PaulC Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 3 hours ago, Zatman said: This is the main issue, Liverpool will win the title and the fans will go to the stadium or have a party somewhere. Knowing that idiot Klopp he will need be centre of attention somewhere so probably will need some fan event The idiot isn’t that stupid. If the reported deaths are 70/80% understated then we are a long way off any football anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 3 hours ago, villa4europe said: I think it would encourage people to start playing again Last year I was playing 3 times a week with different sized groups, that's me meeting up with 37 different people, now I'm down to training on a Wednesday with 19 other people You can watch the Premier league of TV but none of you are allowed to meet up and play, including kids... Because they're more controlled than we would be? Doesn't work The only way it can be done is if the lockdown ends, the pubs reopen, it's then mid summer... Look at the last world cup with that weather... There'd be huge gatherings for it Sad indictment on the British public if they did that. Are we just sheep? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 4 minutes ago, PaulC said: Sad indictment on the British public if they did that. Are we just sheep? Its not sheep Its what's good for the goose is good for the gander There will be no gentle relaxation of the lockdown, you can't have football on the TV whilst trying to tell millions of people going insane at home that they can't go to the park and play football, why is it safe for some but dangerous for others? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, villa4europe said: Its not sheep Its what's good for the goose is good for the gander There will be no gentle relaxation of the lockdown, you can't have football on the TV whilst trying to tell millions of people going insane at home that they can't go to the park and play football, why is it safe for some but dangerous for others? Fair enough. I can’t see football restarting next season then. There’s going to be a gentle relaxing of the messures when the numbers of new cases and deaths go down to an acceptable level but full on relaxing of measure whereby mass garherings of people are allowed in stadiums is a long long way off Edited April 10, 2020 by PaulC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutByEaster? Posted April 10, 2020 Moderator Share Posted April 10, 2020 Norwich have signed Danel Sinani, a 23 year old striker on a three year contract. Their non-playing staff are currently being paid by the taxpayer - that can't be right surely? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KentVillan Posted April 11, 2020 Share Posted April 11, 2020 Assuming the season isn't finished (can't see it happening) then the key question with relegation is who the Premier League are most worried about upsetting. Bournemouth Villa Norwich Leeds West Brom Fulham / Brentford / etc. EFL FA UEFA FIFA Politicians Sponsors & other commercial partners The Big 6 clubs My sense is that letting down the Championship play-off contenders is an easy sell, since promotion from those places is a long shot to begin with. So let's assume it's only Leeds and West Brom in contention for promotion. So Bournemouth are probably off the hook - lucky for them, because I doubt the PL have any great love of such a small club being a perennial fixture in the league. Now your question is do you want Villa+Norwich or Leeds+West Brom in the PL? This is a bit trickier. We're traditionally the biggest club of the four, but Leeds aren't far behind if we're honest, and you could argue West Brom are a bigger club than Norwich. But whereas Villa and Norwich will be well placed to sue the Premier League if we get relegated without completing the season, I imagine Leeds and West Brom will be on much shakier ground. So that favours Villa and Norwich surviving. The EFL will get treated however the PL want to treat them. There will be zero sympathy. It will be hardnosed business decision. Ultimately, the EFL can't block anything the PL decides to do, so I can't see them being particularly influential over what happens. The FA, UEFA, FIFA will make loud noises in the media but doubt they'll have any bearing on proceedings. Politicians will be an interesting one, because you'll surely have MPs in West Mids, Norwich, Leeds all making a very strong case for their respective clubs to be given special treatment. Sponsors and other commercial partners just want as many games as possible involving popular clubs - especially clubs like Villa and Leeds. So IMO that leads you towards Bournemouth, Villa and Norwich all surviving, with Leeds and West Brom being promoted to a 22-club season for 2020-21. I just don't see how the EFL can block this, and really they'd be the only big losers from it. (You might say - but wait, the Big 6 clubs will block this because they won't want the extra fixtures... but given the loss of revenue caused by Coronavirus, they would probably be quite keen to have an extra two games to play against two pretty big clubs.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutByEaster? Posted April 11, 2020 Moderator Share Posted April 11, 2020 I think results and promotion and relegation are secondary concerns to the Premier League at the moment - everything falls a distant second to making sure they get that TV money. It's not the results that are important to them, it's the product - games that can be screened. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KentVillan Posted April 11, 2020 Share Posted April 11, 2020 6 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said: I think results and promotion and relegation are secondary concerns to the Premier League at the moment - everything falls a distant second to making sure they get that TV money. It's not the results that are important to them, it's the product - games that can be screened. Exactly my point. A 22-club season makes perfect sense commercially, and if the EFL lose out, the PL won't lose any sleep over that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutByEaster? Posted April 11, 2020 Moderator Share Posted April 11, 2020 1 minute ago, KentVillan said: Exactly my point. A 22-club season makes perfect sense commercially, and if the EFL lose out, the PL won't lose any sleep over that. I sort of agree - but I think you can take your whole list over the page and just replace it with - "They don't care who they upset, they just want the TV money". 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KentVillan Posted April 11, 2020 Share Posted April 11, 2020 1 minute ago, OutByEaster? said: I sort of agree - but I think you can take your whole list over the page and just replace it with - "They don't care who they upset, they just want the TV money". Got you, but the TV money thing does depend on which clubs are vying for promotion / relegation, so the PL will be thinking about how to manage this, and they will want to come up with some bullshit "fairness" justification for whatever they do. if the relegation places were filled by teams like Huddersfield, Burnley, etc then no doubt they would just bin the 3 teams in the relegation zone. Villa (especially) and Norwich are the kinds of clubs the PL want in the league. Big fanbases, play open attacking football. Keep Villa, allow Leeds and West Brom up... you're setting up 2 Yorkshire derbies and 6 West Mids derbies. It all points towards that outcome IMO, especially as we would have the cash to mount a massive legal challenge against relegation, which would be a much bigger headache for the league than having to apologise to the EFL for ruining their product. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutByEaster? Posted April 11, 2020 Moderator Share Posted April 11, 2020 11 minutes ago, KentVillan said: Got you, but the TV money thing does depend on which clubs are vying for promotion / relegation, so the PL will be thinking about how to manage this, and they will want to come up with some bullshit "fairness" justification for whatever they do. if the relegation places were filled by teams like Huddersfield, Burnley, etc then no doubt they would just bin the 3 teams in the relegation zone. Villa (especially) and Norwich are the kinds of clubs the PL want in the league. Big fanbases, play open attacking football. Keep Villa, allow Leeds and West Brom up... you're setting up 2 Yorkshire derbies and 6 West Mids derbies. It all points towards that outcome IMO, especially as we would have the cash to mount a massive legal challenge against relegation, which would be a much bigger headache for the league than having to apologise to the EFL for ruining their product. You're right I think in that broadcasters will have preferences on the teams they'd like to show - Leeds vs Villa might get you better ratings than Hull vs Bournemouth - but for the most part, they're not interested in showing those games anyway, and the TV money is negotiated as a collective - better teams give better value to broadcasters but not more income for the League. For the league it's largely an irrelevance - I don't think they're looking any further than the current contracted tranche of money - I think they know they're contracted to play x amount of games to get that money and I think they'll find a way to play them - I think what those games look like, how they're played, who takes part and who that upsets is secondary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enda Posted April 11, 2020 Author Share Posted April 11, 2020 1 hour ago, KentVillan said: Got you, but the TV money thing does depend on which clubs are vying for promotion / relegation, so the PL will be thinking about how to manage this, and they will want to come up with some bullshit "fairness" justification for whatever they do. if the relegation places were filled by teams like Huddersfield, Burnley, etc then no doubt they would just bin the 3 teams in the relegation zone. Villa (especially) and Norwich are the kinds of clubs the PL want in the league. Big fanbases, play open attacking football. Keep Villa, allow Leeds and West Brom up... you're setting up 2 Yorkshire derbies and 6 West Mids derbies. It all points towards that outcome IMO, especially as we would have the cash to mount a massive legal challenge against relegation, which would be a much bigger headache for the league than having to apologise to the EFL for ruining their product. I’m not sure this is true. The Premier League, as a corporate entity, are its twenty members. I don’t think Everton and Man City really care that much about Villa