Steve Bruce

[HeyAnty]

3 hours ago, terrytini said:

That really amounts to no more than him not doing the things some people think he should do when they think he should do them. I dont see how him making different choices to those some would prefer means he has “ no tactical brain whatsoever”.

There are two things to that. 

Some People : I think its about 90% of people. 

Making different choices:  My biggest gripe with Bruce is he doesn't make the choices, or at least to its to late and when he does they are head scratching. 

[srsmithusa]

3 hours ago, terrytini said:

Oh I can’t stand some of his decisions, some of his selections, and for the life of me I don’t know why he delays subs so long.

Its just I don’t think that means he doesn’t know what he’s doing tactically, just that I don’t like it.

As for the rest, I agree, except I don’t share your worry, it’s all part of the game.

Terry, I don't like them either.  They are frequently baffling to me, to you, and to many observers.  Cogent and clear arguments can be made that they appear to be tactically naive.  So it's  1) we don't like them   AND its 2) they often don't seem to be carefully considered  AND 3) they are rarely effective at turning a match around.  When was the last time Bruce (or anyone else) put on 5 strikers and it worked?  He missed his target, 2 years in a row.  So his decisions, selections and tactics are much more than just disliked by a few fans.  They are ineffective.  There is the subjective argument that I don't like it, and it doesn't make sense to me.  But there is also the objective.  We'll be playing in the championship next year.

[bannedfromHandV]

5 minutes ago, HeyAnty said:

There are two things to that. 

Some People : I think its about 90% of people. 

Making different choices:  My biggest gripe with Bruce is he doesn't make the choices, or at least to its to late and when he does they are head scratching. 

Funny that, didn't hear too much of it from the 38,000 at Wembley pre-game.

I think people often mistake VT and the actual villa fan base as being one and the same thing.

[MessiWillSignForVilla]

1 hour ago, bannedfromHandV said:

Funny that, didn't hear too much of it from the 38,000 at Wembley pre-game.

I think people often mistake VT and the actual villa fan base as being one and the same thing.

Kind of hard to be annoyed at a managers substitutions and reactions to a game before the game has even started.

And there were plenty of grumbles and angry shouts around me before/when he started making the subs at Wembley, mostly along the lines of "Make some **** subs" and "Why would he do that?"

[flashingqwerty]

I wanted to take a look at the numbers being passed around of the savings that need to be made.

The most common set of numbers i've seen are that

1. Wage bill needs to be reduced by 17m
2. We need to raise 23m to cover operational losses

When i first saw these numbers i was convinced this meant that a fire sale would ensue and we would lose the majority of our best players.

But having done the math i am not so sure now...

Taking loan players and players out of contract as follows:

• Johnstone - 12k pw - 624k pa
• Bunn - 17.5k pw - 910k pa
• Sarkic - 1k pw - 52k pa
• Samba - 15k pw - 780k pa
• Hutton - 30k pw - 1.56m pa
• Terry - 100k pw - 5.2m pa
• Snodgrass - 40k pw - 2.08m pa
• Onomah - 30k pw - 1.56m pa
• Agbonlahor - 55k pw - 2.86m pa
• Grabban - 29k pw - 1.508m pa

That adds up to a saving of 17.134m so wages taken care of.

Raising 23m might be a little trickier - we may find that we have to sell Jack if we want to improve other areas of the team.

But without those players its glaringly obvious that we need:

• At least 1 GK if Gollini is still set on leaving
• At least 1 CB, probably 2
• At least 1 wide player, possibly 2
• A replacement for Jack, should we sell him

So, not as much needed as first thought.  But to achieve it, would likely mean selling some others and replacing them with players with smaller wage demands.

I still dont want SB to be the man to do it personally, but its much less of a shift than i expected, so i could understand why some might want to give him another shot

[DJ_Villain]

3 minutes ago, flashingqwerty said:

I wanted to take a look at the numbers being passed around of the savings that need to be made.

The most common set of numbers i've seen are that

1. Wage bill needs to be reduced by 17m
2. We need to raise 23m to cover operational losses

When i first saw these numbers i was convinced this meant that a fire sale would ensue and we would lose the majority of our best players.

