Ollie Watkins

[roonst83]

34 minutes ago, nick76 said:

yeah that was a really bad sign.  Attitude in the number one attribute needed and if your game is off as well it doesn’t bode well.  Bench time will give him chance to sort himself out.

He’s done this countless times. 

[wilko154]

I see we've got a new scapegoat.

Attitude problem? Absolute rubbish, he was part of the celebrations after Coutinho's goal, he called other players to join in then high fived Coutinho on the way back to the centre circle. The bloke was probably just looking knackered from all of the running he had been doing for 90 minutes.

Yesterday he struggled in the 10 position. He's so much better when he is up front as the central striker. If you look at the balls into him, the majority are where he has his back to goal with a defender behind him. He's a striker, it's where he was so good for us last season, and it's where he needs to play this season.

I would bench Ings, and play Watkins up front with Buendia and Coutinho in behind him now. If he's off the boil in a game, then bring on Ings to give him a go with half hour remaining.

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

9 hours ago, Stevo985 said:

Ings or Watkins needs to be dropped and stick with one up front.

I think Watkins is the guy to lead the line

Can we genetically modify them?

Watkins with Ings finishing ability and ball control would be a hell of a striker.

I love Ollie, but his touch and decision making seriously lets him, and us down quite a fair bit.

EDIT: and no conspiracy theory here, but I too, have some questions about his attitude recently - could be much ado about nothing though.

Edited January 16, 2022 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[nick76]

22 minutes ago, wilko154 said:

I see we've got a new scapegoat.

That’s a cop out, if a player is playing poorly then we can discuss that.  Just because some fans don’t like their number one player being critically analysed or called out doesn’t mean he’s a scapegoat.

25 minutes ago, wilko154 said:

Yesterday he struggled in the 10 position. He's so much better when he is up front as the central striker.

He’s been both this season and played with and without Ings and has been poor.

[gwi1890]

32 minutes ago, wilko154 said:

I see we've got a new scapegoat.

Attitude problem? Absolute rubbish, he was part of the celebrations after Coutinho's goal, he called other players to join in then high fived Coutinho on the way back to the centre circle. The bloke was probably just looking knackered from all of the running he had been doing for 90 minutes.

Yesterday he struggled in the 10 position. He's so much better when he is up front as the central striker. If you look at the balls into him, the majority are where he has his back to goal with a defender behind him. He's a striker, it's where he was so good for us last season, and it's where he needs to play this season.

I would bench Ings, and play Watkins up front with Buendia and Coutinho in behind him now. If he's off the boil in a game, then bring on Ings to give him a go with half hour remaining.

Like I mentioned earlier he played as a striker in a 2 it’s out of possession and in transition he is deployed wide , a position he actually takes up when playing “central” anyway,  and yes I do agree it should be either Ollie or Ings preferably the later,  I think it’s bizarre that people don’t notice that we play the Christmas tree out of possession and a diamond midfield with 2 up top in possession.  And yes we did look better when we had technical players each side of a centre forward.

Edited January 16, 2022 by gwi1890

[The_Steve]

Loved this from Ollie

 

[GingerCollins29]

1 hour ago, useless said:

He did celebrate, joined in with the huddle and called over Buendia to celebrate with them as well, he also made a point of waiting for Coutinho so he could congratulate him individually.

 

Face like a slapped arse. Acting like a spoult brat at the mo

[MaVilla]

i dont dislike Watkins, he's a decent striker, he has a lot of positives to his game.

However, i dont think he suits Gerrards system, I dont think Watkins has the vision or technical ability to play close link up play with players like Coutinho and Buendia, its possible Watkins is just having a run of bad form, but i dunno, i watch him this season and he just has bricks for feet, he doesnt see good passes, he's selfish and loses the ball a lot, he just isnt technically very good in my opinion.

the "he feels threatened by Ings" thing doesnt wash with me, if you are a player at the top level who cant handle competition, then thats on you, and isnt an excuse, now im not saying this is or isnt the proposed case for his poor form, im just saying if what some people say in relation to this is true, then it shines a not very good light on his mentality within an improving club......but ye....im not saying this is the case, as tbh none of us know one way or the other, so i wont say this is or isnt the reason the his poor play/form.

In a nutshell, i just dont think he's good enough for the direction we want to go.

[a m ole]

If you want to talk about attitude problem, how about grown men thinking one of our hardest working players is some kind of spoiled brat because they don’t like his facial expressions.

