Wesley Moraes

[useless]

'Keep right on' is probably not the best thing to say on this forum, it's the slogan of local rivals birmingham city or small heath alliance as they're often referred to. With Wesley some rate some don't and some are somewhere in between, I don't think anyone is going to change anyone's mind via a few sentences on here, all we can do is hope that he improves along with the whole team.

[It's Your Round]

13 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said:

I would really prefer it if you actually add the context of what was said if you are gonna try and be a smart ass. It was literally just covered on this forum. 

If point scoring is your game, keep right on. 

Blue nose confirmed!! 

[KentVillan]

1 hour ago, KenjiOgiwara said:

Definitely. It's likely the choice Deano makes that secures us relegation, but he's the manager. 

I disagree with this. Whether Wesley is a dud or not, I think we're going to stay up regardless. Our fixture list is a touch easier in the second half of the season, and all of our players will improve as this squad gels.

We've played Man City away, Man Utd away, Arsenal away, Spurs away, Chelsea away. We still have loads of winnable home fixtures left to play - Norwich, Southampton, Watford, Sheffield Utd, Palace - and our home form is good enough to pick up points from the big boys, as well.

I really don't think Wesley will be the cause of us getting relegated. My bigger worry is a season-ending injury to Grealish or Mings.

I do accept the argument that with a better striker we would be higher up the table, but I'm not sure who that striker would have been. People saying Maupay would be tearing up trees with the service he'd get at Villa are massively underestimating Brighton.

[KenjiOgiwara]

1 minute ago, KentVillan said:

I disagree with this. Whether Wesley is a dud or not, I think we're going to stay up regardless.

You might be right, and I was probably a bit too negative. We're a good team and we've had some tough fixtures. But I think without a senior striker to carry his bit, I think we will be fighting the relegation all season. With a half capable striker I don't think we would. 

[Zatman]

38 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said:

I would really prefer it if you actually add the context of what was said if you are gonna try and be a smart ass. It was literally just covered on this forum. 

If point scoring is your game, keep right on. 

Not point scoring, just a view of your scouting talent 

[villalad21]

To sum up all the excuses so far:

- He doesn't get any service (Despite we are one of the highest goal scorers in the league)

- He's young and will get better. (Yet he is arguably worse now compared to his first 2 games)

- He really is a false 9 ( 1 assist in 15 games, impressive for a false 9)

- He and his family haven't settled

Will be interesting to follow this thread in the future and see the rest of the excuses unfold.

IMO Wesley simply isn't a very good footballer and i don't see a lot room for improvement, well i do because Wesley doesn't really excel at anything. But that's like saying Andre Green is young and even though he's bang average at every single attribute there is plenty room for improvement!

[KenjiOgiwara]

53 minutes ago, Zatman said:

Not point scoring, just a view of your scouting talent 

Not sure you understand what the word scouting or context actually means. 

[Vive_La_Villa]

Bit OTT to say he isn’t even a footballer but I guess it’s just exaggerating for effect

 After the Leicester game he has a run of games where I think he will have a big part to play in occupying defenders in very winnable games. Yes it’s the least a striker should do and we need goals from him blah blah blah but let’s face it there is no alternative.  So instead of posting the same crap over and over again about how shit he is how about we just get behind him for a few weeks a least. 

I think we clearly know which VT’s do not rate the lad one bit and I respect that.  I just don’t get the need for them to have to keep telling everyone over and over.

[Tomaszk]

2 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

After the Leicester game he has a run of games where I think he will have a big part to play in occupying defenders in very winnable games. Yes it’s the least a striker should do and we need goals from him blah blah blah but let’s face it there is no alternative.  So instead of posting the same crap over and over again about how shit he is how about we just get behind him for a few weeks a least.

He gets plenty of support at games. As long as he keeps working hard, that will remain the same thankfully.