But having done the math i am not so sure now...

Taking loan players and players out of contract as follows:

• Johnstone - 12k pw - 624k pa
• Bunn - 17.5k pw - 910k pa
• Sarkic - 1k pw - 52k pa
• Samba - 15k pw - 780k pa
• Hutton - 30k pw - 1.56m pa
• Terry - 100k pw - 5.2m pa
• Snodgrass - 40k pw - 2.08m pa
• Onomah - 30k pw - 1.56m pa
• Agbonlahor - 55k pw - 2.86m pa
• Grabban - 29k pw - 1.508m pa

That adds up to a saving of 17.134m so wages taken care of.

Raising 23m might be a little trickier - we may find that we have to sell Jack if we want to improve other areas of the team.

But without those players its glaringly obvious that we need:

• At least 1 GK if Gollini is still set on leaving
• At least 1 CB, probably 2
• At least 1 wide player, possibly 2
• A replacement for Jack, should we sell him

So, not as much needed as first thought.  But to achieve it, would likely mean selling some others and replacing them with players with smaller wage demands.

I still dont want SB to be the man to do it personally, but its much less of a shift than i expected, so i could understand why some might want to give him another shot

Isnt Richards still on our books too? His contract has got to be up soon hasnt it?

[MessiWillSignForVilla]

4 minutes ago, flashingqwerty said:

• Terry - 100k pw - 5.2m pa

1

There's no way Terry is on £100k pw, most reports suggest it's closer to £50k-60k pw.

[flashingqwerty]

3 minutes ago, DJ_Villain said:

Isnt Richards still on our books too? His contract has got to be up soon hasnt it?

unfortunately he still has another year to run

[flashingqwerty]

2 minutes ago, MessiWillSignForVilla said:

There's no way Terry is on £100k pw, most reports suggest it's closer to £50k-60k pw.

numbers came from Football Manager so whilst not 100% they arent usually far from the mark.

plus we know SHA offered him 100k pw as he has said so himself.  so whilst it may not be 100k it certainly would not be half that

[MessiWillSignForVilla]

7 minutes ago, flashingqwerty said:

numbers came from Football Manager so whilst not 100% they arent usually far from the mark.

plus we know SHA offered him 100k pw as he has said so himself.  so whilst it may not be 100k it certainly would not be half that

Which version of FM? On the latest update, Terry is on £60k pw at Villa.

[daggy_333]

24 minutes ago, flashingqwerty said:

I wanted to take a look at the numbers being passed around of the savings that need to be made.

The most common set of numbers i've seen are that

1. Wage bill needs to be reduced by 17m
2. We need to raise 23m to cover operational losses

When i first saw these numbers i was convinced this meant that a fire sale would ensue and we would lose the majority of our best players.

But having done the math i am not so sure now...

Taking loan players and players out of contract as follows:

• Johnstone - 12k pw - 624k pa
• Bunn - 17.5k pw - 910k pa
• Sarkic - 1k pw - 52k pa
• Samba - 15k pw - 780k pa
• Hutton - 30k pw - 1.56m pa
• Terry - 100k pw - 5.2m pa
• Snodgrass - 40k pw - 2.08m pa
• Onomah - 30k pw - 1.56m pa
• Agbonlahor - 55k pw - 2.86m pa
• Grabban - 29k pw - 1.508m pa

That adds up to a saving of 17.134m so wages taken care of.

Raising 23m might be a little trickier - we may find that we have to sell Jack if we want to improve other areas of the team.

But without those players its glaringly obvious that we need:

• At least 1 GK if Gollini is still set on leaving
• At least 1 CB, probably 2
• At least 1 wide player, possibly 2
• A replacement for Jack, should we sell him

So, not as much needed as first thought.  But to achieve it, would likely mean selling some others and replacing them with players with smaller wage demands.

I still dont want SB to be the man to do it personally, but its much less of a shift than i expected, so i could understand why some might want to give him another shot

Gabby Isn't on £55k a week. He and most other players had a large wage drop when we got relegated.

[HeyAnty]

2 hours ago, bannedfromHandV said:

Funny that, didn't hear too much of it from the 38,000 at Wembley pre-game.

