Made In Aston Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 1 hour ago, TRO said: The big burning question is and always has been ......are we well equipped enough as a club that when we sell players, we can buy better. I knew a time when that was so, in the last 10 years we haven't and I am not sure we have turned that corner yet either From the transfers we are doing and players linked to, it appears the new owners are trying to buy young players with potential. Hopefully we can get a progressive, experienced DOF to bring it all together into an effective, coherent long term strategy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshVilla Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 I think it will take a 40+ mill bid for him to leave now with the season starting imminently. Anything less and i'll be disappointed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
privateer Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 9 minutes ago, terrytini said: He’s not a goal scorer. No, he's not really noted for his tally but I think the point for some - me included - is that he perhaps should have more to his name already and should be more prolific. The reason being, he gets in so many great positions to pull the trigger without doing so I wonder why? Is he being told not to? Is he not seeing it? I don't know but he's like an anti-Tonev, he doesn't shoot often enough and tends to do a good job with his strikes. I'd like to see him doing it more often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrUnKeNbUm Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 3 minutes ago, privateer said: No, he's not really noted for his tally but I think the point for some - me included - is that he perhaps should have more to his name already and should be more prolific. The reason being, he gets in so many great positions to pull the trigger without doing so I wonder why? Is he being told not to? Is he not seeing it? I don't know but he's like an anti-Tonev, he doesn't shoot often enough and tends to do a good job with his strikes. I'd like to see him doing it more often. Hard to score when you keep getting hacked down just outside the box. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 1 hour ago, TRO said: We are where we are in the main, because we have bought players that have offered us in general less than the ones who have left. Again, not sure I agree with either the sentiment or the reasoning.... “ we are we are......we were 4th. Not good enough, but not bad. But is it for why you say ? Ive had a very rough go at a comparison...players who’ve gone, and sort of who has come in....between 2016 and now. Okore - Chester.................Bennett - Elmo.................Lescott - Elphick..............Amavi - De Laet...............Kinsella - Jedi..............Cissoko - Bree Crespo - Taylor............Bacuna - Lansbury..............Sinclair - Albert...........Westwood - Whelan ............Richardson - Birkir......... Sanchez - Hourihane..........Kozák - Hogan........Ayew - Kodja........ Weve also lost NZog (Green) .....Gestede ( Davis ).....Traoré,Veretout, And Idrissa Gueye.....who I can’t match off the top of my head. Whilst the merits of each could of course be debated, I don’t think there’s anything in that lot that stands out as being particularly bad exchange. So, in my view, the reason we are where we are is ( a) we aren’t too bad - and as Bruce said today we will be there or thereabouts - and it’s not the player exchanges. ( for me, it’s 7 Points from 7 games last August and September but I accept there are many views. Nowt wrong with the players here.....although I agree there’s a list of another half a dozen who’ve been a total waste of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 6 minutes ago, privateer said: No, he's not really noted for his tally but I think the point for some - me included - is that he perhaps should have more to his name already and should be more prolific. The reason being, he gets in so many great positions to pull the trigger without doing so I wonder why? Is he being told not to? Is he not seeing it? I don't know but he's like an anti-Tonev, he doesn't shoot often enough and tends to do a good job with his strikes. I'd like to see him doing it more often. Well I’d like to see it too.....but I was questioning the view that to get to the higher/ highest levels it’s essential. Those players didn’t do so bad ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvfcRigo82 Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 10 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: Let's continue this discussion when transfer window closes next week No need gents. Jack is not bigger than the club - he's the face of the club, our identity! To us he is indispensable in such a crucial season for all branches of the tree. £50k or £50 million, as @Mazrim rightly stated; He is worth £170m to us considering the circumstances and situation plus the time frame of such events for the forthcoming season. We will continue to build the team around Jack and rightly so. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 32 minutes ago, terrytini said: I see this a lot but must admit I think it’s overdone. He’s not a goal scorer. In largely poor sides his tally so far is a goal every 9 games, approx. Darren Anderton, every 8. Steve Macmannamanaman du du de du du mana mana du du di du - 7 Ginola and Giggs - 6 Waddle and Mersin - 5. Now there are mitigating factors and alternative slants one could put on these stats, but they are true. Each of those players ( in my view) was in some ways similar to Jack - ALL played, for the majority of their careers, in far far better teams than Jack has. Hes scored 14 goals in 125 odd games - had he scored just 4 more he’d be level with Mac a.m. So' yes, a shade more goals, but not essential in my humble opinion I’d be more interested in his assist record. Snodgrass had 14 although he did take set pieces. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Mazrim Posted August 3, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted August 3, 2018 Goals and assists are obviously important but I wonder how many goals Grealish is involved in from beginning to end. Probably loads. How many fouls does he draw that lead to set pieces that lead to goals? Quite a few. