VillaFaninLondon Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 15 minutes ago, lexicon said: Selling Barry or Milner, arguably our best players at the time, and loaning Matt Targett, a player we've decided isn't good enough for the first team, are worlds apart. If you read it I did say that in the second line of that paragraph. But surely you must agree that sending him to Newcastle over another team in the bottom half is a bit silly if it keeps them up. The owners and Gerrard have been great so far though so got to trust their judgement I guess. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MentalM Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 2 minutes ago, VillaFaninLondon said: If you read it I did say that in the second line of that paragraph. But surely you must agree that sending him to Newcastle over another team in the bottom half is a bit silly if it keeps them up. The owners and Gerrard have been great so far though so got to trust their judgement I guess. If it secures him regulary first team football in PL the added value he gets, is probably worth it when we sell him this summer (which I assume we do). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexicon Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 22 minutes ago, VillaFaninLondon said: If you read it I did say that in the second line of that paragraph. But surely you must agree that sending him to Newcastle over another team in the bottom half is a bit silly if it keeps them up. The owners and Gerrard have been great so far though so got to trust their judgement I guess. I honestly don't care about Newcastle. We've got plenty of financial muscle too and a much more progressive and organised sporting structure behind us. I don't think Targett is going to be any sort of catalyst in their survival and if they're willing to give us a good chunk of change for his services, then I'm all for it. Newcastle are going to be a basket case for quite a bit longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samjp26 Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 1 hour ago, VillaFaninLondon said: I said from the start this was an odd move sending him there. He's not a world beater (and in fact he has put in some poor performances for us this season), but when things are going well for him he's a very dependable, solid FB. This is particularly the case when he someone very good playing in front of him like ASM (or Grealish for us). We have potentially sent him somewhere that, if he helps keeps them up, will be looking to overtake us in the league from as early as even next season and from an investment POV it's a bit strange because the owners have invested money in top players to presumably take us up the league - helping out a competitor in that regard is a bit like shooting yourself in the foot. Maybe it is my negative Villa thinking hat on from when I still have nightmares of selling our best players to City like Barry and Milner which helped them overtake us. It's not quite the same as Targett is a backup and not anywhere like a key player for us like those players were, but at least in those situations we got money for those players whereas with Targett we've probably only got a small loan fee. Would rather have sent him to a Brentford or a Crystal Palace or even a Leeds in all honesty, or told him that he needs to fight for his place, Or if we were going to let Newcastle have him, at least get around 20m for him which is at least a profit on the player we signed from Southampton and would be a fair deal for all parties. I think this is my gripe - there is no option/provision to buy for Newcastle, probably because in the summer they'll have their eyes on a better player that they'll be happy to spunk their money on. I do hope we got a decent loan fee. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laughable Chimp Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, MentalM said: If it secures him regulary first team football in PL the added value he gets, is probably worth it when we sell him this summer (which I assume we do). I don't think the added value would be much if at all tbh. If we kept him and he just became backup for the rest of the season for us, clubs aren't going to suddenly think he's shit and table low offers. They know he's only playing backup because Digne is superior. They'd be evaluating him based on his performances when he was starting for us for the past 2 and a half seasons. A loan to Newcastle isn't going to add to his value if he's playing roughtly at the same level as he did in the past 2 and a half seasons for us. If he plays terribly for them, it could even tank his value. If Targett hadn't been playing for a long while, then a loan for regular football would be good for his value because it would get rid of uncertainties about whether he could still perform. That's not the case here. There's plenty of recent information to be able to evaluate Targett already. Edit: I would actually argue further that by sending him out on loan, we've clearly communicated that we think Targett is surplus to requirements to other clubs and don't need him in the squad whatsoever. At least if we kept him as backup, we could leverage the fact that we still see him as somewhat valuable cover, even if that's not actually the case. Edited February 9, 2022 by Laughable Chimp 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich192 Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 Has it ever been leaked about the loan fee, and if there’s an option to buy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MentalM Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 57 minutes ago, Laughable Chimp said: I don't think the added value would be much if at all tbh. If we kept him and he just became backup for the rest of the season for us, clubs aren't going to suddenly think he's shit and table low offers. They know he's only playing backup because Digne is superior. They'd be evaluating him based on his performances when he was starting for us for the past 2 and a half seasons. A loan to Newcastle isn't going to add to his value if he's playing roughtly at the same level as he did in the past 2 and a half seasons for us. If he plays terribly for them, it could even tank his value. If Targett hadn't been playing for a long while, then a loan for regular football would be good for his value because it would get rid of uncertainties about whether he could still perform. That's not the case here. There's plenty of recent information to be able to evaluate Targett already. Edit: I would actually argue further that by sending him out on loan, we've clearly communicated that we think Targett is surplus to requirements to other clubs and don't need him in the squad whatsoever. At least if we kept him as backup, we could leverage the fact that we still see him as somewhat valuable cover, even if that's not actually the case. I think we communicate that he is surplus to requirements if he doesnt play either? with his first