for Messi and Messi v Ronaldo. Whats next, a thread about who’s the best out of Messi, John Fashanu and Ian Ormondroyd?! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 13 minutes ago, villa4europe said: That theory only ever seems to be applied moving forwards though... Like no modern footballer could be great in the 60s/70s/80s which is unfair, they'd adapt in a different way but still be good enough to adapt Pele, Maradona, messi would all be great players in any era I dont think the growth hormones Messi took would have been around in other eras 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 Messi? Don't you mean 'Pessi' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhan_Zhuang Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 1 hour ago, Jonesy7211 said: Earlier in the thread somebody mentioned that players are protected more now, but to also add to that I think players are handled better off the pitch too. I think Gazza would be in the conversation if he'd gone to Utd instead of Spurs. Best player at the 90 world cup. I think Maradona would have lasted far longer too, and his career wouldn't have ended in relative ignominy. But I voted Maradona. I think he'd be incredible in the modern game. It's a valid point... Rehabilitation, physiotherapy, sports science all would help immeasurably. I'm still Diego Armando Maradona, when I read his book El Diego he discusses the excruciating pain he was often in before, during and after matches. Made to play, just got on with it... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mic09 Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 It's great how drugs, mafia connections, disregard for professionalism, a handball cheat can be brought into conversation when it's about Maradona, but walking off crying or doing dodgy interviews cross Ronaldo off the list. I think that if Maradona played today, he would be the most hated person on VT. I am not saying Ronaldo is the greatest, but in my opinion off the field behaviour should be taken into consideration when we decide who the greatest of all time is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 39 minutes ago, Mic09 said: It's great how drugs, mafia connections, disregard for professionalism, a handball cheat can be brought into conversation when it's about Maradona, but walking off crying or doing dodgy interviews cross Ronaldo off the list. I think that if Maradona played today, he would be the most hated person on VT. I am not saying Ronaldo is the greatest, but in my opinion off the field behaviour should be taken into consideration when we decide who the greatest of all time is. Does that include rape? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhan_Zhuang Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 48 minutes ago, Mic09 said: It's great how drugs, mafia connections, disregard for professionalism, a handball cheat can be brought into conversation when it's about Maradona, but walking off crying or doing dodgy interviews cross Ronaldo off the list. I think that if Maradona played today, he would be the most hated person on VT. I am not saying Ronaldo is the greatest, but in my opinion off the field behaviour should be taken into consideration when we decide who the greatest of all time is. If you know the story about Maradona it could be understood that the Mafia in Napoli involved him in their world and got him addicted in the first place as a ploy to keep him connected with them and dependent. After he died it was found that Maradona was literally supporting hundreds of people and families from his country. I think he was a good man who became a victim of his success and everybody wanted a piece of him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinebro Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 Messi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tegis Posted December 15, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted December 15, 2022 One telling thing is that there are actually alternatives to Messi during his days. For Pele and Maradona during their heyday it was them.....................MASSIVE GAP..........................ANOTHER MASSIVE GAP..............................A bunch of great players 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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