versus Huddersfield fighting it out for seventeenth place. Care much more about 20 teams versus 22 imho. One thing that I see happening is the Conservative government passing legislation to give the PL immunity from torts about all this. That would mean Boris and co would pick whatever suits them the most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_gary_cahill Posted April 11, 2020 Share Posted April 11, 2020 2 hours ago, OutByEaster? said: I think results and promotion and relegation are secondary concerns to the Premier League at the moment - everything falls a distant second to making sure they get that TV money. It's not the results that are important to them, it's the product - games that can be screened. I think you are right but that’s not the way it should be 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted April 11, 2020 Share Posted April 11, 2020 Latest news saying lockdown to remain till the end of May, and from that point they will start opening stuff up in reverse order, schools first etc. It also says that potential poverty impact from the economy being in lockdown could end up creating more deaths than were currently saving. It seems given most information that it is very likely the season will be finished behind closed doors, starting some time in June. Unless this lasted till start of August, a voiding of the season is looking highly unlikely. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morley_crosses_to_Withe Posted April 11, 2020 Share Posted April 11, 2020 For anyone from a legal background: If the PL were to declare the seasons as finished and the table as final then what would our legal challenge be? On what grounds would a legal challenge be raised/would any challenge be supported by current law? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted April 11, 2020 Share Posted April 11, 2020 25 minutes ago, Morley_crosses_to_Withe said: For anyone from a legal background: If the PL were to declare the seasons as finished and the table as final then what would our legal challenge be? On what grounds would a legal challenge be raised/would any challenge be supported by current law? Our home game in hand certainly be the biggest challenge, then even then the fact not every team has played each other twice 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattyvilla Posted April 11, 2020 Share Posted April 11, 2020 i actually think for me it becomes less important as time goes on , i just want to be back at villa park with these horrible times behind us. Which division we are in is totally unimportant to me now , they should end the season then make the decisions that need to be made. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedClaretAndBlue Posted April 11, 2020 Share Posted April 11, 2020 No one life is worth risking over any game of football. Read in the telegraph about people in South Korea beating covid and have tested positive again which is pretty damn worrying. The season has to be voided; wouldnt surprise me if next season couldnt even begin either. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted April 11, 2020 Share Posted April 11, 2020 The legal challenge wording would depend on the wording of the membership / contract whatever it is we have with the PL, it would have to be a contract breach If for example it says "if at the end of the season your club is in the relegation zone then you will relegated to the EFL" At the front of the contract there will be a definition of the terms relegation zone, relegated, EFL and most importantly a definition of the word season, of that definition is 38 games play other twice then relegation after 29 games would be a breach of contract Its not talked about but I'm surprised there isn't a clause for suspension and termination, not necessarily for deadly viruses but for war, you would then apply the theory of that clause to this scenario Not sure why one of the big media outlets hasn't obtained a PL contract via their magical sources and employed their own legal team to explain it 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted April 11, 2020 Share Posted April 11, 2020 5 minutes ago, villa4europe said: The legal challenge wording would depend on the wording of the membership / contract whatever it is we have with the PL, it would have to be a contract breach If for example it says "if at the end of the season your club is in the relegation zone then you will relegated to the EFL" At the front of the contract there will be a definition of the terms relegation zone, relegated, EFL and most importantly a definition of the word season, of that definition is 38 games play other twice then relegation after 29 games would be a breach of contract Its not talked about but I'm surprised there isn't a clause for suspension and termination, not necessarily for deadly viruses but for war, you would then apply the theory of that clause to this scenario Not sure why one of the big media outlets hasn't obtained a PL contract via their magical sources and employed their own legal team to explain it Allegedly mainly Liverpool fans/legal experts, the league table can be final after 75 percent of games. Our game in hand means we are just below 75 percent 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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