Genie Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 36 minutes ago, Jon said: Pales in comparison with how many innocent Muslim children the various western governments (of which we have been very prominent) have killed with scant regard or justification over the past X years. Yes, it's evil. But so have been the actions of our governments, which have caused the death of tens of thousands of innocent Muslim children. That's partial 'justification'. They see it as a war, and this is retribution. It's an unspeakably vile, horrific act, but the perpetrator is not 'cowardly' in the way that say a Bush or Blair kill millions but don't get their hands dirty. This person sacrificed themself. I thought about a similar post but couldn't word it correctly. Just the other week the US killed 300 civilians in 1 day. It answers the question I keep reading "how could someone do this"?. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post markavfc40 Posted May 23, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted May 23, 2017 22 minutes ago, mjmooney said: I was considering posting something like this, but decided it would bring down the inevitable shower of outrage. This is appalling, but the idea that 'we are the good guys' and 'they' are the monsters is part of the problem. Bear in mind that 'they' see it the other way round. This mindset on both sides has us all locked into an apparently unbreakable cycle of horror. It is just a vicious circle isn’t it. I think one of the issues is that when something happens on our shores, or in other European Cities, or America, then we feel more connected to it. Certainly in the case of this attack it really hurts us all. We will all be talking about it at work, on social media. It gets to us emotionally. When people are getting bombed in Syria, many of them children, we aren’t as connected. We listen to or watch the report and some think that is a shame and then switch off from it. There will be many in this country now thinking we need to go at ISIS hard and if innocent people are killed in the process then so be it, turn a blind eye, that it is collateral damage. I don’t know what the answer is but seeing/valuing one life as any more important than another is a way of thinking we need to stop. See these nuts jobs for what they are. Nut jobs hiding behind the name of religion. By bombing innocent people you just create more of these nuts jobs, build up more anger and for me lose the moral high ground and just ensure the vicious circle continues. 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wainy316 Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 Man, it probably shouldn't but it just hits so much harder when it's somewhere you've lived or spent a lot of time in. Devastating and I'm sure it won't be there will be more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wainy316 Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 36 minutes ago, mjmooney said: I was considering posting something like this, but decided it would bring down the inevitable shower of outrage. This is appalling, but the idea that 'we are the good guys' and 'they' are the monsters is part of the problem. Bear in mind that 'they' see it the other way round. This mindset on both sides has us all locked into an apparently unbreakable cycle of horror. We are the good guys though. As are the Middle Eastern civilians getting bombed every day. We should not carry the burden of our politicians despicable decisions. Let Blair and Al Baghdadi fight each other one on one. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villaglint Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 Humanity is a such a complex thing. The brain is one of the most astonishing objects I've ever learned about, our progress and civilisation still boggles my mind. But there is still so much of the animal in us. At times there is no benefit in trying to rationalise this or that but just look upon man and weep. In terms of the how do we stop/defend/prevent this type comments. It's such a long battle but if we all raise our kids not to blindly believe in sky fairies that would be a reasonable start. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post TrentVilla Posted May 23, 2017 Moderator Popular Post Share Posted May 23, 2017 21 minutes ago, Genie said: I thought about a similar post but couldn't word it correctly. Just the other week the US killed 300 civilians in 1 day. It answers the question I keep reading "how could someone do this"?. It still doesn't answer it to me I'm afraid. I get the above, that to some extent it's motivated by or self justified by the actions of the West. However the docterine of ISIS doesn't actually require that justification, justification is provided by the call to kill the non believer as shown by the slaughter of fellow muslims from different sects. I still though don't understand the self justification. No matter how many of hele attacks happen in the West I could never justify taking the lives of other innocent people in revenge. The vey idea is just so abhorrent it is alien to me. So while I understand the point people make about vengeance it doesn't in any way answer the question of how someone could do it. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Awol Posted May 23, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted May 23, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, Jon said: It's an unspeakably vile, horrific act, but the perpetrator is not 'cowardly' in the way that say a Bush or Blair kill millions but don't get their hands dirty. This person sacrificed themself. There are parents still trying to find their children right now and you post this? Well done, that's the most disgraceful thing I've ever read on this forum - and it's a low bar. Edited May 23, 2017 by Awol 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 Apparently, this is one of those who died. **** **** heartbreaking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 Got to switch off from this all for a bit. Too upsetting. Just makes me think of my niece, who is a lot like that girl above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 25 minutes ago, TrentVilla said: It still doesn't answer it to me I'm afraid. I get the above, that to some extent it's motivated by or self justified by the actions of the West. However the docterine of ISIS doesn't actually require that justification, justification is provided by the call to kill the non believer as shown by the slaughter of fellow muslims from different sects. I still though don't understand the self justification. No matter how many of hele attacks happen in the West I could never justify taking the lives of other innocent people in revenge. The vey idea is just so abhorrent it is alien to me. So while I understand the point people make about vengeance it doesn't in any way answer the question of how someone could do it. You're looking at this through your own eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