half of the season + half a season without many minutes I dont see any sale value would be higher than £10-12. If he plays for Newcastle and does the job, that could be £15-20. Also add in the loan fee and wages saved and I would say its good business based on what the player also wanted himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaFaninLondon Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 9 minutes ago, MentalM said: I think we communicate that he is surplus to requirements if he doesnt play either? with his first half of the season + half a season without many minutes I dont see any sale value would be higher than £10-12. If he plays for Newcastle and does the job, that could be £15-20. Also add in the loan fee and wages saved and I would say its good business based on what the player also wanted himself. We spent 11.5m + 2.5m in add ons on Targett based on half a good season in the Champ with Fulham as he never played at Southampton and was always behind Bertrand. Even if he didn't play in the 2nd half of season for us, we'd get at least what we paid back for him for sure because he's a much more proven PL player now than he was when we bought him and in fact I'd expect 15m+ even if he didn't play again this season. If he does well for Newcastle we might get marginally more money but it's not enough of a reason to send him to a team with their wealth and threat to us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaFaninLondon Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 1 hour ago, lexicon said: I honestly don't care about Newcastle. We've got plenty of financial muscle too and a much more progressive and organised sporting structure behind us. I don't think Targett is going to be any sort of catalyst in their survival and if they're willing to give us a good chunk of change for his services, then I'm all for it. Newcastle are going to be a basket case for quite a bit longer. I don't care about them either but it's patently clear they are another team to contend with in future and if they were to get relegated at least it delays their rise by at least another year. Targett may not be in our plans but he's still miles better than any of their LBs and therefore we've inadvertently helped them stay up if it happens (still hoping it won't but looking more and more likely it will given their recent results). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KAZZAM Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 Newky got ripped of all over in the Jan window and overspent on pretty much every player. I'll be furious if we just let Targett go just to keep him happy and get him playing without getting our fill from the Newcastle money train. I mean he was getting his medical done without fees agreed and last minute so we should've had all the leverage. Loan fee must be huge if we didn't insist on a mandatory buy option otherwise its a shambles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laughable Chimp Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 17 minutes ago, VillaFaninLondon said: We spent 11.5m + 2.5m in add ons on Targett based on half a good season in the Champ with Fulham as he never played at Southampton and was always behind Bertrand. Even if he didn't play in the 2nd half of season for us, we'd get at least what we paid back for him for sure because he's a much more proven PL player now than he was when we bought him and in fact I'd expect 15m+ even if he didn't play again this season. If he does well for Newcastle we might get marginally more money but it's not enough of a reason to send him to a team with their wealth and threat to us. I think we should be able to get 20m for Targett but if we really wanted to move him on this summer, I think we would take 15 or a bit less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrBlack Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 If he wasn't such a clear upgrade on their existing full back I'd have been fine with the deal. But significantly improving that side of their defence, fully unleashes their best player to carry them to safety. It may seem insignificant on the face of it to loan them an average full back, but it really will keep them up. Shame we couldn't find someone else to take him if he was so desperate to leave for first team football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete101 Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 See a lot of " I don't blame Targett for choosing to play premier League football" , if he can justify taking dirty money for that end goal, then maybe he wasn't the great guy I always thought he was Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulMcGrath_5 Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 3 minutes ago, pete101 said: See a lot of " I don't blame Targett for choosing to play premier League football" , if he can justify taking dirty money for that end goal, then maybe he wasn't the great guy I always thought he was I've heard he eats meat too!! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Silvers Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 19 minutes ago, PaulMcGrath_5 said: I've heard he eats meat too!! Oh, the outrage. I'd love to be a fly on the wall of some of this high and mighty do-gooders, bet there's tons of rope. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 I'm pleased that he has got well received, at Newcastle, and shows our set up to be ok. We can't keep looking over our shoulder, ex players have been good to us, and us good to them. We have to move on, and that is part and parcel of the progress. best of luck Matt. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 33 minutes ago, TRO said: I'm pleased that he has got well received, at Newcastle, and shows our set up to be ok. We can't keep looking over our shoulder, ex players have been good to us, and us good to them. We have to move on, and that is part and parcel of the progress. best of luck Matt. He gave us two and a half years, performed very well and will be sold on for a profit. We need more players like that over the coming years. We need to be able to sell players when we move beyond them. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkyvilla Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 1 hour ago, pete101 said: See a lot of " I don't blame Targett for choosing to play premier League football" , if he can justify taking dirty money for that end goal, then maybe he wasn't the great guy I always thought he was Surely it's Villa that took the dirty money? Targett I assume is still paid by us. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 8 hours ago, Demitri_C said: Does there need to be a reason to rewatch a game on youtube? Villa getting battered? Just a weird thing to watch back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
messi11 Posted February 9, 2022 Share Posted February 9, 2022 Please Comeback 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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