Jacob Ramsey

[Risso]

He's very promising and it's nice to be able to introduce him gradually rather than chucking him in at the deep end as has happened with youngsters in the past.

[lapal_fan]

4 minutes ago, Risso said:

He's very promising and it's nice to be able to introduce him gradually rather than chucking him in at the deep end as has happened with youngsters in the past.

I think that's a key point.

Our youngsters of yesteryear have struggled when we've been struggling and the pressure is on to get points, with a hostile crowd.

Oddly though, I always felt Delphonso should have gone on loan, even though he made cameo's in our first team.. never happened though he obviously suffered because of it.

Hopefully Ramsey keeps getting minutes, but maybe month or half season loan where he'd start and play a few games back to back wouldn't harm his progress?

[mikeyp102]

Looked decent, would have been a great goal. 
Whilst I’d agree it’s great that he is getting some game time. I’d also say a loan could be beneficial. If you think we have Barkley and Trez coming back in to the match day squads, Ramsey may find game time limited. Even a month loan with regular starts would develop him.

[VillaChris]

Don't think he'll go out on loan while it stays 9 subs.

Key here now is the trust being shown in him. Was trusted to start at Wolves ahead of likes of Hourihane and Nakamba. And was the one trusted to come on for last 15 minutes to close out a 1-1 against very good team. That will be huge confidence boost to show how much DS and the rest rate him.

Looked good again, very close to scoring.

I actually think key with young players is they avoid a serious injury at 17-21 in their development years. People laugh about Gary Gardner now but a decade ago he was rated on level Jacob is now if not more. Two ACLs by age of 22 and he had no chance of making it at top level although we still keep him around here until his mid 20s.

Edited December 29, 2020 by VillaChris

[Guest av1]

11 minutes ago, VillaChris said:

 

I actually think key with young players is they avoid a serious injury at 17-21 in their development years. People laugh about Gary Gardner now but a decade ago he was rated on level Jacob is now if not more. Two ACLs by age of 22 and he had no chance of making it at top level although we still keep him around here until his mid 20s.

If memory serves wasn't Gardner the stand out player in a England youth tournament next to Wiltshire?

[Vive_La_Villa]

20 minutes ago, mikeyp102 said:

Looked decent, would have been a great goal. 
Whilst I’d agree it’s great that he is getting some game time. I’d also say a loan could be beneficial. If you think we have Barkley and Trez coming back in to the match day squads, Ramsey may find game time limited. Even a month loan with regular starts would develop him.

Nah I think he plays his part. Need 2 players in every position and I can’t see Hourihane featuring again. Also whilst Jack has been great in the middle I still prefer him out wide. 
 

 

[Johnnyp]

28 minutes ago, mikeyp102 said:

Looked decent, would have been a great goal. 
Whilst I’d agree it’s great that he is getting some game time. I’d also say a loan could be beneficial. If you think we have Barkley and Trez coming back in to the match day squads, Ramsey may find game time limited. Even a month loan with regular starts would develop him.

What's the fascination with Ramsey going out on loan ? I mean, jesus. This kid has earned his place in the squad. He's for the future, he's also for the now. What's to say Barkley picks up another knock ? Or McGinn, Luiz. We've been crying out since Jack came through for more young players to make the breakthrough. Look at Dortmund with Bellingham. They aren't afraid to have him in the 1st team squad. Need to get out of the locked in and rigid mindset that young players must go out on loan. No. Not a very talented one. He doesn't.

Edited December 29, 2020 by Johnnyp

[villa4europe]

24 minutes ago, Johnnyp said:

What's the fascination with Ramsey going out on loan ? I mean, jesus. This kid has earned his place in the squad. He's for the future, he's also for the now. What's to say Barkley picks up another knock ? Or McGinn, Luiz. We've been crying out since Jack came through for more young players to make the breakthrough. Look at Dortmund with Bellingham. They aren't afraid to have him in the 1st team squad. Need to get out of the locked in and rigid mindset that young players must go out on loan. No. Not a very talented one. He doesn't.

So he can play with men and toughen up

Its bollocks

[Gompedyret]

Of course he'd benefit going out on loan, obviously with a team meeting qualified opposition and preferably playing in a way comparable to us. The key is getting as much competitive playing time as possible, as nothing can quite match that. Jacob being talented is just a plus, as it would mean bigger chance that he gets playing time even in a rather good team.

Some progressive team in the upper half of the championship would be ideal, half a year there after we strengthen in the January window sounds good to me. He will come back in the summer, stronger, hungrier and more mature, ready to make some serious impact.

[Johnnyp]

Just now, villa4europe said:

So he can play with men and toughen up

Its bollocks

Exactly. He'll end up playing on some mud baths, regressing as a player and picking up bad habits. No to that.

[bannedfromHandV]

40 minutes ago, av1 said:

If memory serves wasn't Gardner the stand out player in a England youth tournament next to Wiltshire?

Gloucestershire?

[TRO]

He will develop his strength in time, I like the balance of the kid and his nose for goal.

Keep him in and around us, introduce him, in cameo's, get him used to the set up......Its very early days, but I like what I see.

He looks like a footballer.

[Johnnyp]

1 minute ago, Gompedyret said:

Of course he'd benefit going out on loan, obviously with a team meeting qualified opposition and preferably playing in a way comparable to us. The key is getting as much competitive playing time as possible, as nothing can quite match that. Jacob being talented is just a plus, as it would mean bigger chance that he gets playing time even in a rather good team.

