Pau Torres

[ozvilla28]

Class player no doubt , but sometimes needs to do the basics right marking and cutting the high ball those balls we're school stuff.

[M_Afro]

Pau has done really well considering it’s his first year in England. He will benefit massively from his experience this year and hopefully by the start of next season he will have Mings or another physical defender alongside him and a physical DCM in front of him. He can then focus on what he is elite at which is progressing the ball (he’s also a much better defender than he gets credit for).

[ozvillafan]

5 hours ago, TRO said:

That's like a lovely shiny bucket with a hole in it.

The first job of a CB is to defend.....if they can play out, that's a bonus. i.e VVD

This all day.

The reason why Paul McGrath is rightly revered is he could do both. He could head the ball clear, he could tackle, he could read the play and intercept and he could mark.

I've heard Pau often mentioned in the same breath in this thread - but his defendng is not great. He's not a great read of defensive situations which puts pressure on the other defenders.

It's not a once off either: There are numerous times in previous games he drops out of the defensive line and plays attackers on - particularly in our box - but we haven't been punished for it. For the second and 3rd today he made poor defensive decisions when all that was needed was to mark a man (or the right man for the 3rd).

He needs to get better, otherwise we have a perfectly good defender ready to take back his spot (next season, once he recovers from the ACL).

[Delphinho123]

He is what he is. He’s a quarterback style defender. Great for setting up attacks and splitting the lines but average defensively. 

It’s a trade off unfortunately. I think we’re a better team with him in it though. 

[S-Platt]

6 minutes ago, Delphinho123 said:

He is what he is. He’s a quarterback style defender. Great for setting up attacks and splitting the lines but average defensively. 

It’s a trade off unfortunately. I think we’re a better team with him in it though. 

Yep I think Unai wanted a back 3 but injuries have killed that chance.  We will see when Mings is back what happens.

[PaulC]

A stat was mentioned yesterday. The win percentage with him in is really high compared to when he's not playing. Yesterday he had a brain freeze. But he's been a fantastic signing and we wouid not be 4th without him. Wouldn't say he's player of the year. Ollie wins that hands down but he's in the next group with Luiz, Bailey and McGinn.

[Sulberto21]

It was Wissa who injured his ankle at the Brentford ground in the first game. He’s been carrying it ever since then. He’s most likely still recovering from the injury but he’s been playing through the pain barrier. 

Class player full summer to recover and he’ll be back on top form next season. 

[Kiwivillan]

I'm thankful for all the points we've gained from him in the team. Everyone has a bad day at the office now and then

[TRO]

5 hours ago, ozvillafan said:

This all day.

The reason why Paul McGrath is rightly revered is he could do both. He could head the ball clear, he could tackle, he could read the play and intercept and he could mark.

I've heard Pau often mentioned in the same breath in this thread - but his defendng is not great. He's not a great read of defensive situations which puts pressure on the other defenders.

It's not a once off either: There are numerous times in previous games he drops out of the defensive line and plays attackers on - particularly in our box - but we haven't been punished for it. For the second and 3rd today he made poor defensive decisions when all that was needed was to mark a man (or the right man for the 3rd).

He needs to get better, otherwise we have a perfectly good defender ready to take back his spot (next season, once he recovers from the ACL).

Perfect rendition.

[Tom13]

11 hours ago, TRO said:

That's like a lovely shiny bucket with a hole in it.

The first job of a CB is to defend.....if they can play out, that's a bonus. i.e VVD

Very simple view. If a defender is winning you more points than he's losing you because of excellent passing, why is one more important than the other?

[DakotaVilla]

5 minutes ago, Tom13 said:

Very simple view. If a defender is winning you more points than he's losing you because of excellent passing, why is one more important than the other?

Totally agree. Also football has moved on. At the highest level, you can’t have the luxury of having any player that can’t contribute to the attack in a significant way anymore - and that includes goalkeepers. 

[AVTuco]

Unai wants to defend by dominating the ball, just like City. Pau is one of the main pieces in that strategy.

[TRO]

25 minutes ago, Tom13 said:

Very simple view. If a defender is winning you more points than he's losing you because of excellent passing, why is one more important than the other?

Simple is sometimes, most poignant...as the old acronym suggests K.I.S.S.

I don't accept your point as a trade off......we need both, if we have plans to go somewhere.

We are WIP ,so I am hoping Unai addresses some of defensive frailties, in the summer.

[TRO]

13 minutes ago, AVTuco said:

Unai wants to defend by dominating the ball, just like City. Pau is one of the main pieces in that strategy.

and Rodri is one of the main pieces in theirs.....I think we may have a different view of the context to dominating the ball....I don't see dominating possession, mainly unchallenged in your own half, as dominating the ball......City dominate the ball, in the opponents last third. For me, there is a significant difference.

What Unai wants to do, and what we are doing is too different things......We dominated Possession yesterday, and we scored 3 goals, great......but without the ball, we didn't hunt in back, so we invited them back in.

I don't believe, that is a strategy, Unai wants from his team......losing the ball in duels as easy as we do, is not dominating the ball.