Grow up you **** melts.

[nick76]

11 minutes ago, a m ole said:

If you want to talk about attitude problem, how about grown men thinking one of our hardest working players is some kind of spoiled brat because they don’t like his facial expressions.

Grow up you **** melts.

 

[a m ole]

1 minute ago, nick76 said:

 

Not as weird as calling him a spoiled brat because he doesn’t celebrate how you want him to.

get a grip.

[nick76]

2 minutes ago, a m ole said:

Not as weird as calling him a spoiled brat because he doesn’t celebrate how you want him to.

get a grip.

[a m ole]

3 minutes ago, nick76 said:

K

[GingerCollins29]

2 hours ago, a m ole said:

If you want to talk about attitude problem, how about grown men thinking one of our hardest working players is some kind of spoiled brat because they don’t like his facial expressions.

Grow up you **** melts.

Amazing how you can be so short sighted not to see there's a massive issue.

Last season is work rate was phenomenal. This season, he doesnt chase as many lost causes, prefers to go it alone rather than lay it off and has been abysmal in front of goal. You **** melt.

[a m ole]

4 minutes ago, GingerCollins29 said:

Amazing how you can be so short sighted not to see there's a massive issue.

Last season is work rate was phenomenal. This season, he doesnt chase as many lost causes, prefers to go it alone rather than lay it off and has been abysmal in front of goal. You **** melt.

The stats and Gerrard disagree with you.

[Spoony]

Calling him a ‘scapegoat’ just isn’t true. He has been woeful. Literally all he does is run and then break our or end our attacks. Any points on attitude aside, he is easily the worst player out there at the moment. I’m not sure what the reasons are but the way he plays now I wouldn’t even have him on the bench. 

[GingerCollins29]

1 hour ago, a m ole said:

The stats and Gerrard disagree with you.

The stats that say less shots, goals, assists etc per game this year than last?

Don't think SG has been asked a direct question about him either.

Do you honestly not think the difference between last year and this is enormous?

Have you not noticed his perplexing decision making, lack of first touch and poor form in front of goal??

[allani]

8 minutes ago, GingerCollins29 said:

The stats that say less shots, goals, assists etc per game this year than last?

Don't think SG has been asked a direct question about him either.

Do you honestly not think the difference between last year and this is enormous?

Have you not noticed his perplexing decision making, lack of first touch and poor form in front of goal??

I am not sure his decision making and lack of first touch are new.  But I don't know how much is lack of confidence, how much is him trying too hard (although I have to say there were a couple of times against Man Utd when he gave up on a ball quicker than he would have done last season), how much is tiredness (I mean let's be honest there aren't many strikers who will have run the number of miles he has in the last 2 seasons), how much is a grump that Ings has been playing more centrally and how much is down to defenders / opposition coaches having figured him out more (defenders tend to get much closer to him than they did last season and seem to be showing him more to the outside where he is more prone to running into a cul-de-sac.  I hope that it is one of the former because if he gets a couple of goals then maybe his general form will turn around too.  But at the moment I think he is one of those who has a question mark over his head.  Great for what we needed last year (and maybe this) but is he what we need next season?  I think he has 18 matches to answer that one way or the other.  He's not alone in being in that position - over the next two or three seasons I hope that we'll be questioning the merits of a few others who 18 months ago would have been high on our list of "must keep" players.  It is always a fine line between keeping a player too long because he was great last season / the season before and giving up on a player too soon because they have hit a bad run of form.  Like you say I don't think anyone is saying that his time is up - just that there are questions about whether this is a poor run of form or an example of someone having hit their ceiling.  Too early to call at the moment but it could be that a big decision is needed in the summer.  And to be honest given the upgrade that we've achieved with the two signings so far - I'm not sure that it is a decision that we should be scared about.  Either we'll get Ollie back to some of his form of last season or we will get a better player.  Either way, club-wise it is a win.

 

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

Meh, as always, time to roll out the generic line.

The truth is probably somewhere in between the extremes opinions on both ends of the spectrum.

Personally, I think since he's had a kid he hasn't gotten any sleep

[Shillzz]

Breaking a 6 year hiatus from VT to voice my opinion that playing with Watkins and Ings yesterday was akin to playing with 9 men. They should not play in the same team together and I wouldn’t be surprised to see Gerrard signing another striker in the next 12 months.