Generic Virus Thread

[Seat68]

3 hours ago, villa89 said:

Nah, diabolical laboratory standards in a country known for such things is the most likely outbreak of the next pandemic same as this one. It's not a conspiracy theory that the virus leaked from the Wuhan coronavirus research laboratory. Even the largely useless  WHO condemned the standard research practices there prior to the pandemic. The wet market origin story is either a cover or just where the lab workers went for assorted animal meat soup for lunch and spread their infection around. 

The world won't learn and whether it's china or some other nation dabbling with things that aren't safe that's the most likely cause of the next one IMO.

2 years later we are back here. Are we really back here. Put the effort in and read this thread. 

[LondonLax]

3 hours ago, villa89 said:

Nah, diabolical laboratory standards in a country known for such things is the most likely outbreak of the next pandemic same as this one. It's not a conspiracy theory that the virus leaked from the Wuhan coronavirus research laboratory. Even the largely useless  WHO condemned the standard research practices there prior to the pandemic. The wet market origin story is either a cover or just where the lab workers went for assorted animal meat soup for lunch and spread their infection around. 

The world won't learn and whether it's china or some other nation dabbling with things that aren't safe that's the most likely cause of the next one IMO.

That has been debunked. The wet market origin has been confirmed.

Finding that out doesn’t exactly exonerate China, if we are going to learn anything from this it need to be that we need to regulate the sale of wild animals. 

[Danwichmann]

10 hours ago, Mr_Dogg said:

Isn't the problem that their vaccine is really not very good?

And boosters aren't being offered regularly. Most people I've spoken to haven't had one for 12 months or more, so basically no protection. 

My WeChat time line is full of sheep (sheep and positive are the same sound in Mandarin) and pictures of thermometers showing temperatures. It's still almost impossible to buy paracetamol, so they're just going to have to suck it up for a while. 

[blandy]

6 hours ago, limpid said:

China was a fault for slow and incomplete reporting, not much else.

That’s generous. They’d banned internal travel while still permitting external air travel, thus seeding it abroad. It’s far from certain whether the origin is inter species transfer, or laboratory, but either way the authorities have not been cooperative. I could go on about the pressure exerted on the WHO, their lockdown policies etc.

[blandy]

1 hour ago, Seat68 said:

2 years later we are back here. Are we really back here. Put the effort in and read this thread. 

That’s unfair. It’s far from settled.

[LondonLax]

6 hours ago, blandy said:

That’s unfair. It’s far from settled.

It does seem pretty settled from the point of view of virologists. 
 

Quote

The research has been led by University of Arizona virus evolution expert Michael Worobey.

Worobey, along with international teams of researchers, traced COVID-19 back to the market where foxes, raccoon dogs and other live mammals susceptible to the virus were sold live immediately before the pandemic began.

These findings have since gone through peer review and include additional analyses and conclusions and virtually all other possible scenarios have been eliminated.

https://www.openaccessgovernment.org/covid-19-originated-at-wuhan-wet-market-via-raccoon-dogs-and-foxes/140578/
 

Quote

“Rigorously combining all available evidence surrounding the emergence of SARS-CoV-2 clearly demonstrates that the virus jumped at least twice from animals to humans at the Huanan market,” said Dr. Marc Suchard, a UCLA Fielding School of Public Health professor of biostatistics. “Identifying multiple transmission events finally puts to rest a single origin from elsewhere.”

https://newsroom.ucla.edu/releases/covid-tied-to-wildlife-sales-at-wuhan-market

[blandy]

2 hours ago, LondonLax said:

It does seem pretty settled from the point of view of virologists. 

There are, and I accept that it's the internet and therefore...., but there are credible (or as credible as any other articles and reports) articles pointing to a Lab outbreak being the source, or as likely to have been the source as the alternative theory that it was a wet market bat, or pangolin.

Quote

And there is growing consensus among experts that the laboratory leak should be looked at more closely.

Even the WHO's own director-general, Dr Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus, has called for a new investigation, saying: "All hypotheses remain open and require further study."

And Dr Fauci now says he's "not convinced" the virus originated naturally. That's a shift from a year ago, when he thought it most likely Covid had spread from animals to humans.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-57268111

there are plenty of credible and less credible articles available espousing various theories. I'm not saying one way or the other, but it's not something I would feel is a settled argument at all, either way. When you have a mix of essentially paranoid national secrecy, an investigation into historical activity, to which access is limited and evidence is limited, I don't think we can say "yeah, it's all settled, it was definitely a bat" or whatever.

[LondonLax]

1 hour ago, blandy said:

There are, and I accept that it's the internet and therefore...., but there are credible (or as credible as any other articles and reports) articles pointing to a Lab outbreak being the source, or as likely to have been the source as the alternative theory that it was a wet market bat, or pangolin.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-57268111

there are plenty of credible and less credible articles available espousing various theories. I'm not saying one way or the other, but it's not something I would feel is a settled argument at all, either way. When you have a mix of essentially paranoid national secrecy, an investigation into historical activity, to which access is limited and evidence is limited, I don't think we can say "yeah, it's all settled, it was definitely a bat" or whatever.

Your quoted article was a full year before the peer reviewed studies discussed in the links from UCLA and Arizona universities

[blandy]

23 minutes ago, LondonLax said:

Your quoted article was a full year before the peer reviewed studies discussed in the links from UCLA and Arizona universities

Sure. There are more recent ones. Like I say, I'm not claiming it's one thing or another, just that it's murky and by no means settled. This recent article summarises some of the concerns

https://inews.co.uk/opinion/covid-origin-debate-now-murkier-than-ever-2035901

Quote

It is three years since a strange new disease began felling people in a city in central China, sparking the pandemic that has killed possibly 15 million people while causing immense collateral damage.

