Dean Smith

[Zatman]

Ward Prowse is probably the best dead ball player in the league, my issue with yesterday was the dead balls we wasted

Barkley and Jack should be on the training ground practicing

[BleedClaretAndBlue]

3 games out of 6 we have scored 3 or more goals :: We managed this one time last season (Norwich 1-5)

3 games out of 6 with a clean sheet

Back to back wins was achieved once last season. 4 in a row is a big leap on that front. 
 

Beating the “top” sides is happening more frequently. Arsenal, Liverpool and Leicester can be considered scalps. Also 8 game unbeaten PL run is something we havent managed since I think the start of McLeish tenure.

Small sample sizes i know and strange times and circumstances with covid, but just a few signs of gradual improvement. We dont expect to win every game, poor results will happen, but as long as we keep seeing signs of progression, which I think is fair to say we have done season-on-season with Smith, then we should be pretty content. Just as much chance of a result next week as there is a poor performance. Im pleased with how things are going on the whole. We are searching for consistency, but who isnt thesedays?

 

[PaulC]

42 minutes ago, Zatman said:

Ward Prowse is probably the best dead ball player in the league, my issue with yesterday was the dead balls we wasted

Barkley and Jack should be on the training ground practicing

Maybe they do and Ward Prowse has a special talent at it. Its more about not conceding freekicks in dangerous areas when they have someone as good as that for me. Did Luiz need to make that foul and did Cash need to handle that ball. Brain freezes costs games. 

[beachboys1]

id like to see smith do something left field watkins wide mings center forward thats a serious suggestion i think mings could cause havonc up front  after yesterday scoring one and another terrific header

[M_Afro]

19 minutes ago, beachboys1 said:

id like to see smith do something left field watkins wide mings center forward thats a serious suggestion i think mings could cause havonc up front  after yesterday scoring one and another terrific header

Steve.......is that you?

[Keyblade]

I hate how black and white things sometimes are with our fans. 8 games unbeaten either side of the summer break, everything is amazing. Lose 2 in a row though and suddenly everything is shit again, we're relegation fodder etc. This is how I know people haven't been keeping up with the PL since we've been down. Midtable sides are typically wildly inconsistent. Look at Everton as a good example. They'd win 2 or 3, then lose the next 2 or 3. Rinse repeat. Ultimately end up finishing 7th-12th. If you offered that at the start of the season, who wouldn't take that? We likely aren't getting relegated and we likely aren't going to finish in European places, which for us is a big improvement already. Let's just be patient and see how this all plays out before jumping to conclusions.

[YouUnastanFren]

2 hours ago, beachboys1 said:

id like to see smith do something left field watkins wide mings center forward thats a serious suggestion i think mings could cause havonc up front  after yesterday scoring one and another terrific header

 

Edited November 2, 2020 by YouUnastanFren

[TRO]

10 hours ago, VillaCas said:

This is what mid-table feels like - ups and downs, losing as many as you are winning.

We don’t yet have options, we don’t yet have a deep bench. If a few of our established players are off form we will struggle.

A lot is made of ‘fitness and physicality’ - for me this is a red herring. When we play well it’s not an issue but when we lose it’s trotted out as a key factor. In reality our fitness is on a par with the clubs around us we just don’t have sufficient quality players to cycle through

It’s still early days and the table will take a while yet to settle down - if after 15 or so games we are mid-table that will be fine, if we are in the dog fight at the bottom we should then be asking questions

I think you are wrong and I will give you my reasoning and it surrounds the distinction of playing with the ball and without the ball.

In the first 4 games we was afforded time on the ball, our opponents allowed us to play, for varying reasons, Sheff Utd and Liverpool have not started the season with their energetic presssing for reasons that belong to them, Fulham equally stood off us and we have players who can hurt teams who do that.....Leicester was a damn good result, but had Vardy played, I don't think we could of contained his pace and intelligence, his effervescence unhinges us.....we don't like players in our faces.

When we played Leeds and Southampton they play a high energy game, their measured aggression is allied to a pressing game where teams have to be a "at it" to compete......they give you no oxygen to breath, and we do not have the personnel with an appetite to negate it.... we are an offensive side who like to have the space to play.....those 2 teams, won't let you have the time or space.

This game was nothing new in the last 2 seasons, we have seen games against these teams that have rendered similar dynamics and subsequently, similar results.

It might be worth noting roughly 12 months ago Southampton were being Pummelled 0-9 by Leicester.....since then they have beaten us 3 times handsomely, 9-4 on aggregate....with a team that still had 8 players playing from that debacle. It is quite noticeable that they have tightened up their game and they get about teams and block any inspiration that their opponent tries to muster.....they were well out the traps and testing our defence right from the off, all but a block from Mings, Ings was in. These blocks are too late, the play should have been picked up with gusto and conviction, we stood off once again.

I also disagree with your opening line, this is not what midtable feels like, this is what relegation feels like, thats what that first half mirrored and the second half against Leeds.3-0 down at home and 4-0 down at home, being dominated is not mid table football ( don't confuse that comment with where i think we will finish, I am talking about that specific game)

Some how we have to get back to being hard to beat, like we did after lockdown and in the first 4 games......but watching the last 2 games was so reminiscent of pre lockdown last season

We have to find a way of being much more effective, without the ball as with it.