This Could Be Rotterdam Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 http://www.itv.com/news/calendar/2017-05-23/daughter-appeals-to-find-parents-missing-after-manchester-terror-attack/ Quote A York College student has written an appeal on Facebook to help find her parents who have gone missing after the Manchester terror attack. It isnt just parents searching for their children, its kids looking for their parents. That girl must feel so lost. Some of the comments on this topic have been ill judged to say the least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 1 hour ago, Jon said: Why not? Because it's crass, insensitive and not worthy of you to be honest. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 2 hours ago, PompeyVillan said: I should imagine to create a bomb capable of such destruction it would have taken some collusion. Training in Syria? These things don't really happen in a total vacuum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 43 minutes ago, TrentVilla said: It still doesn't answer it to me I'm afraid. I get the above, that to some extent it's motivated by or self justified by the actions of the West. However the docterine of ISIS doesn't actually require that justification, justification is provided by the call to kill the non believer as shown by the slaughter of fellow muslims from different sects. I still though don't understand the self justification. No matter how many of hele attacks happen in the West I could never justify taking the lives of other innocent people in revenge. The vey idea is just so abhorrent it is alien to me. So while I understand the point people make about vengeance it doesn't in any way answer the question of how someone could do it. and its not the time to make comparisons. My thoughts are with the victims and their families right now. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Dr_Pangloss Posted May 23, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted May 23, 2017 1 hour ago, Jon said: Pales in comparison with how many innocent Muslim children the various western governments (of which we have been very prominent) have killed with scant regard or justification over the past X years. Yes, it's evil. But so have been the actions of our governments, which have caused the death of tens of thousands of innocent Muslim children. That's partial 'justification'. They see it as a war, and this is retribution. It's an unspeakably vile, horrific act, but the perpetrator is not 'cowardly' in the way that say a Bush or Blair kill millions but don't get their hands dirty. This person sacrificed themself. It's thinking like this that turns me off from associating with the modern left. It's a callous, disrespectful and pathetic attempt at grandstanding. 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meregreen Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 Oh please give it a rest mate. It's **** all to do with the left. Making political capital about horrors like this makes me sick. I'm a member of the Labour Party and find these acts of insanity quite appalling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 6 minutes ago, meregreen said: Oh please give it a rest mate. It's **** all to do with the left. Making political capital about horrors like this makes me sick. I'm a member of the Labour Party and find these acts of insanity quite appalling. I agree, not sure why people feel the need to characterise people into brackets because they have an opinion. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meregreen Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, Jon said: Pales in comparison with how many innocent Muslim children the various western governments (of which we have been very prominent) have killed with scant regard or justification over the past X years. Yes, it's evil. But so have been the actions of our governments, which have caused the death of tens of thousands of innocent Muslim children. That's partial 'justification'. They see it as a war, and this is retribution. It's an unspeakably vile, horrific act, but the perpetrator is not 'cowardly' in the way that say a Bush or Blair kill millions but don't get their hands dirty. This person sacrificed themself. They most certainly are "cowardly" . This person killed themself, and murdered innocent children while doing it. That is not " sacrifice" by my definition. Edited May 23, 2017 by meregreen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Demitri_C Posted May 23, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted May 23, 2017 I just hope if the person responsible is of a Muslim culture, they don't promote him as Muslim. He would be a terrorist nothing else. This is the thing that I don't like. Muslims are people too, They should not be tarnished by these kind of acts of brutality. Seeing all the feeds on Facebook from worried relatives, god its heart breaking. Its hard not to feel emotional for these poor people. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dAVe80 Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 (edited) Listening to the radio this morning, and hearing stories from some of the people who were there. It was pretty hard to concentrate on driving. Had to have a little moment, when I got parked up at work. So terribly sad. Edited May 23, 2017 by dAVe80 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts