Straggler Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 27 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: Great post. @Arj Guy clearly finds it hilarious though. I could have made it even funnier. Belle could have had a pregnancy that threatens her life to bring to term. The local Dr refuses to abort for fear of going to jail and she dies, both baby and mother don't make it. Jock can hold a 2 for the price of 1 funeral. Or Jocks brother visits and rapes Belle. Jock and Belle then have to raise his brothers rape baby. So many punch lines for this joke of a decision. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 Trump has been going bareback his whole career. There is a reason he doesn't have 100 bastards around the globe and it doesn't involve the Targaryens. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomav84 Posted June 25, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted June 25, 2022 14 minutes ago, Straggler said: I could have made it even funnier. Belle could have had a pregnancy that threatens her life to bring to term. The local Dr refuses to abort for fear of going to jail and she dies, both baby and mother don't make it. Jock can hold a 2 for the price of 1 funeral. Or Jocks brother visits and rapes Belle. Jock and Belle then have to raise his brothers rape baby. So many punch lines for this joke of a decision. mad thing is that if she aborts said rape baby, she'll do more time than the rapist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fun Factory Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 (edited) 13 hours ago, il_serpente said: The bolded part is very true. Do you really think Mitch McConnell gives a sh*t about abortion? He and his ilk pushed for the conservative justices because doing so would keep the religious conservatives voting Republican reliably. The culture wars were stoked by that party to keep a bunch of people so emotionally invested in side issues that they'd continue to vote against their own best interests. This idea that Roe v. Wade was a sucker punch to deeply held conservative beliefs is revisionist history. There was no passionate, widely held opposition to abortion before Roe, even among conservatives at the time. Passionate opposition to abortion as a fundamental component of conservatism didn't really come about until nearly a decade after the ruling as Jerry Fallwell's Moral Majority started getting evangelicals involved in politics and helped put Reagan in power. Once-moderate (or at least not extreme) Republicans saw the opportunity to lock in a lot of votes among easily-swayed and often uneducated people whose interests should otherwise have inclined them to vote Democratic. It's no accident that a lot of Republicans who were on the record as being pro choice years ago (including Bush the elder) suddenly claimed to oppose abortion and support overturn of Roe. Isn't that more or less the same for gun control? 30-40 years ago it wasn't really a big talking point. Its just a long standing fight back for the white, over 40 population who don't like the fact that America is becoming more diverse, more liberal and more urban. Fortunately for them they have been able to hijack the political process to push their minority opinions to the rest of the country. Very much like apartheid in South Africa. The US is heading towards the dark ages unless they can change their political institutions that are biased towards rural evangelical populism. Edited June 25, 2022 by The Fun Factory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 From reading hot takes around the net so many people seem to think the Supreme Court have banned abortion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 6 hours ago, CVByrne said: It's amazing how US Democracy is effectively broken to its core. They cannot pass any laws at National level even when they have majorities. I think they need to end the rules like filibuster which basically stops any legislation the opposition don't like from going anywhere. Then the country is governable. It amazes me that over here in Europe where we have functioning democracies you just vote in a Government and they pass laws. Take Roe v Wade, why on earth are a handful of hand picked Judges deciding things every other democracy simply passed laws on. They really need to just accept that the whole concept of the United States has run its course. Let it all laws be decided at state level but allow those states the latitude to override parts of the constitution like the right to bear arms. If some states want to ban abortion then others should be allowed to ban guns. Without the possibility to pass state laws that conflict with the constitution the country as a whole will further descend into further chaos. I can't even believe its for discussion. Does it really need to be said the abortion or not has to be the womans choice ? Incredible - absolutely staggered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 6 hours ago, CVByrne said: It's amazing how US Democracy is effectively broken to its core. They cannot pass any laws at National level even when they have majorities. I think they need to end the rules like filibuster which basically stops any legislation the opposition don't like from going anywhere. Then the country is governable. It amazes me that over here in Europe where we have functioning democracies you just vote in a Government and they pass laws. Take Roe v Wade, why on earth are a handful of hand picked Judges deciding things every other democracy simply passed laws on. They really need to just accept that the whole concept of the United States has run its course. Let it all laws be decided at state level but allow those states the latitude to override parts of the constitution like the right to bear arms. If some states want to ban abortion then others should be allowed to ban guns. Without the possibility to pass state laws that conflict with the constitution the country as a whole will further descend into further chaos. The bolded bit is my problem with the whole thing. It should never have been the Supreme Court that made abortion legal. Same with the legalisation of gay marriage. Having that sort of social change imposed on the country by judges (and then changed back again a few years later when judges change) is a terrible idea. These things need to happen via democracy, with the will and consent of the electorate, not imposed via the Supreme Court. When Australia legalised gay marriage there was a national plebiscite. The country returned a vote in the affirmative, then the elected Parliament took a vote and enacted the required legislation. Compare that with the US where the population were never consulted and the the Supreme Court just told the country this is how it’s going to be from now on. That kind of democratic deficit really riles people up and drives them to ‘correct’ what they see as a burning injustice. I expect gay marriage will be overturned in short order as well and it will be another scandal but the truth of it is it should not have been enacted by the court in the first place. That’s not the way to run a country. At least not if you don’t want to divide people and push them into becoming extremists. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 1 hour ago, hippo said: I can't even believe its for discussion. Does it really need to be said the abortion or not has to be the womans choice ? Incredible - absolutely staggered. Yes it should require laws passed by an elected government. Laws people thought right and just 100 years ago will be different to what we believe right and just now and they will be different in 100 years from now. Societies change and the flexibility of law should be there to change with it. We have that in Europe because we have functioning democracies. People want to vilify the anti abortion groups in America. We don't agree with their views but to them they feel incredibly strongly about them. A functional democracy should pass laws the majority of the electorate are in favour of. In America 66% of people believe there should be access to abortion for women by choice. The failure of that country as a Democracy is the fact they could never pass a law that enacts the majority view of the country. The views of the 34% who don't want the right of women to abortion by choice are not evil or to be vilified. They hold a view the majority of their country doesn't hold. That should be accommodated in a functional democracy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 2 hours ago, LondonLax said: The bolded bit is my problem with the whole thing. It should never have been the Supreme Court that made abortion legal. Same with the legalisation of gay marriage. Having that sort of social change imposed on the country by judges (and then changed back again a few years later when judges change) is a terrible idea. These things need to happen via democracy, with the will and consent of the electorate, not imposed via the Supreme Court. When Australia legalised gay marriage there was a national plebiscite. The country returned a vote in the affirmative, then the elected Parliament took a vote and enacted the required legislation. Compare that with the US where the population were never consulted and the the Supreme Court just told the country this is how it’s going to be from now on. That kind of democratic deficit really riles people up and drives them to ‘correct’ what they see as a burning injustice. I expect gay marriage will be overturned in short order as well and it will be another scandal but the truth of it is it should not have been enacted by the court in the first place. That’s not the way to run a country. At least not if you don’t want to divide people and push them into becoming extremists. Excellent post. I agree with every word you have written above. Sadly in Ireland we amended our Constitution to make abortion illegal in our Constitution at the beginning of the 1980s because of the vile influence the Catholic Church had over Ireland at the time. But unperturbed, a simple referendum with a significant majority on favour removed that from the constitution and allowed the elected government to legislate. That's a functional democracy with a written constitution. The issue America faces is that it's no longer a single country and needs to accept that. States need to be allowed to do what they want Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted June 25, 2022 Author Share Posted June 25, 2022 7 hours ago, desensitized43 said: I think it’s pretty much inevitable at this point that if he’s allowed to run he’ll win. He got more votes that any losing candidate in history. America has always been a divided country but I can’t remember it being this bad in my lifetime. I’m not old enough to remember the civil rights and anti Vietnam struggle but it certainly feels like we’re getting back to that point. Am I right in saying secession is a word being thrown around in places like California? Just type seccession into a Twitter search and you'll see for yourself. Some of it will be Russian based but much of it is real. The Texas GOP is officially exploring the possibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted June 25, 2022 Author Share Posted June 25, 2022 (edited) 7 hours ago, Straggler said: The fricking idiots cheering this decision on still think they are inflicting this law on other people. It's the immoral people having sex outside of wedlock, harlot women, the dregs of society being held to account for the sinful lives they live. But like Brexit, they have utterly failed to notice that the impact will be felt in their own homes and indeed their own bodies. In Mississippi now a white skinned, gun toting, church going, red voting, heterosexual, truck driving, country music listening man and woman can fall in love get married and decide to get pregnant. They are all excited and tell everyone, they drive together to the clinic and get all the scans done, all is well and life is good. Then the worst happens. One day our beautiful belle slips and falls in the bathroom. It's an accident pure and simple, but the unborn life is snuffed out. Our quarterback jock has been downstairs watching the NFL with a few beers. He rushes up to find his fallen wife, and they together rush to hospital to find out the worst news of their lives. Belle is treated with some drugs to ensure she is not infected by the failed pregnancy, and go home to start the first day of their now tragedy inflicted lives. The next day. Knock knock, it's the police. The house is now a crime scene. Belle and QB Jock are suspected of carrying out an unlawful termination. Can Belle and QB jock prove that this was an accident? It turns out that the clinic they go to is already being investigated for carrying out unlawful terminations. Of course, they didn't know that, why would they, but the circumstantial evidence is adding up. Oh, and the drugs Belle was given to prevent infection are similar enough to the drugs used to induce an abortion that this is really beginning to look suspect. Best go get a good lawyer, gosh that is expensive. But how are miscarriages investigated by the police. It turns out with her rights to privacy of her own body stripped away like this, that really quite invasive and intimate physical examinations of her body by the police are standard operating procedure. The day after her miscarriage, full of grief, she is on a cold bed in a police facility, being probed, poked and having samples taken from. Treated like a criminal. QB Jock is in a different police facility. He had been drinking the day of the crime. It's not a good look for him, also he had shared driving responsibilities over their many trips to the Dr, so he is now an accessory to the murder of the unborn child. As they go through it, all Belle and Jock can think is that the abortion laws were not supposed to be for people like them, it was supposed to be for the other folk. You know, the bad ones that don't go to church and wear short skirts. Not us, we make homemade lemonade. How did they end up coming for us? They may both go to jail. For years. You gonna tell me that the police in the USA haven't made wrongful convictions? Even if they don't go to jail, just consider that every miscarriage is now a potential crime scene. Think how the US police may decide to investigate. The picture is not pretty. Also, and more likely to happen often, is if your southern country boy got his Belle pregnant by accident, maybe when they're in high school, he'd be on the hook for 18 years of monthly child support payments. "Whoops" Edited June 25, 2022 by maqroll 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted June 25, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted June 25, 2022 6 minutes ago, maqroll said: Also, and more likely to happen often, is if your southern country boy got his Belle pregnant by accident, maybe when they're in high school, he'd be on the hook for 18 years of monthly child support payments. "Whoops" All good news for lawyers, I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 14 minutes ago, maqroll said: Just type seccession into a Twitter search and you'll see for yourself. Some of it will be Russian based but much of it is real. The Texas GOP is officially exploring the possibility. Texas **** off and being their own nation of clearings in the woods that shoots each other to death seems to be a net gain for America. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 1 hour ago, CVByrne said: Yes it should require laws passed by an elected government. It probably should be, but there was never a need, because it was established law, before the republican judges infiltrated the court on the back of lies and stripped rights away from millions of women. What they've done is unprecedented, brings shame upon the court, and in a just world, the most recent three appointees would be impeached and removed for obtaining their position on false grounds. They're snakes in the grass, traitors to the values they claimed to believe in until they obtained a majority by subterfuge, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted June 25, 2022 Author Share Posted June 25, 2022 32 minutes ago, Davkaus said: Texas **** off and being their own nation of clearings in the woods that shoots each other to death seems to be a net gain for America. Except for all the people down there who aren't conservative and white and straight will be subjected to whatever you might imagine. We can't abandon them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 19 minutes ago, Davkaus said: It probably should be, but there was never a need, because it was established law, before the republican judges infiltrated the court on the back of lies and stripped rights away from millions of women. What they've done is unprecedented, brings shame upon the court, and in a just world, the most recent three appointees would be impeached and removed for obtaining their position on false grounds. They're snakes in the grass, traitors to the values they claimed to believe in until they obtained a majority by subterfuge, There was no reason they should not have enshrined the Supreme Court judgment in law in the 70s if that was the political will of the people. It was never legislated despite a supreme court judgment. Why? The issue with America is, in 1973 it wasn't the majority of the population who believed a woman should have a right to an abortion via choice and now it's the same but opposite. The majority don't believe a woman should be denied access to abortion by choice. The common denominator is the fact is a handful of judges don't agree. They don't legislate because it's a non functional democracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desensitized43 Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 57 minutes ago, maqroll said: Just type seccession into a Twitter search and you'll see for yourself. Some of it will be Russian based but much of it is real. The Texas GOP is officially exploring the possibility. Well I know it’s been talked about in those circles since “the lost cause” crap started but it’s now started happening the other side with people in the liberal states talking about cutting loose from their Christian fundamentalist brethren. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted June 25, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted June 25, 2022 10 minutes ago, maqroll said: Except for all the people down there who aren't conservative and white and straight will be subjected to whatever you might imagine. We can't abandon them. AKA Austin. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 8 minutes ago, mjmooney said: AKA Austin. Maybe they can build a wall? Be a bit like Berlin during the cold war. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choffer Posted June 25, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted June 25, 2022 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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