I think people often mistake VT and the actual villa fan base as being one and the same thing.

So you saying if you comment on VT regards Bruce not having a tactical notion you are not a proper villa fan and ones who arent on here are the real fans.  I know alot of lot of fans not on VT and they have the same sentiment as i do.

Ive supported villa for 39 years so you can do one!

[hippo]

Bruce is as much in the dark as the rest of us

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2018/06/04/steve-bruces-aston-villa-future-uncertain-against-backdrop-financial/

"The failure to communicate with Bruce since Villa were narrowly beaten by Fulham over a fortnight ago is a sign of the confusion at Villa Park, with reports even claiming that owner Tony Xia is willing to sell up if he can find a buyer.

That has not been confirmed by anyone at the club, but Bruce is stuck in limbo and wants to address the matter urgently with the Villa hierarchy, even though he is supposed to be on holiday."

 

I think he is goner myself. 

 

[MikeAVFC]

Telegraph Football‏Verified account @TeleFootball

FollowingFollowing @TeleFootball

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Exclusive: Steve Bruce's Aston Villa future uncertain against backdrop of financial strife. @LukeEdwardsTele reports

https://t.co/pTXAR8aNdv

Edited June 4, 2018 by MikeAVFC

[Eastie]

8 minutes ago, hippo said:

Bruce is as much in the dark as the rest of us

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2018/06/04/steve-bruces-aston-villa-future-uncertain-against-backdrop-financial/

"The failure to communicate with Bruce since Villa were narrowly beaten by Fulham over a fortnight ago is a sign of the confusion at Villa Park, with reports even claiming that owner Tony Xia is willing to sell up if he can find a buyer.

That has not been confirmed by anyone at the club, but Bruce is stuck in limbo and wants to address the matter urgently with the Villa hierarchy, even though he is supposed to be on holiday."

 

I think he is goner myself. 

 

And while all this uncertainty goes on potential players are moving to other clubs - both huth and Hernandez are available on frees as was Dawson - wyness does what he always does and hides from social media after a defeat yet is quick to gloat as soon as we win .

wouldnt surprise me at all if Bruce doesn’t know what’s going on - where other clubs prepare for the new season we are left floundering with nobody seeming to know what’s going on apart from major changes that xia alludes to . 

 

Edited June 4, 2018 by Eastie

[hippo]

2 minutes ago, Eastie said:

And while all this uncertainty goes on potential players are moving to other clubs - both huth and Hernandez are available on frees as was Dawson - wyness does what he always does and hides from social media after a defeat yet is quick to gloat as soon as we win .

wouldnt surprise me at all if Bruce doesn’t know what’s going on - where other clubs prepare for the new season we are left floundering with nobody seeming to know what’s going on apart from major changes that xia alludes to . 

 

I don't Xia grasps that we finished the season late - and the transfer window closes earlier. I would bet that Wyness is on holiday too. Like I said yesterday Xia wouldn't see a problem with dropping a new manager in a few days before the season starts IMO. 

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

5 hours ago, bannedfromHandV said:

Funny that, didn't hear too much of it from the 38,000 at Wembley pre-game.

I think people often mistake VT and the actual villa fan base as being one and the same thing.

Although I'm not a Bruce fan I've got to agree with you on this.

Seems we are very much the loud minority to be fair.

EDIT: Does that make us wrong though? You only have to look at some of the polls over the years to see what nonsense the "majority" are capable of coming up with 

I'd even go as far as arguing the the average fan is casual at best, and the likes of us on Forums are more hardcore.

I've met many a Villa "fan" who barely knows what's going on here aside from "we need stability".

Edited June 4, 2018 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[NoelVilla]

Setting everything up for Bruce to resign or leaving with mutual consent. Hope it happens soon if it's the case. 

[Demitri_C]

They need to hurry up and  back or sack him. If they intend to sack him they need to stop letting this drag on.

I think he is staying personally 

[Vive_La_Villa]

6 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

They need to hurry up and  back or sack him. If they intend to sack him they need to stop letting this drag on.

I think he is staying personally 

Let what drag on? Have I missed something?