[TRO]

6 hours ago, M_Afro said:

Pau has done really well considering it’s his first year in England. He will benefit massively from his experience this year and hopefully by the start of next season he will have Mings or another physical defender alongside him and a physical DCM in front of him. He can then focus on what he is elite at which is progressing the ball (he’s also a much better defender than he gets credit for).

I agree.

I also acknowledge, the balance of the players around him, with those attributes, leave him exposed.

We all know, what he does best.....and I still want him in our team.

[AVTuco]

2 minutes ago, TRO said:

and Rodri is one of the main pieces in theirs.....I think we may have a different view of the context to dominating the ball....I don't see dominating possession, mainly unchallenged in your own half, as dominating the ball......City dominate the ball, in the opponents last third. For me, there is a significant difference.

What Unai wants to do, and what we are doing is too different things......We dominated Possession yesterday, and we scored 3 goals, great......but without the ball, we didn't hunt in back, so we invited them back in.

I don't believe, that is a strategy, Unai wants from his team......losing the ball in duels as easy as we do, is not dominating the ball.

I agree what Unai wants and what he gets currently are two different things. We're still a project, and ahead of schedule in my mind.

[TRO]

5 hours ago, Delphinho123 said:

He is what he is. He’s a quarterback style defender. Great for setting up attacks and splitting the lines but average defensively. 

It’s a trade off unfortunately. I think we’re a better team with him in it though. 

The problem is, the players he needs around him....Kamara and Mings are not there.

I understand the necessity of trade offs, for where we are......but progression, in itself, warrants limiting those trade offs to a minimum.

My main point is to progress, we have to defend better.......how we do that, is a debate in itself.

our record this season, of 49 goals conceded, is not all on Pau......We all know that.

Edited April 7 by TRO

[TRO]

20 minutes ago, AVTuco said:

I agree what Unai wants and what he gets currently are two different things. We're still a project, and ahead of schedule in my mind.

Look the season has been great, lets get that Elephant in the room out of the way, to start with.

We have let 2 goal leads slip, too many times this season, for it not to be a concern....and the main concern is the manner of the collapses.

Pau Torres, is not solely responsible for them either....that's out the way, too.

The defensive side of our game, needs scrutiny and forensic examination.....I see things during a game, that concern me, as do others I guess. I am not suggesting Unai changes his football philosophy, but I am suggesting we concede too many and too easily....and I do not share the view, the forwards have to cover for that, by scoring more, and missing less chances, as some propagate....I don't accept that trade off.

Its largely the manner of those goals conceded yesterday, that's the major concern......The opposition never laid a glove on us, before the infamous 9 minutes.....Then they smelt a rat, we was standing off, and that was the incentive they needed.

Paul Torres, played his part, but it wasn't all on him.

Konsa, stopped Vinicius Jnr, but couldn't stop Reguillion?.....It was collective incompetency and in no way was Unai, expecting that.

Pau Torres is a fine footballer, and I'm glad we have him....but he is missing, crucially adept players who can compliment his skill set.

When we see teams, with physically adept players like VVD, Rodri, Gabriel or Saliba......it has a significant effect on those teams.....We miss Mings and Kamara.....and so does Pau.

 

Edited April 7 by TRO

[PaulC]

16 minutes ago, TRO said:

Look the season has been great, lets get that Elephant in the room out of the way, to start with.

We have let 2 goal leads slip, too many times this season, for it not to be a concern....and the main concern is the manner of the collapses.

Pau Torres, is not solely responsible for them either....that's out the way, too.

The defensive side of our game, needs scrutiny and forensic examination.....I see things during a game, that concern me, as do others I guess. I am not suggesting Unai changes his football philosophy, but I am suggesting we concede too many and too easily....and I do not share the view, the forwards have to cover for that, by scoring more, and missing less chances, as some propagate....I don't accept that trade off.

Its largely the manner of those goals conceded yesterday, that's the major concern......The opposition never laid a glove on us, before the infamous 9 minutes.....Then they smelt a rat, we was standing off, and that was the incentive they needed.

Paul Torres, played his part, but it wasn't all on him.

Konsa, stopped Vinicius Jnr, but couldn't stop Reguillion?.....It was collective incompetency and in no way was Unai, expecting that.

Pau Torres is a fine footballer, and I'm glad we have him....but he is missing, crucially adept players who can compliment his skill set.

When we see teams, with physically adept players like VVD, Rodri, Gabriel or Saliba......it has a significant effect on those teams.....We miss Mings and Kamara.....and so does Pau.

 

I think Arsenal will win the league this time because Declan Rice has added that steel to the midfield. Its something we haven't got especially without Kamara. But even with him at times our defence has looked vulnerable. When Bailey plays teams double up on him. We don't seem to do that to opposition teams. Too many crosses allowed to come in. It's hard to believe we are 4th when we are so vulnerable in certain areas.  Different to the end of last season when we were hard to score against. Injuries to Mings. Kamara I guess. 

[sharkyvilla]

To be fair to Pau I don't remember him putting a foot wrong recently before yesterday.  Early in the season he was getting run past quite easily but that seemed to have stopped.  Yesterday they all decided to defend like they're pissed for 10 minutes.