Keinan Davis

[TRO]

17 minutes ago, WHY said:

It amazes me how many fans are willing to sell this lad but want Archer in the team. I would hazard a guess his minutes to goals are on a par with what Archers are at Preston, if not better. He also has more assists and has a better all round game imo. He has been the catalyst for the run Forest are on. He also suits what Gerrard wants in a striker more. I’m not knocking Archer btw as I think he has the tools to develop into a good striker. Hopefully we get them both back in the summer and we have a good look at them in preseason. 

I am a big advocate of Variety in a squad....He is a a different type.

I get the arguments of the past, his inablity to score or his injury record......but he could do a job like Ivan Toney or Jean Pierre Mateta...if he keeps up this form and fitness.

I just think him being injury free, and scoring is a real plus.....we know how hard it is to score in the championship.

Unless a sizable offer comes in, I would keep him..... we know how hard it is to buy players, even pigs in pokes.

 

Edited April 10, 2022 by TRO

[Zatman]

7 minutes ago, sidcow said:

Totally agree. They could actually be the perfect partnership in all honesty. 

Didn't they partner in one of the lower league cup games I forget the name, its not Johnstone Paint still. Think Archer got a couple that game

[Davkaus]

2 minutes ago, TRO said:

I am a big advocate of Variety in a squad....He is a a different type.

I get the arguments of the past, his inablity to score or his injury record......but he could do a job like Ivan Toney or Jean Pierre Mateta...if he keeps up this form and fitness.

I just think him being injury free, and scoring is a real plus.....we know how hard it is to score in the championship.

Unless a sizable offer comes in, I would keep him..... we know how hard it is to buy players, even pigs in pokes.

 

I wasn't a big advocate of his at all in the past, we've really needed our goals to come from the forward man, but I'd be intrigued to see him in front of Coutinho and or Buendia

[TRO]

1 minute ago, Davkaus said:

I wasn't a big advocate of his at all in the past, we've really needed our goals to come from the forward man, but I'd be intrigued to see him in front of Coutinho and or Buendia

Lets be clear here.....He wasn't playing like this with us, when we made our judgments on him.....These goals are not tap ins, they are real quality work.

Confidence is a strange phenomenon....and can change opinions....I hope he can keep this up.

sure, one swallow, doesn't make a summer and its different gravy in the Prem....but he is giving us all, something to think about.

[WHY]

11 minutes ago, duke313 said:

I think it’s because Archer is 4 years younger than Davis, and Davis has made 87 appearances for Villa already scoring only 7 goals. Archer for example has scored 4 goals For us in only 6 appearances.

I get that but it’s here and now mate. Both are performing well out on loan so why not take a look at both of them. Steve Cooper is a very good coach and plays a system where Davis is integral to how they play. Antonio’s goal record was awful until he hit his mid 20’s as well but you could see he had something. Davis might have a lot of appearances but his actual minutes on the pitch probably equate to more like 30 games. Don’t forget Davis never came through an academy system so was still very raw. You can see his all round game is improving week on week at Forest. Is this not the point of loaning players out? 

[Zatman]

6 minutes ago, Davkaus said:

I wasn't a big advocate of his at all in the past, we've really needed our goals to come from the forward man, but I'd be intrigued to see him in front of Coutinho and or Buendia

I think Bailey would be the player to profit from him 

[Laughable Chimp]

32 minutes ago, WHY said:

It amazes me how many fans are willing to sell this lad but want Archer in the team. I would hazard a guess his minutes to goals are on a par with what Archers are at Preston, if not better. He also has more assists and has a better all round game imo. He has been the catalyst for the run Forest are on. He also suits what Gerrard wants in a striker more. I’m not knocking Archer btw as I think he has the tools to develop into a good striker. Hopefully we get them both back in the summer and we have a good look at them in preseason. 

Huh, I was initially going try and refute you but you're right, they're actually quite similar.

0.46 goals per 90 for Davis compared to 0.53 goals per 90 for Archer

[The_Steve]

Davis has found is level at the Championship - Archer has a much bigger ceiling - as do Barry and Brad Young. I think they are in for more games with 5 subs next season. A decent fee for Davis is what will happen, wish him all the best. He’s not coming back. 

[duke313]

Just now, The_Steve said:

Davis has found is level at the Championship - Archer has a much bigger ceiling - as do Barry and Brad Young. I think they are in for more games with 5 subs next season. A decent fee for Davis is what will happen, wish him all the best. He’s not coming back. 

Just stick a buy back clause in on any youth we sell. Chelsea do it.

[The_Steve]

1 minute ago, duke313 said:

Just stick a buy back clause in on any youth we sell. Chelsea do it.

Yes, I agree. We need to protect these assets we sell also. I’d love to see him do well regardless. 

Edited April 10, 2022 by The_Steve

[May-Z]

2 minutes ago, The_Steve said:

Davis has found is level at the Championship - Archer has a much bigger ceiling - as do Barry and Brad Young. I think they are in for more games with 5 subs next season. A decent fee for Davis is what will happen, wish him all the best. He’s not coming back. 

Not sure about Davis having found his level. I think it's more a case of finding himself fit for a decent runs of matches and actually being on the pitch for that time instead of the bench.

