fightoffyour Posted May 13, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted May 13, 2021 Thankfully West Ham aren’t getting CL but they’ll still need to replace Antonio sooner or later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKP90 Posted May 13, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted May 13, 2021 8 hours ago, Villaphan04 said: yeah I just don't understand where a new signing at CDM fits into our squad with us having Luiz McGinn and then bringing in Sanson in January. Don't see any space for one in our starting 11 unless Dean drops us playing that advanced attacking midfield (of the 3). Throw in Ramsay as well getting game time and I dunno 5 hours ago, Villaphan04 said: agreed with most of this. I like Nakamba but it's telling that he rarely gets a game for us. I really like Luiz as well and want to give him more game time, yet also think there is room for an out and our DM better than Nakamba. I guess my big concern would be where does this new DM signing play. Like you say, Luiz would then compete with McGinn (whom Smith loves like you said) and Sanson (like you say again wasn't signed to be a backup). I just don't see where another midfield signing would go in because Deano isn't going to be dropping his 2 wingers playstyle (or at least hasn't shown any inclination to do so. This leaves me at the point where are we expecting to sell Luiz to get this new old fashioned DM We desperately need a dm who can initiate attacks and provide protection for the back 4. There are pages of discussions on this thread which have gone in to why Nakamba isnt that, and why Luiz, as good as he is, is not a proper DM. Playing 3 midfielders as 8’s doesn’t provide balance and makes us vulnerable to teams fielding advanced midfielders. You sort of answered the question though, as we need a rethink of the team structure in the middle to address this balance. Doesn’t need to change the winger style, would actually complement it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Abraham is easily a £40m player, will score goals wherever he goes, and has good workrate, if we didn't already have Watkins I would be happy to sign him for that much as our first choice. You look at his age, his record over the last two seasons in the premier league and in Europe, and the fact that he's an England international, and you're not going to get a player with that kind of background for much cheaper. Any less than £40m and you're then talking about the kind of fees it would take to buy the best championship strikers, Toney would probably cost £30m plus, we paid similar for Watkins, and if someone was to have bought Mitrovic last summer they probably would have had to pay a similar fee. If anything £40m for Abraham is cheap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexicon Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 5 minutes ago, useless said: Abraham is easily a £40m player, will score goals wherever he goes, and has good workrate, if we didn't already have Watkins I would be happy to sign him for that much as our first choice. You look at his age, his record over the last two seasons in the premier league and in Europe, and the fact that he's an England international, and you're not going to get a player with that kind of background for much cheaper. Any less than £40m and you're then talking about the kind of fees it would take to buy the best championship strikers, Toney would probably cost £30m plus, we paid similar for Watkins, and if someone was to have bought Mitrovic last summer they probably would have had to pay a similar fee. If anything £40m for Abraham is cheap. He's too one-dimensional for me - Watkins is a much better option IMO and I'd much rather have Toney for the numbers you're talking. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKP90 Posted May 13, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted May 13, 2021 1 minute ago, lexicon said: He's too one-dimensional for me - Watkins is a much better option IMO and I'd much rather have Toney for the numbers you're talking. I’d have to agree about Tammy. I think he’s a great player, but that the ship has sailed with him. As you say, if we didn’t have Ollie i’d be all for it, but I wouldn’t want to drop him for Tammy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barry'sboots Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 On 12/05/2021 at 09:10, Dave-R said: I agree with you but in a few games where we need to be shifts soon as season ends because we need to be making a run towards the top. Now to do that we should still keep the likes of Luiz, Mcginn, Ghazi, Trezegeut, they will do for next season and can be bench boys, we do need to go look for much better. I'd bring a new CDM, a much better attacking midfielder and a Winger into the club. I agree with your three priorities. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 I think Watkins is a better all round player than Abraham, maybe I'd expect Abraham to score more goals, out of the two I'd prefer Watkins, as I said last summer before he even joined us. I'd take Abraham over Toney from what I've seen, both are quite similar in style, but Abraham is younger and proven at an higher level, and it probably wouldn't take much more to buy Abraham than it would Toney if the £40m figures being talked about are correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexicon Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 5 minutes ago, useless said: I think Watkins is a better all round player than Abraham, maybe I'd expect Abraham to score more goals, out of the two I'd prefer Watkins, as I said last summer before he even joined us. I'd take Abraham over Toney from what I've seen, both are quite similar in style, but Abraham is younger and proven at an higher level, and it probably wouldn't take much more to buy Abraham than it would Toney if the £40m figures being talked about are correct. I don't think they are so similar in style and the issue for me is all-round play - Toney is more of a team player and gets assists, whereas Abraham is more of an out-and-out striker, which is somewhat of an anachronism these days. The more phases of play a player can be involved in, the better and the way we play, we're best with ones who play in at least two - if we break it down into defending, transitional/build-up, attacking. Abraham is very much just the third IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 (edited) Toney on £21k/w at Brentford while Tammy on £82k/w at Chelsea. If we are talking about rotation players then whatever Tammy will be asking for is no doubt too much. Been mentioned here before but the likes of Patson Daka (unrealistic perhaps) or Abdallah Sima represents much better value for money and potential for us IMO. Edited May 13, 2021 by sne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M_Afro Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Tammy at £20m is a no brainier but even at that price he does not suit our style of play. £40m is way too much. Ollie is our number 9. We need to focus on supplying him better and more regularly. If we can do that, then we are fine to enter the new season with Wes, Davis and Barry as the next in line. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Toney was such an obvious punt to get hold of last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barry'sboots Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 14 hours ago, nick76 said: and this squashes the rumours he doesn’t like two upfront I'm more interested in the one in behind?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-R Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 48 minutes ago, useless said: I think Watkins is a better all round player than Abraham, maybe I'd expect Abraham to score more goals, out of the two I'd prefer Watkins, as I said last summer before he even joined us. I'd take Abraham over Toney from what I've seen, both are quite similar in style, but Abraham is younger and proven at an higher level, and it probably wouldn't take much more to buy Abraham than it would Toney if the £40m figures being talked about are correct. I'd buy Abraham if we certainly could, it really would be amazing to have both Watkins and Abraham at the club. Having Ollie and Tammy gives us change around options and Ollie himself can play along the whole of the front line. The way I see it is Trezegeut is injured, we either go buy a winger or buy Tammy. If we buy Tammy we can make use of Watkins of the right which was his position at Brentford. If we buy a Winger then we have to buy one who can be utilised across the whole frontal line anyway. I'd just go go buy Tammy, we know the guys and Smith has made him work and we know full well that Ollie works anywhere on the frontline, that's if we buy another frontline player which I think we will. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel Posted May 13, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted May 13, 2021 7 minutes ago, Tomaszk said: Toney was such an obvious punt to get hold of last season. Really? Would you want Clarke Harris, this years league1 top scorer? (Ironically he also plays for Peterborough) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 If we changed to 5-3-2 Tammy would make sense, but then there'd be other players who'd make even more sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Abraham would never be available for £20m in a million years, to think we could get him for that much would be as erroneous as thinking we could get Toney for £15m, or another team thinking they could get Watkins for not much more than £20m. If we want a striker for around £20m, that can play on his own up front, then Dike is the player from the championship to look at. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-R Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 28 minutes ago, M_Afro said: Tammy at £20m is a no brainier but even at that price he does not suit our style of play. £40m is way too much. Ollie is our number 9. We need to focus on supplying him better and more regularly. If we can do that, then we are fine to enter the new season with Wes, Davis and Barry as the next in line. I do agree with this, my main choice would be to first bring more Wingers in who can deliver, Cross, pass, be more of a support to there lone striker and attacking box players. We have struggled with Ghazi and Trezegeut to get them to do that and although Traore can do it at times, he's not a specialist at getting the ball to a lone singular target. We just have struggled so much since Jack has been out and while ever we struggle with the above, we will be seen as a one man team still. The moment we can start supplying our attacking players with better more accurate balls without Jack doing it, then it will be better for the team. If I could stretch our signings to four then I would bring in two Wingers a CDM and an attacking midfielder. I'm not concerned about the keeper situation or defence, i think we can deal with next season without signing for those areas, the areas that need most attention are between midfield, Wings and Striker. I think we could possibly buy 3 signings and buythe fourth in January and the 4th would be that 2nd winger then. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-R Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 (edited) 3 minutes ago, useless said: Abraham would never be available for £20m in a million years, to think we could get him for that much would be as erroneous as thinking we could get Toney for £15m, or another team thinking they could get Watkins for not much more than £20m. If we want a striker for around £20m, that can play on his own up front, then Dike is the player from the championship to look at. I reckon if Chelsea set Tammy at 20 mill there would be a flood of clubs from this league and below trying there luck. A bidding war would start and I could see the price floating to over 30-35 mill anyway as that's what I reckon Chelsea will be happy with. Edited May 13, 2021 by Dave-R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKP90 Posted May 13, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted May 13, 2021 Would anyone take Tammy as a loan with option to buy? If he’s that desperate to get out of Chelsea it might suit everyone, as we could see if we can accommodate him, Chelsea could perhaps increase his value if he has a good season and we don’t exercise the option. Plus we don’t have to shell out loads of money on him this season helping our FFP. Seems a possible way forward to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barry'sboots Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 6 minutes ago, Dave-R said: I'd buy Abraham if we certainly could, it really would be amazing to have both Watkins and Abraham at the club. Having Ollie and Tammy gives us change around options and Ollie himself can play along the whole of the front line. The way I see it is Trezegeut is injured, we either go buy a winger or buy Tammy. If we buy Tammy we can make use of Watkins of the right which was his position at Brentford. If we buy a Winger then we have to buy one who can be utilised across the whole frontal line anyway. I'd just go go buy Tammy, we know the guys and Smith has made him work and we know full well that Ollie works anywhere on the frontline, that's if we buy another frontline player which I think we will. If we had Tammy, I would not want to push Ollie out wide - I would love to see them play off each other with Jack in behind them, or possibly BT at "10" and Jack as an "8" as he has played before. ---------------------------- Martinez ----------------------------- ------- Axel ------------- Konsa ------------- Mings ------- Cash -------- Bissouma ------ Luiz ----------- Targett ----------------------------- Jack ---------------------------------- ------------------- Tammy -------- Ollie ----------------------- Or ----------------------- Current back 5 ------------------------- ------------------------- Bissouma ------------------------------ ------- SJM ---------------------------------------- Jack ------- -------------------------------- BT ----------------------------------- --------------------- Tammy ---- Ollie ------------------------- I think that could be really exciting. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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