[Kiwivillan]

4 hours ago, Zatman said:

I think a lot of people are missing the human aspect for Wesley too. He has a young family and none of them probably spoke English when he joined. So they are also adapting to a new country, school etc and its really not easy sometimes to move abroad and play your best.

Look at trouble JPA had with his family 

Pretty sure they are all still in Brazil? This concerned me when he signed

[Kiwivillan]

1 hour ago, KenjiOgiwara said:

You might be right, and I was probably a bit too negative. We're a good team and we've had some tough fixtures. But I think without a senior striker to carry his bit, I think we will be fighting the relegation all season. With a half capable striker I don't think we would. 

Why are you completely ignoring the fact we've played 6 of last season's top 7 away? We're 6th in the table for points at home. Relegation is a stretch considering the fixtures gone.

Also besides us only Man City and Liverpool have 5 players with 3 or more goals. That's the way Smith operates with goals shared around and Wesley, who didn't have amazing goal scoring record in Belgium, is a piece of his puzzle

Edited December 7, 2019 by Kiwivillan

[KenjiOgiwara]

51 minutes ago, Kiwivillan said:

Why are you completely ignoring the fact we've played 6 of last season's top 7 away? We're 6th in the table for points at home. Relegation is a stretch considering the fixtures gone.

Also besides us only Man City and Liverpool have 5 players with 3 or more goals. That's the way Smith operates with goals shared around and Wesley, who didn't have amazing goal scoring record in Belgium, is a piece of his puzzle

You are literally quoting me where I write we've had some tough fixtures. I am not ignoring it. It's obviously a factor that reflects our over all points and league table. Problem is that we've played a fair bunch of teams we will be competing for survival with and Wesley haven't been good against them either. He had a couple of tap ins against Norwich, then missed a penalty. 

I don't really have an issue with Wesleys goal tally. I am happy if he picks up 10-12 goals. It's his overall play that's the problem. We could stick any half capable striker up front and with our midfield they will get some goals, but the question is how their overall performance will assist the team in our attacking play. This is where he's shown not to cut it. It's not about goals alone. 

I hate to loosely use the word fact, but the fact is that if Keinan Davis had performed like Wesley the same people defending Wesley on here would be calling for his replacement to be brought in. 

[TRO]

10 hours ago, Kiwivillan said:

He played well against Man U and we got a result at OT. 4 of the other previous 6 were away to City Wolves and Chelsea and home to Liverpool  all top 7 teams last season. What are people expecting?

I think there is a confusion here and 2 lines of thought are being crossed

• He is not scoring regularly enough
• He is not even showing the basics is some games.....not heading the ball or holding it up etc.

The first one is accepted to a degree due to the  new country, new league, new colleagues etc.

The second one harbours more concern.....I am not writing him off, yet......but I do have concerns and yes staying in this league is the main one.

Edited December 7, 2019 by TRO

[Laughable Chimp]

3 hours ago, AVTuco said:

Could you copy the current list here mate?

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/premier-league/torschuetzenliste/wettbewerb/GB1/plus/1?saison_id=2019&detailpos=14&altersklasse=alle

Click on the minutes per goal column to sort the players in terms of minutes per goal.

Edited December 7, 2019 by Laughable Chimp

[TRO]

1 hour ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

Bit OTT to say he isn’t even a footballer but I guess it’s just exaggerating for effect

 After the Leicester game he has a run of games where I think he will have a big part to play in occupying defenders in very winnable games. Yes it’s the least a striker should do and we need goals from him blah blah blah but let’s face it there is no alternative.  So instead of posting the same crap over and over again about how shit he is how about we just get behind him for a few weeks a least. 

I think we clearly know which VT’s do not rate the lad one bit and I respect that.  I just don’t get the need for them to have to keep telling everyone over and over.

I think its more like folk are frustrated with him.

We have to get behind him in the ground.....I think everyone does and will continue to do, he doesn't pick himself.

as for the same old crap....a fair bit of it ,is true, so its hard to wax lyrical about him, when his performances don't warrant it.....now that would be posting crap.