Fitness and Physicality is huge part of the game, always was, always will be......embrace it.

ps They knew what to expect in both games,Dean said as much......we just couldn't compete, when it mattered.

 

 

 

Edited November 2, 2020 by TRO

[TRO]

5 hours ago, PaulC said:

I honestly don't blame the manager for this defeat. 

If he gets the praise i.e the first 4 games....he has to carry the can.

but getting rid, is too stupid for words, so that is right off the agenda.

He has to sit down and analyse where it went Wrong....I think MaVilla, hits the nails squarley on the head in his comments on the Ollie Watkins page.

We need to sign the personnel in this Jan Window, to help us with scenarios like the last 2 games.

I can't comment on the fitness, because I am not aware of the intensity of the training or lack of it......but in the last 2 games the opposition, looked better prepared to me....and showed more of a willingness to run.

I think we looked very slow and lethargic, leggy, in the last 2 games.

[TRO]

4 hours ago, PaulC said:

Maybe they do and Ward Prowse has a special talent at it. Its more about not conceding freekicks in dangerous areas when they have someone as good as that for me. Did Luiz need to make that foul and did Cash need to handle that ball. Brain freezes costs games. 

sadly, that half baked tackle of Luiz's was not the first time....in the box he is a penalty waiting to happen, his tackling is not sharp and concise with good positional play, its lethargic, reluctant and just throws his body at it, moodily....not good enough, right now in that role.

He looks like another one, who just wants to get ON the ball and play......not OFF the ball and marshall......I don't think he is happy playing that role.

[TRO]

4 hours ago, beachboys1 said:

id like to see smith do something left field watkins wide mings center forward thats a serious suggestion i think mings could cause havonc up front  after yesterday scoring one and another terrific header

you have just tickled me....it reminds me of the "haribo ad" with the 2 policemen in the car.....sorry.

[PaulC]

2 minutes ago, TRO said:

sadly, that half baked tackle of Luiz's was not the first time....in the box he is a penalty waiting to happen, his tackling is not sharp and concise with good positional play, its lethargic, reluctant and just throws his body at it, moodily....not good enough, right now in that role.

He looks like another one, who just wants to get ON the ball and play......not OFF the ball and marshall......I don't think he is happy playing that role.

Yes I agree. We need a hard man in dm. We cant fit Luiz, Barkley and MCginn in if he doesn't play that role though unless we change to a diamond formation  and drop Trez

[MrBlack]

39 minutes ago, PaulC said:

Yes I agree. We need a hard man in dm. We cant fit Luiz, Barkley and MCginn in if he doesn't play that role though unless we change to a diamond formation  and drop Trez

Move Luiz to where Barkley plays,  rotate them based on who is having an off day (if they both are then tough shit).

Bring in a proper DM that is better than Nakamba, and we'll have a great midfield.

The current first 11 is great when we're on the front foot. Shocking when we're not. Conor would make that statement even more true so doesn't help us. We really do lack any kind of player that can change a game in our favour from when plan A isn't working. Changing style has helped to a degree so far, but when the players themselves are having an off day we are screwed.

Way better position than we were in last year at least, but we need a DM desperately in Jan. 

[beachboys1]

1 hour ago, TRO said:

you have just tickled me....it reminds me of the "haribo ad" with the 2 policemen in the car.....sorry.

no offence took i omly said let watkins get confidence on wing and davis no faith in

[Guest av1]

Just had this Facebook memory pop up. 

 

This time last year Villa beat Bolton 2-0 after losing away to QPR the previous week. 

Today we a feel gutted to have conceded a last minute winner to Liverpool. When you consider what Dean Smith has achieved in the last 12 months it's pretty remarkable really..

In the last 30 or so years of going down the Villa, there aren't to many occasions I've left VP with a smile on my face after a loss, today was one. I'm so proud of what Dean Smith has created at VP.

 

The sentiment still stands. Gutted about the last 2 defeats but I still maintain that he he doing a remarkable job. 

 

[briny_ear]

2 hours ago, TRO said:

If he gets the praise i.e the first 4 games....he has to carry the can.

but getting rid, is too stupid for words, so that is right off the agenda.

He has to sit down and analyse where it went Wrong....I think MaVilla, hits the nails squarley on the head in his comments on the Ollie Watkins page.

We need to sign the personnel in this Jan Window, to help us with scenarios like the last 2 games.

I can't comment on the fitness, because I am not aware of the intensity of the training or lack of it......but in the last 2 games the opposition, looked better prepared to me....and showed more of a willingness to run.

I think we looked very slow and lethargic, leggy, in the last 2 games.

I’m not personally convinced we will be able to get the stature of midfielder we need in the January window. May manage a marginal improvement but it wold be sensible to work on the basis that we have to make better use of what we have got.

Basically we gave Southampton far too much space in midfield and paid the penalty. We showed in the post lockdown phase and in the first couple of matches this season that we can play much tighter and that is what we need to get back to. I think the 7-2 may have gone to everyone’s heads, including the manager.