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, Vive_La_Villa said: Exactly. Name me the stand out player that got Cardiff promoted. I think it depends in what context you mean....i thought over 46 games Bamba and Morrison were outstanding......as was jack in his half season for us. Edited August 3, 2018 by TRO 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvfcRigo82 Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 1 minute ago, Mazrim said: How many fouls does he draw that lead to set pieces that lead to goals? Quite a few. Slightly off topic but this was why I wanted to see Snodgrass back on loan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kieranavfc Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 To put Grealish's fee into context, Boro are selling Ben Gibson to Burnley for FIFTEEN million. Anything under double that is an embarrassing offer for Jack. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 9 minutes ago, TRO said: I think it depends in what context you mean....i thought over 46 games Bamba and Morrison were outstanding......as was jack in his half season for us. Yes they were. Yet neither of them are stand out players in terms of ability. A lot of players are capable of stepping up when required so Jack is not irreplaceable. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said: Yes they were. Yet neither of them are stand out players in terms of ability. A lot of players are capable of stepping up when required so Jack is not irreplaceable. I am not sure i am on the same wave length.....players with oodles of tecnical ability will always catch the eye, its natural......but it takes a lot of abilility in a different sense to play at the back....Paul McGrath being an example. But its all about dominating your position that gets the applause. In that context, probably the best player, i have ever seen for us. In Jacks case i love watching him play, and loved it more when he added steel to his game. but i like watching a good centre half at work nearly as much as a tricky winger. its getting the balance between offensive and defensive play that brings success. Edited August 3, 2018 by TRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 (edited) 5 minutes ago, TRO said: I am not sure i am on the same wave length.....players with oodles of tecnical ability will always catch the eye, its natural......but it takes a lot of abilility in a different sense to play at the back....Paul McGrath being an example. But its all about dominating your position that applause. In that context, probably the best player, i have ever seen. In Jacks case i love watching him play, and loved it more when he added steel to his game. but i like watching a good centre half at work nearly as much as a tricky winger. its getting the balance between offensive and defensive play that brings success. Tro neither of them are about to get big money moves to top 4 teams any time soon. They did a job but there was no one star in that team that couldn’t be replaced. Had either of those centre half’s been sold or were injured another would have come in and done the same job. I’ve no doubt about that. Everyone in that team knew what they had to do and give that extra for their manager every single minute of every game. We sell Jack it doesn’t mean we can’t get promoted. The right manager and how we play as a team is far more important than any individual player. Edited August 3, 2018 by Vive_La_Villa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Made In Aston Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 (edited) 38 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said: Darren Anderton, every 8. Steve Macmannamanaman du du de du du mana mana du du di du - 7 Ginola and Giggs - 6 Waddle and Mersin - 5. These are largely wingers me jack plays ACM. Show me the goals for lampard, Gerrard, Scholes and even the mighty Tim cahill during his Everton days. Bet its a lot more than jack's 3 a season. An effective ACM should be able to get at least 10 goals and JG is a long way off. Edited August 3, 2018 by Made In Aston Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said: Tro neither of them are about to get big money moves to top 4 teams any time soon. They did a job but there was no one star in that team that couldn’t be replaced. Had either of those centre half’s been sold or were injured another would have come in and done the same job. I’ve no doubt about that. Everyone in that team knew what they had to do and give that extra for their manager every single minute of every game. We sell Jack it doesn’t mean we can’t get promoted. The right manager is far more important than any individual player. I have every doubt that a team like cardiff in their position, when NW took over, would have had difficulty replacing Bamba and Morrison....as for top 4 ....we are not talking about that level.....they all "do a job".....but there is plenty of players that don't......i think a player doing his job for 46 games is a massive plus. I agree, we can sell Jack and get promoted, just makes that bit more difficult unless we can find a replacement? Not taking anything away from Neil Warnock, but he was blessed with his type of players ar Cardiff when he took over....but yes he knows how to balance a team.Neil Warnock has been at clubs where his type of players were not there and he was restricted in buying and it didn't end well. line 3 you are right.....but it makes it harder. I agree the manager is central to a successful team Edited August 3, 2018 by TRO 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 50 minutes ago, AvfcRigo82 said: No need gents. Jack is not bigger than the club - he's the face of the club, our identity! To us he is indispensable in such a crucial season for all branches of the tree. £50k or £50 million, as @Mazrim rightly stated; He is worth £170m to us considering the circumstances and situation plus the time frame of such events for the forthcoming season. We will continue to build the team around Jack and rightly so. He isn't irreplaceable though. We have had bigger player leave in the past if he goes I wish him well be sad to see him go but life goes on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaffer85 Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 When has Jack actually been an attacking mid maybe last season but was before then always out wide so hard to compare to attacking mid as he has only had half a season in that position Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvfcRigo82 Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 Just now, Demitri_C said: He isn't irreplaceable though. We have had bigger player leave in the past if he goes I wish him well be sad to see him go but life goes on. We wern't recovering from a mighty f*ck up in the past that involved relegation and borderline oblivion. There has been no bigger situation for the club than this within the last 35 years that I can recall. Right now, Jack is the heartbeat of Aston Villa in terms of progression. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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