Its a forum, where we should be able to share our unadulterated thoughts on all things Villa.

[Vive_La_Villa]

42 minutes ago, TRO said:

I think its more like folk are frustrated with him.

We have to get behind him in the ground.....I think everyone does and will continue to do, he doesn't pick himself.

as for the same old crap....a fair bit of it ,is true, so its hard to wax lyrical about him, when his performances don't warrant it.....now that would be posting crap.

Its a forum, where we should be able to share our unadulterated thoughts on all things Villa.

Dont see the need for repetitive posts of how crap he is but that’s just my opinion.  I’m not saying people shouldn’t post their thoughts on him. Just don’t get why the same thing has to be said over and over in between every game by the same people. Feels like it becomes posting for a reaction. 

Sorry mate. I should probably just ignore the thread. 

[TRO]

34 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

Dont see the need for repetitive posts of how crap he is but that’s just my opinion.  I’m not saying people shouldn’t post their thoughts on him. Just don’t get why the same thing has to be said over and over in between every game by the same people. Feels like it becomes posting for a reaction. 

Sorry mate. I should probably just ignore the thread. 

I think its just posters reacting to other posters posts and creating interaction.....but the same as you, just my opinion.

Personally, I really enjoy different opinions....It makes me, re-examine mine.

I post with a conviction in my point, but if others have a stronger argument and I see it, I have no problem agreeing.

Hey Ho .....Everton beating Chelsea 2-0 another good scoreline for us......not.

I think Chelsea, was really up for our visit.

Edited December 7, 2019 by TRO

[Laughable Chimp]

Starting to think Dean needs to think of a new approach for more difficult games. It seems to work well against teams weaker than us or teams on our level, but when we're going up against bigger teams we seem to falter at a higher rate than other teams around us.

 

Edited December 7, 2019 by Laughable Chimp

[TRO]

10 minutes ago, Laughable Chimp said:

Starting to think Dean needs to think of a new approach for more difficult games. It seems to work well against teams weaker than us or teams on our level, but when we're going up against bigger teams we seem to falter at a higher rate than other teams around us.

I agree.

The thinking needs to be deeper......less of a format and more specific to games and opponents.

We played Chelsea on the back of 2 defeats and they are on their way to another one......Frank got in to them and asked for more aggression and he got it.....yes they are technically better than us, but the defining factor was, they showed more aggression in getting the ball.

We show more aggression at Home than away, we have players who respond to the crowd, its not intrinsic aggression like Andy Gray had other players from the past.

Dean, Imo needs to get some in, they have to be able to play too, its not single dimensional.

for example......When he was available, we should have gone for Danny Ings.....that's the type of player with that character and will to win and force issues, that we need.

I really hope we can stay up, ability wise I think we can.....its the character and application that bothers me.

It's  interesting how managers target Jack.....I wonder if Dean will target Vardy?

Edited December 7, 2019 by TRO

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

25 minutes ago, TRO said:

I agree.

The thinking needs to be deeper......less of a format and more specific to games and opponents.

We played Chelsea on the back of 2 defeats and they are on their way to another one......Frank got in to them and asked for more aggression and he got it.....yes they are technically better than us, but the defining factor was, they showed more aggression in getting the ball.

We show more aggression at Home than away, we have players who respond to the crowd, its not intrinsic aggression like Andy Gray had other players from the past.

Dean, Imo needs to get some in, they have to be able to play too, its not single dimensional.

for example......When he was available, we should have gone for Danny Ings.....that's the type of player with that character and will to win and force issues, that we need.

I really hope we can stay up, ability wise I think we can.....its the character and application that bothers me.

It's  interesting how managers target Jack.....I wonder if Dean will target Vardy?

Indeed, someone tried to tell me we were "outclassed". I said no, we weren't we were just turd and impotent, no aggression, urgency or ball retention. Told them it was also possible to perform well and eventually be outclassed (Like at Liverpool for example), but that Chelsea performance was not that!