[VillanousOne]

From what many have said, the current tactics and line up work against teams that don't press us as hard, that give us space to play and time.

But teams that press higher up and close us down quicker, we need a more defensive holding midfielder to replace either McGinn or Barkley, we only have Nakamba who comes anywhere near close to being able to play that role. Or play McGinn much deeper.

Edited November 2, 2020 by VillanousOne

[Tomaszk]

12 hours ago, Delphinho123 said:

The balance in the midfield isn't right. To be honest, it's something Smith has struggled with since he's been here. It's like he doesn't know whether to stick or twist and in what games to do what. 
We had it in the season in the championship with the Whelan/Hourihane/Grealish situation and we're seeing it again now. 

We are too easy to play against in midfield, it's that simple. The times we have played well this season, McGinn has been outstanding, but when he isn't playing well, we don't have enough protection for the back 4. We're playing this 4-3-3 formation where both McGinn and Barkley are given license to get forward but in doing so, we're so open to being hit on the break. Teams are walking through us. 

We have the following central midfielders:
McGinn
Luiz
Nakamba
Barkley
Ramsey
Hourihane

The three highlighted in bold are the best 3 players, no doubt, but are they the best fit for winning football matches? I'm not sure. If you're asking your fullbacks to get forward and provide an overlap, if you lose the ball, you're essentially in a position where you could have Mings, Konsa and Luiz defending against 3 or four attackers. It happens a lot, especially at Villa Park. If you're insistent on playing this front 3 system of Grealish, Watkins, Trezeguet with Barkley in behind and fullbacks overlapping, I'm afraid you need two defensive midfielders in there to cover for them when we lose the ball. Luiz (who I think is slightly overrated), is decent enough but he can't resist attacks on his own without McGinn or Barkley helping. 

In the summer I would have much preferred to bring in a big, strong defensive midfielder to play alongside Luiz, allowing McGinn to get forward to play the role Barkley is now. As good of a signing Barkley was, and I do think he is a good player, I'm not sure that's the type of player we need in our current situation. 

Smith, who is notoriosuly stubborn, needs to seriously look at the balance in the middle of the pitch otherwise we will continue to concede lots of goals at home. Has he got the balls to drop Barkley? Has he got the balls to drop McGinn and play Ramsey? Like I say, sometims your best XI isn't always your best 11 players. We don't have much squad depth, but we need to figure out a way of playing with what we have. Why not try McGinn on the right of a front 3? I know, crazy right? But he has enough quality and energy to play that position and it allows us to bring in a more defensively minded player. A front 4 of McGinn, Barkley, Grealish and Watkins is fine and allows us to play two midfielders who's job it is to defend. 

Unless he changes things, we will continue to struggle in midfield and lose football matches.

Balance isn't working I agree. However, I think player underperformance, especially Barkley, as opposed to much else is to blame the last two games though. Balance wasn't right in Sheff U, Fulham or Leicester either.

Very tough to press as a 4231, that's why many of the top pressing sides play 433. Liverpool, City, Barca, Real, PSG. Other teams are trying different things but that's a solid shape for a top side trying to dominate. Smith is trying to do it.

If we play 4231, we'll be standing off teams more and I don't think he likes it. Doesn't see not dominating as a good way of trying to win games. Makes sense.

I'd love to see McGinn charge around on the right of a front three. Absolutely zero doubt he'd be better than Trez or Traore. Zero.

I'd be interested in starting Ramsey over Barkley at Arsenal. Get some real legs in there, not sure what's been up with Barkley last two games.

There is so few decent options in terms of personnel. Smith has attracted more criticism than is fair after four wins to kick off. He's gone and broken people's expectations again. Needs to stop doing that.

[romavillan]

People went over the top in reaction to us winnign 4 on the bounce, there is an over the top reaction to losing two on the bounce now. 

Simple fact is when Smith took over we were 15th or so in the Championship, had we beat Southampton we would have gone top of the league. After the over the top reactions to winning the first 4 some people are overly gutted we aren't winning every week in style. Not for the first time Smith has made a rod for his own back by having an unexpected spell of success, too much too soon again. Arguably we came up a year before we were planning on doing so, and we almost certainly over achieved with our start to the season. Criticism is fine, but there were actually people calling for him to be sacked after the saints game. Those doing that should have a little think what bottom half Championship felt like. 

We look good to improve on last season, 10 points more than last season for me is solid improvement and I don't see why we can't do that. Then next season we can compete on wages with the top half clubs, THEN if we get the recruitment right there will rightly be pressure on Smith to get a result more weeks than not. There really shouldn't be at the moment, we all know the squad is thin, three or four of our first choice eleven have a a bad game and we don't have the bench to be able to sort that out. 

Patience. UTV.  

[Tomaszk]

According to raw numbers, how we compare to other sides this season.

Be good to see it first four v last two. Or maybe in games we win v games we don't win in a few weeks time. Does feel like we're swinging to opposite ends of the performance spectrum without hanging round in the middle too much.