Some progressive team in the upper half of the championship would be ideal, half a year there after we strengthen in the January window sounds good to me. He will come back in the summer, stronger, hungrier and more mature, ready to make some serious impact.

Again, this fear. This theory that youth must be loaned out. It's an unwritten rule almost. I'd go out on a limb and say Ramsey and Bellingham are not miles apart as talent right now. Be realistic though. Hourihane is out of favour and he's hit his ceiling at this level. Is Nakamba going to massively improve us or get better ? Hardly. So unless we bring what another or maybe 2 centre midfielders in , in January, he's going nowhere. Given how close and in amongst it he is. If anything id say this. When Barkley comes back in and one drops out of the match day squad, it's Hourihane or Nakamba who are in trouble more than Jacob.

[TRO]

58 minutes ago, VillaChris said:

Don't think he'll go out on loan while it stays 9 subs.

Key here now is the trust being shown in him. Was trusted to start at Wolves ahead of likes of Hourihane and Nakamba. And was the one trusted to come on for last 15 minutes to close out a 1-1 against very good team. That will be huge confidence boost to show how much DS and the rest rate him.

Looked good again, very close to scoring.

I actually think key with young players is they avoid a serious injury at 17-21 in their development years. People laugh about Gary Gardner now but a decade ago he was rated on level Jacob is now if not more. Two ACLs by age of 22 and he had no chance of making it at top level although we still keep him around here until his mid 20s.

ditto.

[Guest av1]

8 minutes ago, bannedfromHandV said:

Gloucestershire?

I knew I'd got that wrong but was too lazy to Google the spelling.

I hoped it would be missed... Bast##d 

Edited December 29, 2020 by av1

[villa4europe]

1 minute ago, Johnnyp said:

Again, this fear. This theory that youth must be loaned out. It's an unwritten rule almost. I'd go out on a limb and say Ramsey and Bellingham are not miles apart as talent right now. Be realistic though. Hourihane is out of favour and he's hit his ceiling at this level. Is Nakamba going to massively improve us or get better ? Hardly. So unless we bring what another or maybe 2 centre midfielders in , in January, he's going nowhere. Given how close and in amongst it he is. If anything id say this. When Barkley comes back in and one drops out of the match day squad, it's Hourihane or Nakamba who are in trouble more than Jacob.

I think the coaches have to put faith in themselves in the same way that the likes of pep and klopp do, how many of their young kids do they have loaned out? It's only one or two from a large talent pool, foden for example didn't need to go and find regular football in order to develop

And that's because he will learn far more every day training with the coaches and being in and around the stars of the first team than he will do from playing 90 mins for reading once a week

Stick Ramsey with Ross Barkley and Grealish on a daily basis with Smith, Shakespeare and Terry drilling him and get him to be the player that we want him to be 

It'll come on the training ground, I'm not worried about it and if villa internally aren't either then I'm not sure why we question what people who are qualified to do this thing think, we have a good set up let them do their jobs 

[useless]

I think in a normal season he would have already gone out on loan in the summer transfer window as getting regular game time at championship level would have been seen as more beneficial to his development than getting the odd five or ten minutes every four or five games with us. Main reason he's been kept around is probably Covid, we could lose a bunch of players at any moment, so need as many available as possible.

And a young player going out on loan isn't a reflection on their ability, or mean that they're not good enough to do a job for us if called upon, just means that getting regular game time is seen as the better option for their overall development.

if he was to go on loan to a championship side, it wouldn't be a bad thing, not sure where people are getting this idea that he'd go to the lower leagues to play on mud baths, if you think that he's good enough for us then it follows that he's good enough get a decent loan at championshp level, and because he's older and already has experience playing professional football it wouldn't be about playing with 'real men', it would be about giving him regular game time something that every player needs.

That said I think he'll stay with us now, and as long as he's getting game time then that will of course do him good as well, and important for our other academy players to see him being given a chance.

[Guest av1]

6 minutes ago, TRO said:

He will develop his strength in time, I like the balance of the kid and his nose for goal.

Keep him in and around us, introduce him, in cameo's, get him used to the set up......Its very early days, but I like what I see.

He looks like a footballer.

Agreed. He doesn't look nervous either, which I think says a lot about the character of young guys trying to break into the senior team. 

[TRO]

4 minutes ago, villa4europe said:

I think the coaches have to put faith in themselves in the same way that the likes of pep and klopp do, how many of their young kids do they have loaned out? It's only one or two from a large talent pool, foden for example didn't need to go and find regular football in order to develop

And that's because he will learn far more every day training with the coaches and being in and around the stars of the first team than he will do from playing 90 mins for reading once a week

Stick Ramsey with Ross Barkley and Grealish on a daily basis with Smith, Shakespeare and Terry drilling him and get him to be the player that we want him to be 

It'll come on the training ground, I'm not worried about it and if villa internally aren't either then I'm not sure why we question what people who are qualified to do this thing think, we have a good set up let them do their jobs 

well said.

[TRO]

I see the benefit of loaning players out and Jacob has already done that, like Jack did.

but like playing in the under23's, Loans can go on for too long.

Jacob has a real opportunity now, because we are not fighting relegation and he can develop in a good team......He is close to being ready.

He has come on albeit for cameo's against Wolves and Chelsea away from home and not looked out of place.....his time is close, and he needs to be with us, with the spirit and camaraderie and banter.

go get 'em son.

Edited December 29, 2020 by TRO