There is still no clarity about whether this disaster was caused by human error, some kind of research mishap, or spilled over from nature. Yet there seems minimal official interest in determining Covid’s origins – let alone in confronting China over its refusal to share data that might help solve this medical mystery – although this hampers our ability to guard against a similar catastrophe.

From the start, the world was failed by the World Health Organisation. This UN body – run by a former minister in a repressive Ethiopian regime elected with Beijing’s help – praised China for “protecting the people of the world” despite the dictatorship silencing whistleblowers, declining to share data and delaying to warn about human transmission.

The organisation was slow to declare a public health emergency. It kowtowed to China with its ludicrous probe of the origins. And even its retiring chief scientist admits they were sluggish to warn of aerosol transmission, a delay that possibly cost many lives.

There are few signs of contrition. Its dismal director-general was handed a second five-year term without opposition. Now the body has appointed Sir Jeremy Farrar, director of the Wellcome Trust research funding behemoth, as next chief scientist. This is a scandalous decision given his central role in trying to seemingly stifle suggestions that Sars-CoV-2 – the coronavirus strain that causes Covid – might not be a natural disease.

Science relies on openness. Yet the more that has emerged in emails, freedom of information requests, leaks and books exposing Farrar’s actions, the less confidence we can have in him holding a world-leading scientific role for all his undoubted expertise and political skills.....

Or have a look at Alina Chan's twitter threads. Again, I'm not claiming this or that, just it's not at all "case closed".

[foreveryoung]

One shits for sure, this virus was here at least 6 months before people in the UK were talking about it. My pal at work who does triathlons, super fit,  never known him I'll, was nearly admitted to hospital with breathing problems, diagnosed by his doctor as heavy flu. To this day he said he has never experienced illness like it, that was March. I may have caught it off him at that time, flu I just couldn't get rid of for like 3-4 weeks.

[Genie]

Quite a few people are currently struggling with a nasty flu like virus that hangs around for weeks. Anyone on here had it?

One thing that occurred to me earlier than the 3 or 4 people I know who have had it recently are all unvaccinated for Covid, could there be some protection from the covid jabs? Could also just be coincidence of course.

[ml1dch]

5 minutes ago, foreveryoung said:

One shits for sure, this virus was here at least 6 months before people in the UK were talking about it. My pal at work who does triathlons, super fit,  never known him I'll, was nearly admitted to hospital with breathing problems, diagnosed by his doctor as heavy flu. To this day he said he has never experienced illness like it, that was March. I may have caught it off him at that time, flu I just couldn't get rid of for like 3-4 weeks.

Were you only talking about it in September, five and a half months after the first lockdown then?

It was pretty big news in March 2020.

[Nicho]

2 minutes ago, Genie said:

Quite a few people are currently struggling with a nasty flu like virus that hangs around for weeks. Anyone on here had it?

One thing that occurred to me earlier than the 3 or 4 people I know who have had it recently are all unvaccinated for Covid, could there be some protection from the covid jabs? Could also just be coincidence of course.

Yes I and many of my friends have been I’ll for weeks, with it coming and going.

Couple positive for covid after a night in brum at the weekend aswell. All vaccinated to my knowledge.

Id prefer the theory it is just flu we havnt managed to catch for a few years but as we arnt testing as throughly worldwide we will surely miss new strains of covid until we visible notice it.

[Genie]

5 minutes ago, ml1dch said:

Were you only talking about it in September, five and a half months after the first lockdown then?

It was pretty big news in March 2020.

I went to America in February 2020 and there were requests at the airport of “if you’ve recently been to China please let us know”.

[Tayls]

18 minutes ago, foreveryoung said:

One shits for sure, this virus was here at least 6 months before people in the UK were talking about it. My pal at work who does triathlons, super fit,  never known him I'll, was nearly admitted to hospital with breathing problems, diagnosed by his doctor as heavy flu. To this day he said he has never experienced illness like it, that was March. I may have caught it off him at that time, flu I just couldn't get rid of for like 3-4 weeks.

I think it was here way before the March as well, without us really knowing anything about it. Wonder what the death toll for regular flu was during the November/December/January leading up to the February when people really started taking it seriously. We still held off until March to take action. 

Edited December 23, 2022 by Tayls

[sidcow]

26 minutes ago, Genie said:

Quite a few people are currently struggling with a nasty flu like virus that hangs around for weeks. Anyone on here had it?

One thing that occurred to me earlier than the 3 or 4 people I know who have had it recently are all unvaccinated for Covid, could there be some protection from the covid jabs? Could also just be coincidence of course.

I was pretty ill 2 weeks ago and still coughing from it. 

[Genie]

5 minutes ago, sidcow said:

I was pretty ill 2 weeks ago and still coughing from it. 

My daughter still has a cough a few weeks on

[nick76]

12 hours ago, Genie said:

My daughter still has a cough a few weeks on

My mom, 4 time jab vaccinated, negative for Covid was really ill early last week.  That illness has gone but the cough is still as aggressive now as it was during the illness period 10 or more days ago.

[Genie]

53 minutes ago, nick76 said:

My mom, 4 time jab vaccinated, negative for Covid was really ill early last week.  That illness has gone but the cough is still as aggressive now as it was during the illness period 10 or more days ago.

Must have just been coincidence based on small sample size then.

However, it’s a nasty bug for sure. 

[sidcow]

1 hour ago, nick76 said:

My mom, 4 time jab vaccinated, negative for Covid was really ill early last week.  That illness has gone but the cough is still as aggressive now as it was during the illness period 10 or more days ago.

Yes, that's me.