You're probably right about him moving on though.

 

[The_Steve]

1 minute ago, May-Z said:

Not sure about Davis having found his level. I think it's more a case of finding himself fit for a decent runs of matches and actually being on the pitch for that time instead of the bench.

You're probably right about him moving on though.

 

He deserves chances for sure - I just don’t think he’s going to get it here. But I’m happy to be proven totally wrong about his ceiling

[sidcow]

25 minutes ago, duke313 said:

Just stick a buy back clause in on any youth we sell. Chelsea do it.

This is essentiall because I'm convinced Forest will end up selling him to a PL team in future, or get promoted themselves and he performs in the PL and get sold for an even bigger fee. 

That's exactly how I see it playing out if we sell him to them, or a similarly positioned Championship team. 

[sidcow]

People make me laugh. 

Just because he's had a few games for us (in bits and bobs in a generally underperforming team, between injury bouts) now he's settled and looking brilliant it's because he's found his level. 

Any other player (Cameron) doing the same thing is considered a nailed on PL player. 

[duke313]

7 minutes ago, sidcow said:

People make me laugh. 

Just because he's had a few games for us (in bits and bobs in a generally underperforming team, between injury bouts) now he's settled and looking brilliant it's because he's found his level. 

Any other player (Cameron) doing the same thing is considered a nailed on PL player. 

I don’t think anybody thinks Archer is a nailed on PL player, but he is 4 years young and has a much higher ceiling than Davis.

[MakemineVanilla]

Keinan scored a great yesterday on 5 minutes, and proved once again that he's predoinently left-footed.

He really enjoyed his goal and was thumping his chest in celebration.

He had the guy marking him on toast, who had to resort to kicking him to try and slow him down.

He's now scored more goals (4) for Forest than for Villa (3), and his next appearence will be his 100th in the Championship, Premier League and cups.

Edited April 10, 2022 by MakemineVanilla

[MWARLEY2]

The itonic thing is if you consider who would be the best Villa 2 up front it would be Keinan and Cameron. 

I think Keinan suffered from bad luck moments that held him back.  But also you have to consider that both Bruce and Smith saw something in him. He is a very very good all round nuisance with considerable skill and a great touch.

[nick76]

16 minutes ago, MWARLEY2 said:

The itonic thing is if you consider who would be the best Villa 2 up front it would be Keinan and Cameron. 

I think Keinan suffered from bad luck moments that held him back.  But also you have to consider that both Bruce and Smith saw something in him. He is a very very good all round nuisance with considerable skill and a great touch.

Just because they are doing well in the lower leagues doesn’t mean they are the best two.  Ollie and Danny are in very poor form but Davis isn’t PL quality, he’s found his level and doing really well. That doesn’t mean he can do that at PL level.  We know what he’s done in the past here….nothing!  Smith saw something in him, yet when this forum was shouting for him to get some time in the second half of last season Smith never did.

[Steero113]

11 minutes ago, nick76 said:

Just because they are doing well in the lower leagues doesn’t mean they are the best two.  Ollie and Danny are in very poor form but Davis isn’t PL quality, he’s found his level and doing really well. That doesn’t mean he can do that at PL level.  We know what he’s done in the past here….nothing!  Smith saw something in him, yet when this forum was shouting for him to get some time in the second half of last season Smith never did.

Tammy Abraham did next to nothing at Swansea in his early chance in the Prem at a young age. Looked ordinary. 

Surprise surprise he went to the Championship (twice) and tore it up, same as Keinan is at Forest. 

He was then given a second chance at Chelsea when he usually would not have been given one (we all know without the transfer embargo they would have brought in a shiny European striker). He came good. 

I cannot say that Davis is Prem level or not because I'm not a professional scout, neither are you. I would like to see him given a proper pre-season chance when fully fit. Something he's never ever had due to injury. He's certainly got something that neither of our current centre forwards have, strength to piss around a CB properly and bring our 10's into play. That's enough for me to want to see how he would work. 

You are entitled to your opinion, but this "he isn't PL quality" has no foundation at all because he's never been given the run to prove it.

Edited April 10, 2022 by Steero113

[WHY]

20 minutes ago, Steero113 said:

Tammy Abraham did next to nothing at Swansea in his early chance in the Prem at a young age. Looked ordinary. 

Surprise surprise he went to the Championship (twice) and tore it up, same as Keinan is at Forest. 

He was then given a second chance at Chelsea when he usually would not have been given one (we all know without the transfer embargo they would have brought in a shiny European striker). He came good. 

I cannot say that Davis is Prem level or not because I'm not a professional scout, neither are you. I would like to see him given a proper pre-season chance when fully fit. Something he's never ever had due to injury. He's certainly got something that neither of our current centre forwards have, strength to piss around a CB properly and bring our 10's into play. That's enough for me to want to see how he would work. 

You are entitled to your opinion, but this "he isn't PL quality" has no foundation at all because he's never been given the run to prove it.

I agree, we have 2 strikers out on loan who are doing well would be madness not to have them both back and give them a preseason imo. I don’t care how they have performed in the past, it’s the hear and now is what I care about. The whole point in loaning players out is to see how they get on with playing regularly. Would be pointless to dismiss it. 

Edited April 10, 2022 by WHY